These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Has suicide ganking become a problem? Empty freighters being ganked.

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Carmen Electra
AlcoDOTTE
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#461 - 2014-06-18 17:22:45 UTC
Winchester Steele wrote:
Tippia wrote:
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:
Yea I am sure getting banned on a free disposable account really stops them from from biomassing.
No, but getting all their other accounts banned alongside it does. Recycled gank alts is a myth. They don't happen because a) they're not worth it, b) they're pretty much useless, and c) they're 100% unnecessary, and would still be even if they had some minute use.

Quote:
The price needs to be in line with the target and its not.
No. The price must not be in line with anything. If it is, the game is fundamentally and irreparably broken in every way. Price is a product, not a factor. Someone flying a multi-billion ISK freighter that took several months to train should know better than to get ganked by a few toons that have been around for years doing the same thing, and which are trivially found and traced using killboards and in-game alerts.

If they don't, then that's because the freighter pilot in question was an idiot who deserved it. His ship and training are not even relevant at that point.



I love my gank alt. I would never biomass him. Besides, surgical strike 5 was such a pain in the ass, who wants to do that again?


I have SS V on my gank alts too! We can be SS V buddies.

Bacon makes us stronger
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#462 - 2014-06-18 17:27:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaarous Aldurald
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
Auron Black wrote:

Remember you force your game play on us, not the other way around, there is plenty of space for you to play in where you don't need to worry about facpo or concord or sec standing.



The ability to contradict yourself like that, in the same sentence, is amazing. Gold star!

Stop trying to force me to go to lowsec. I want to blow up miners in highsec. Thank you.


I couldn't have put it better myself. He outright admits that he wants to shove us into a corner where they don't have to worry about us anymore.

Trammel.

Which means "hindrance, handcuffs, to strip away freedom".

Appalling.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#463 - 2014-06-18 17:29:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Auron Black wrote:

I love the absolute nonsense you spout in your posts, it is actually quite funny.
You're the one who is spewing forth nonsense, myopic nonsense.

Quote:
Carebears couldn't care less about low sec pvp, fw or other. It is the end goal of "all" gankers to lock out other people's gameplay, turn the game into trammel.
They should do, everything in Eve is linked. The things they profess to not care about are also the things that create a demand for the stuff people loot from missions, the stuff they mine and manufacture etc. Highsec is a small part of a greater ecosystem.

Quote:
Remember you force your game play on us, not the other way around, there is plenty of space for you to play in where you don't need to worry about facpo or concord or sec standing.

Implied Consent:
n. consent when surrounding circumstances exist which would lead a reasonable person to believe that this consent had been given, although no direct, express or explicit words of agreement had been uttered.

When you log in to a PvP game, it is implied that you consent to PvP. If you don't want to engage in PvP, which in Eve isn't restricted to pew pew, then you shouldn't be logging in to a PvP game Shocked

If highsec was meant to be a safe or PvP free zone, then CCP would have implemented it as such, the fact that they didn't says something important about the nature of both highsec, and the game. Something that some people appear to have trouble comprehending Roll

TL;DR You're woefully ignorant about the game you're playing, and they're not forcing anything upon others. When you log in you consent to PvP, in all of its myriad forms.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Tilly Delnero
Doomheim
#464 - 2014-06-18 17:35:35 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:

"handcuffs, to strip away".

I like the sound of this Trammel of which you speak. Twisted
Winchester Steele
#465 - 2014-06-18 17:38:31 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
How about the dev's fly freighters for a month. Then we will see if they actually understand.


Given that out of millions of trips made by freighters every month only a few dosen die I would say they will have a rather univentful time.



This is a very good point. Go look at Red Frog's queue on their website. They make thousands of trips every month. I would wager they lose less than 2% of those trips to ganks. This "problem" occurs so infrequently that I don't even know why we are discussing it. (Actually I do: crybears gonna cry.)

To be honest, I think ganking could use some buffs (longer Concord response time, bring back the boomerang, etc) before it becomes another extinct profession like can-flipping.

...

Iain Cariaba
#466 - 2014-06-18 17:46:56 UTC
Ganking doesn't need nerfed, the ganked just need to realize there are already steps in game to make to reduce your juicyness as a target. Spend 2 minutes searching through these forums and you'll find all the answers you need.

@CCP: Isn't 24 pages well past time to lock a thread that's already been rehashed over and over again a hundred time thus month alone?
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#467 - 2014-06-18 17:52:33 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
But hey, since this is such a commonly done, "all the gankers are doing it" kinda thing, care to point me at a list of these biomassed cycle alts? I mean, if it's that common, link me some chars with the following characteristics:

1. Doomheim corp (that's the corp of biomassed chars)
2. Less than 3 months old.
3. Negative sec status.
4. Previous member of a known ganking corp.
5. Some connection between the accounts.
6. Currently active gank character.

I mean, if this happens as often as carebear folks claim it does, there should be ample examples of the above, right?


