Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Every small gang should have a combat prober with them. If you don't, you are simply unprepared. It is the number one weakness for most roaming gangs. Every home defense gang should have them readily available.

I cannot count the number of times I have watched every other ratter in my system dock up or POS up when the first hostile comes into local, while I happily run even the crappiest complex, knowing that unless they scanned it down hours beforehand, when I wasn't around, they cannot find me unless they drop probes.

Or, assume I am the sort of person who likes to have off-grid links (I am). You can take that huge bonus away from me by dropping combat probes. But most people won't. And that character will happily boost me and all my friends without any fear whatsoever. Because when you formed your gang, you decided that one more DPS ship or one more tackler was more important than a decent combat prober.

The choice is yours… be effective, or suck.

Wormhole guy here.

Wonderfull changes.

Im looking forward to finally fly Recons as I love to scout and hunt and mainly support.
Perhaps carebears and small corps will leave WH as they will find hard to live in that harsh environment. Good.
If they are still looking for a place to live and own - Null Sec still looks pretty empty in some parts. Enough space for everyone.
Wormhole is about teamwork, so organised corporations will adapt to changes very easly with no tears, but happy face.

Sorry for FW, but again, find new tactics and solutions. Perhaps group together, form a gang and face the enemy. Simple as that.


Fly safe, recons are out there... ;)

Being a low-class wormholer myself, this dscan immunity is a dream came true to me. Every time I run an anomaly I wish there would be some way to hide what I'm doing, and this is it! HAC-class tank should allow running low-class WH anomalies a breeze. Because no hunter ever going through anoms just to see if there's someone there - they all use dscan.
THIS is why dscan immunity is grossly OP. It allows pilot to _do things_ while being offgrid-cloaked.

Working as intended.

If he wanted to fight you without his Falcon alts, he would. If you really wanted to kill him, you'd bring the right counter.

Sun Tzu says you should know your enemy. So we see a hostile and look up his killboard stats. Then people know when they see FT Diomedes in local, that he probably isn't much of a threat unless you are a POS or sovereignty structure. They know that he lost a Scimitar the other day, but hasn't been seen in a sub capital ship since then. They know that several months ago he lost a nicely-fit ratting Ishtar to a roaming gang. They see that he is normally active in USTZ and prefers to fly with certain other pilots. They plan accordingly. The really savvy ones will examine his corp history, forum posting history, and see what else they can learn before they even engage.

If you are afraid of the other guy's Falcon or Scimitar or OGB and he is afraid to fight without it, the only way either of you will get a fight is non-consensually.

Last time I checked, Eve was all about non-consensual PVP. Outside of tournaments and pre-arranged duels the only consensual PVP in Eve is when the other side doesn't recognize "It's a trap!" until it is too late. We have to use operational maneuver and misdirection to gain surprise. What a horrible thought!

First rule of combat is: don't let the enemy dictate the terms of the fight. The fair fight is the one you walk away from. If you refuse to bring the counter to my fleet composition, that is your problem, not mine. If you don't want to fight my fleet composition, then I have to find a way to trick you into it, or make you do it against your will. That is the essence of combat as I understand it - finding a way to impose your will on your adversary. Not everyone will have that attitude. And that's fine too, in this lovely game called Eve.

So thoughtful <3

I always thought rook needed more PG too, think it can only fit a single LSE (though it can fit 1 invuln/em w/ single LSE). I think curse should stay shield tanked, or gimped armor tank. Its got a very strong ewar bonus, tank should be at a disadvantage.

think i'm ok with rapier slot layout currently 4/6/4. Debating on your proposed change on huginn.. would have more tank, but would it have the grid for it, even with the PG addition. Sad thing is, even with an extra 100 PG, 4 720's would still use up all the grid for the most part.

4 720's = 892 PG, even with +100 grid, you'd only have 40ish PG left over for MWD/tank/EWAR with max skills. So.. guess its another minny ship with 650's or 3 PG mods for arty to fit...

I still don't get why the Curse has 6 mids and 4 lows. It's Amarr and Khanid, it should have the same 5 mid/5 low arrangement as the pilgrim, because you know, armour.

Wormhole dweller. These changes are glorious!

Irrelevant. You do not need 1 billion kills to your your brian and make a logical annalisis . As was poitned several times. With exception of FW plexes this exact behavior can be mimmicked by thigns like Stratios and a pilto with brains to disengage the cloak some 100 thousand KM before landing.

And the d-scan immunity is still FAR less powerful than a cloak ship well piloted.

And yet the huge issues people predict do not happen.

To emualte the same thing in FW the stratios /rapier/arazu etc pilot would have to keep its dscan at a range shorter than the range to the accell gate by a tiny bit... then uncloak as soon as someone starts to cross. That is something that will be made easier with eh new d-scan immunity.

But GOOOD pilots, really good pilots capable of using their brain, not peopel that think they are good pilots because they spend 10 hours per day playing, already can achieve basically the same effect with any cloak warper.

YET.. the number of stratios and alike ruining small scale pvp is what? Almost non existent.

As a high sec ganker you clearly dont understand the issues here. I dont recal anyone that is complaining about these changes complaining about the strateos. In fact i dont remember anyone at all that i know complaining about it at any point.

So bad strawman is bad.

In all scenarios that i fight in, a ship immune to dscan is very much worse than a cloaky ship, and even though i dont live in wormholes, my limited understanding of them is that dscan immunity will be more powerful there than it will be where i am in FW.

Arbitrary mechanics to make up for people who are terrible at eve and cant hide their fleet/bait a fight are a very bad move and encourage an undesirable meta that will be to some degree compulsory for all.

As you correctly said, there are mechanics that already allow people to emulate this effectwith less powerful force recons, so encouraging this type of activity my taking the skill out of it and giving people ships close to ahac performace to do it with is demented.

TBH im less concerned with plex campers than i am small roaming gangs of recons that warp into plexes with zero warning and create a 180km killzone.

At least with the current force recons the player has a chance to spy the recon entering systems and plexes, hence a possible counter before a pointless gank.

I personally would be more supportive of this idea of it weren't only combat recons getting this UI sorcery. Having a single class of ship which follows different rules from every other ship in the game seems like poor design (I thought everything was supposed to be intuitive now?), but if dscan immunity was more generally a thing, I guess I couldn't really argue with that.