Upcoming Feature and Change Feedback Center

Perhaps I didn't get my point communicated well. Your goal is not to engage the whole fleet, your goal is to separate one from the group. Yes, a hictor will die terribly to 50 supers, but your goal is to catch the last one before it activates the gate, and kill it before the fleet can get back to the gate to rescue it.

Who will he refit off of? Your goal is to separate him from his friends. Try to get a point on the guy that's slowest to align/last to take the gate. If you aren't successful, warp away, try again at the next gate.

Re the other post, I'll go find it and respond to it.

Another alternative: Make sure everyone is aligned down the gate and hit warp at the same time. If done properly, that only leaves 1-2 seconds where stragglers aren't in warp, which is not nearly enough time for a HIC to decloak and grab one.

Okay, so your suggestion is the attacker gets to drop 100+ bombers/blops BS/whatever on the carrier/fax instead of the super/titan with the trap? So the attacker only gets to kill a 1b isk ship with every site?

Except you blew your load and didn't kill a super or a titan. Go ahead and try again. I know you are there now I will keep track of you. A billion isk is what? The cumulative payout of 1-2 sites? That's trivial. Ignorable. "Everyone send your last payout to X." Problem solved. While you are trying to reset I will keep running sites. My cumulative income will outweigh your killing ability.

This is the post I wanted you to reply to. Try and focus on your claims that burning long ranges will makes this less profitable vs. my proof that supers and titans won't have to burn at all and your claims that titan's can't hit frigate and cruiser NPCs vs. proof that they can with ease.

Incursion rats have a much lower sig then normal rats, so they tend to act a bit differently then standard rats. Can you give me the Avatar's gun resolution/tracking/optimal/falloff/dps of those guns so I can do a more detailed comparison?

The optimal range image you linked me doesn't show it's tracking. I'm sure you can push out that far you stack optimal, but what does that to to your tracking (But it's at least pulse, so there's a chance to get that working). That's only 4500 dps. That is 4x the DPS of a normal incursion Nightmare. It's less then 2x of a incursion Vindicator. And doesn't provide long-range webs. Yes it's better, but not game-breakingly so. It's also 50x more expensive.

I think you missed my point of getting one guy separated from the group. Do you not think it's possible to get one guy separated from the group, or do you think it's not possible to kill them once they are separated before help arrives? Try getting 60 people to not jump through a gate, then get them to all jump through the gate all within the same tick. You'll see how hard it is. You only need (or want) one straggler to get caught in your trap.

The sites are already getting completed in a matter of minutes, this is something I think you're missing. Good groups can do a TCRC in under 8 minutes, payout-to-payout, which is the time from completing a site, to completing the next site, and all the travel involved in it. There's enough traveling involved to prevent things from becoming terribly overpowered. Some of these sites are doable in 480 seconds. Time efficiency is already important. Every 40 seconds added to the site time is a ~11% loss in isk/hr. Aligning down the gate and taking the gate alone accounts for ~30 seconds. Warping to the next site adds in another ~60s. That gives you ~390 seconds in site. Yes, bringing a titan in will be faster. But your guns still have to cycle, you still have to lock targets. You can only Blap the site so hard. Even with 60 Titans doing a TCRC, assuming they apply 100% damage to the target... they'll take the 8 minute site to about 6. (the MTAC still has to burn to the MTAC factory before you can apply DPS, we've had 4 fleets contesting a TCRC, and still didn't put a dent into it). So with a fleet 50x more expensive then what they use in hisec, you can make about 30% more isk/hr.

PS: I also can't wait for 60 titans being in one incursion to be the start of the next B-R.

I do agree it'll be safer in lowsec, but there's a lot more neuts running around in lowsec as well. More people to track your patterns, and it's less unusual for there to be a neut in local. More chances that neut is ready to attack you.

I don't see PL and Goons cooperating on anything right now. But if that happens, go run the mothership in something like cruisers or T3s. That will cause the incursion to despawn and shut down the incursion, cutting off their money making.

If you compare it to the hisec incursion faucet, it'd still be next to nothing. Hisec incursions are run non-stop 23/7, by 100+ pilots at once. When you get the lucky drop in your backyard, why not let the people take a bit of money out of it.

And even if you figure some way of totally OP through the incursions that I don't know of, and do them twice as fast as hisec, so what? It's pilots, undocked in low/null, ready to be shot. If you don't want to shoot them, fine, that's your choice, but at least they don't have concord there to rescue them. That still provides a decent balance.

You are god damn right, The moment they implement this I'll be packing my stuff and head to nullsec LOL.

Anyway who ever think this will make you print isk faster is out of his mind, we are rolling TCRC in hisec in less than 10 mins and in ships costs more than fitted carrier so I don't know what you all talking about, Have you ever saw titan or super aligning and warping from site to site before ( usually incursion sites are 30+ AU away from the sun ) ? I could go make myself a sandwich and come back and my capital still didn't finished warping. Therefore wasted time between aligning/warping and clearing sites are balanced, I'm sure it will be more lucrative than it is right now but not by far ridiculous amount.

I like the idea and it wouldn't really be overpowered at all using capitals.

Highsec incursion fleets routinely blitz the Vanguard sites in 5-10 minutes, and a capital fleet running the sites is hard limited by their 5 minute siege/triage cycles which seems pretty fair by comparison.

My only reservation is that if people commit capitals to an incursion site for the 'easy' ISK they should be stuck there until the site is completed, perhaps by a structure in the site that infinite-points any caps/supers on grid until after the payout trigger.

I'm sure you can make more ISK/LP doing incursion in capitals for TCRC and NRF but as for TPPH it is gonna be pain as hell for first 2 rooms.