OMG.. You are asking for proof?!?!?! Why cant you simply take highsec's word for it?!?!! Why must everything be backed up with some sort of factual evidence to support ones claims?!?!?!

Inconceivable!

Friendship over!

*slams door

Im not really ending friendships, im just really into slamming doors today, and it seems kinda empty without emotional content.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#468 - 2014-06-18 17:57:13 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
But hey, since this is such a commonly done, "all the gankers are doing it" kinda thing, care to point me at a list of these biomassed cycle alts? I mean, if it's that common, link me some chars with the following characteristics:

1. Doomheim corp (that's the corp of biomassed chars)
2. Less than 3 months old.
3. Negative sec status.
4. Previous member of a known ganking corp.
5. Some connection between the accounts.
6. Currently active gank character.

I mean, if this happens as often as carebear folks claim it does, there should be ample examples of the above, right?


OMG.. You are asking for proof?!?!?! Why cant you simply take highsec's word for it?!?!! Why must everything be backed up with some sort of factual evidence to support ones claims?!?!?!

Inconceivable!

Friendship over!

*slams door

Im not really ending friendships, im just really into slamming doors today, and it seems kinda empty without emotional content.

Proof is overrated, and your door appears to OP.

Nerf proof and UAE's door.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#469 - 2014-06-18 18:02:44 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
Bagrat Skalski wrote:
Quote:
It's stupid that concord would allow this to happen.


Actually, CONCORD would not allow this. They would forbid capsuleers with less than -5 security status to use gates that lead to high sec, same as gates that are located there, and same as clone jumping to a station in high sec. They could still go thru wormholes to a systems in High sec.

Please tell me you don't actually believe this is a good idea.

His idea is pretty much a big FU to anybody who does faction warfare or lowsec PvP. It locks them out the market hubs and highsec in general. They can get round it using alts but they shouldn't have to unless they want to.

It would be ironic if such a change forced a decentralization of trade hubs forcing more trade to move out to low sec.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#470 - 2014-06-18 18:09:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
It would be ironic if such a change forced a decentralization of trade hubs forcing more trade to move out to low sec.
If that happened I would be deploying an Expanded Super Capital Tear Collection Array on the forums, and emptying it every server tick.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Rager Zed
Zeta Reticuli Blackpill Alliance
Absolute Glory
#471 - 2014-06-18 18:09:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Rager Zed
This is day four for me in this game, and I might not have a say on the matter, but like all people I will voice my two cents.


This is coming from a guy, who is just going to focus heavy on trade skills, because I find the combat very dull to me. I don't like it, and I might starting doing it with drones...but ya if I keep paying monthly. I won't be doing it because of the combat.



With that being said, I don't mind people killing me, and even if I am empty and they get nothing for it. That is fine, because hey this is what seems to makes me want to play eve. Things can happen.



With that being said, Lots of things I don't agree with, but understand about the nature of this game. My friends who play this wants to give me all this money and ships, but i refuse. I won't even accept help from them. I'm making eve into my own personal world, where i'm a simple man..and won't ask for help (unless it is things I don't understand about the game).


Now, I might not understand all that is going on, but if people are camping in a station and able to use alt accounts to scout, undock with main kill dock and being protected while they search for targets. I have mix feelings about that, but what can really be done? Muti accounts thing is encourage it seems and no way to really change it i don't think like it or not. but at the same time people said that it could be avoided..and ask for help. (I don't really like the thought of going through a game and being 100 percent depending on others to the point that you can't get enjoyment doing your thing with out some one up your butt.) *Shrugs* I'm just going by the info of what most of you guys post.
Kijo Rikki
Killboard Padding Services
#472 - 2014-06-18 18:09:52 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:

Im not really ending friendships, im just really into slamming doors today, and it seems kinda empty without emotional content.



*SLAM* F U WIND!!! WE DIDN'T WANT YOU IN HERE ANYWAY

You make a valid point, good Sir or Madam. 
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#473 - 2014-06-18 18:15:28 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie wrote:
It would be ironic if such a change forced a decentralization of trade hubs forcing more trade to move out to low sec.
If that happened I would be deploying an Expanded Super Capital Tear Collection Array on the forums, and emptying it every server tick.

Hm, maybe we should replace pod goo with tears. I'm sure the proper saline content is good for the body.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Lysenko Alland
Ubiquitous Hurt
The WeHurt Initiative
#474 - 2014-06-18 19:48:02 UTC
Rager Zed wrote:
This is day four for me in this game, and I might not have a say on the matter, but like all people I will voice my two cents.

This is coming from a guy, who is just going to focus heavy on trade skills, because I find the combat very dull to me. I don't like it, and I might starting doing it with drones...but ya if I keep paying monthly. I won't be doing it because of the combat.


Don't mistake the combat experience in missions with what combat is like against other players. The two are TOTALLY different experiences in EVE.

(In many fights against other players, seemingly small choices regarding movement and module activation can have a large impact on the outcome, unlike against NPCs. This is for two reasons: First, the NPC AI is not very smart, and second, there's a huge power differential between a player and an NPC, while two players are much more likely to be closely matched.)
Capt Starfox
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#475 - 2014-06-18 20:23:47 UTC
Rager Zed wrote:

Now, I might not understand all that is going on, but if people are camping in a station and able to use alt accounts to scout, undock with main kill dock and being protected while they search for targets. I have mix feelings about that, but what can really be done? Muti accounts thing is encourage it seems and no way to really change it i don't think like it or not. but at the same time people said that it could be avoided..and ask for help. (I don't really like the thought of going through a game and being 100 percent depending on others to the point that you can't get enjoyment doing your thing with out some one up your butt.) *Shrugs* I'm just going by the info of what most of you guys post.


Create an insta-undock and you'll be fine from being camped in a station. You should do this with any and every station you visit often. And, while you're at it you might as well create an insta-dock too.

Other than that it's okay to ask questions, but try to do the research yourself first. There's nothing wrong with being new and/or not understanding a certain game mechanic. It's funny how often I learn something new in this game.

And, what Lysenko wrote about the difference between PvE combat and PvP combat. Although, I would add that PvP is very fun whereas PvE isn't and is typically used as a means to an end. That end is usually PvP.

Abandon all hope ye who x up in fleet
Lunarisse Aspenstar
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#476 - 2014-06-18 20:33:40 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
Seems like this is one of those situations where a perceived problem is in actuality an opportunity. If haulers were to start employing escorts to help protect their hindquarters not only would it increase their odds of arriving intact, but it would also give other players something to do as well.

It may not be the most exciting task out there, but if the ISK is right I'm sure there are young pilots out there who would happily ride shotgun with freighters in griffins or the like, helping web them into warp and jamming attempted ganks.
I can't see the cost of such services being so prohibitive as for it to cut too deeply into a freighter pilot's bottom line, so the real problem must lie elsewhere...


Honestly when I first started playing Eve, I expected players would be doing escorts for haulings or convoys. Much to surprise I found out hauling seems to be a solo endeavour even when the cost of defense versus hauling fees might warrant it. Not a bad idea.
Molang
MyXGamer
#477 - 2014-06-18 20:53:15 UTC
I hardly ever post on the forums but I decided to on this one.

There is one great reason to blow up empty freighters.

As a manufacturer I saw my profits almost double during events like burn Jita. When ships blow up empty or not the manufactures stand to profit. End of story, welcome to EVE.

If you feel that ganking a freighter with a full cargo is justified because of the monetary gain then you also have to justify ganking freighters for the temporary profit margin increase in the region.

Feel free to ridicule me.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#478 - 2014-06-18 20:55:19 UTC
DJentropy Ovaert wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
How about the dev's fly freighters for a month. Then we will see if they actually understand.


How much you want to bet that as a Dev they will actually be at the keyboard and working with a advanced scout and perhaps even a webbing friend to help keep them safe?

I'd bet that as a Dev who understands the social nature of Eve Online, the chance is very high.

Insist on flying hulls worth nearly 1.5 billion *and* often add tons of juicy loot on top, set that auto and go on the trip totally alone without even paying attention to anything around you, without bothering to check the map to make sure your route does not take you right through a freaking war zone ..... the player in questions gets what he deserves and hopefully will learn to not make the same mistake again.

Most of the tears that I see seem to come from freighters assuming that fitting triple bulkheads = a free pass to disregard sanity, go totally AFK, and just assume that a hour or two later they will arrive at their destination alive and turn a profit.

EVE already gives us some great ways to make money while AFK, it's called PI and Market Trading. If a players plan for making cash involves being in space and AFK - it is nothing but my pleasure to help educate them on the folly of their ways.

(Edit: Corrected a simple grammar error)


I didn't say they shouldn't use alts to scout/protect. Absolutely - they should drag a fellow dev or corp mate, hell bring the corp!, into fleet with them. Go for it! Try it. Let them get a feel for the numbers they are so happy to pull out of their ass. But they have to do it for a month, every day.


Grimpak
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#479 - 2014-06-18 20:58:03 UTC
Molang wrote:
Feel free to ridicule me.



/me ridicules Molang

there.

[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]

[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
Helia Tranquilis
Confused Bunnies Inc
#480 - 2014-06-18 21:05:13 UTC
Todays meta in flying freighters in highsec

1. Even empty freighter must have maximum tank, tech 3 links and several logi alts
2. Webber alt and scout or you die, spares when they get trashe[re]d
3. ISBox fleet of catalysts on standby to counter gank the bumping machariel(s)
4. Another fleet of Falcons to break through odd 100 magnetometric strength of ECCM'd gallente face-huggers

Or have friends that are willing to break their ratting and come escort your boat during your market adventures. We can all see that one happening.


Besides, last expansion stated: "The empires are losing control"

The art involved in ganking has made concord largely irrelevant. Sooner you accept that, the sooner you realize the only accepted form of making isk is in FW.