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New industry skills discussion (connected to Advanced Industry)

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wicked cheese
Doomheim
#181 - 2014-09-02 01:18:04 UTC
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
Just some quick (and possibly terrible) ideas off the top of my head.

Advanced Science: 2% reduced copy time per level, requires Science V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.

Advanced Research: 2% reduced TE research time per level, requires Research V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.

Advanced Metallurgy: 2% reduced ME research time per level, requires Metallurgy V and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.

Industrial Process Management: 1% reduction in manufacturing job install costs per level, requires Advanced Mass Production V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, mem/cha.

Scientific Process Management: 1% reduction in research job install costs per level, requires Advanced Laboratory Operation V and Advanced Industry V, rank 9, int/cha.

Group Dynamics: 2% bonus to team effects per level, requires Social V and Advanced Industry V, rank 6, cha/int.

Edit:

Tinkering: 3% reduced invention job time per level, requires Science V, Jury Rigging V, and Advanced Industry V, rank 5, int/mem.


everything this man said!
Lonewolf174
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#182 - 2014-09-03 00:56:26 UTC
Employee Influence: TE reduction on jobs installed in a station (or maybe space too) that are owned by allaince/corp the character is a member of. (maybe a smaller bonus on stations with a hanger being rented?)
Hakan MacTrew
Konrakas Forged
Solyaris Chtonium
#183 - 2014-09-03 02:53:41 UTC
Specific skills that reduce time on given job types could work.

Not sure about having skills that reduce time only in stations/offices owned by the players corp/alliance.

How about a skill that gives a small increase to the chance of successful invention?

Friends
Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
#184 - 2014-09-03 07:48:15 UTC
I like alot of this, but I favor either an invention queue or multi-run invention jobs (kinda silly i can build 3100 of a module in a month in 1 production run but I can only invent once per queuing)

I also support having additional science slots since those slots are used by 4 types of jobs, not just one like manufacturing.

In leu of either, separate the science jobs so that we have 2 sets of science slots, 1 set for invention/copying, 1 set for ME/PE research.
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#185 - 2014-09-09 23:05:35 UTC
Mhari Dson wrote:
I like alot of this, but I favor either an invention queue or multi-run invention jobs (kinda silly i can build 3100 of a module in a month in 1 production run but I can only invent once per queuing)

I also support having additional science slots since those slots are used by 4 types of jobs, not just one like manufacturing.

In leu of either, separate the science jobs so that we have 2 sets of science slots, 1 set for invention/copying, 1 set for ME/PE research.

I agree 100%, invention slots should have their own set of 10, or share with only copy slots, not all research slots.
Magic Crisp
Amarrian Micro Devices
#186 - 2014-09-10 07:56:34 UTC
What about giving those outpost construction, capital construction, Advanced *shop construction skills a slight time reduction bonus? So even when one is to build something that has a low skill requirement on these, training said skills higher still has a benefit.
Indigo Love-Jones
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#187 - 2014-09-10 16:17:00 UTC
Hi,

I know this topic is about Advance Industry but I would like to talk about the changes that have been made regarding industry.

Before the patch Production Efficiency was the most crucial skill to have if you want to build anything within Eve. Which was trained by anyone wanting to produce anything. This skill I am presuming has been changed to Advance Industry and has it's attribute changed to manufacturing time per skill level.

Research, Metallurgy was all about reducing the material needed and time needed to do research. Now since the patch this skills have been changed to material efficiency research speed per skill level and manufacturing time research per skills level. This is a major change to the original skill.

Initially players would specialised a character to perform blueprint copying only which will only need the skill Laboratory Operation and Advance Laboratory Operation.

Also players would dedicate a character for pure research which they would need Research, Metallurgy but not Production Efficiency due to the fact that character would not need to build anything but just do research on blueprints.

Now since the change, this has caused the specialised character for blueprint only certain problems. They have found out that they can no longer copy the blueprints they used to be able to copy due to the fact that the skill Research and Metallurgy is now needed to use that blueprint they used to make copy of.

Also for the specialised characters for Research only to find out that they will now need to train the Advance Industry skill in order for them to be efficient at research. Without the Advance Industry skill their research time is drastically reduced.

I would like to ask you developers what went on in your heads to make such a drastic change to Industry forcing everyone to train all form production and research skill?

Regards, Indigo Love-Jones
Kelsi Monroe
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#188 - 2014-09-12 12:23:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Kelsi Monroe
Please don´t add time reduction skills off any kind. Last thing industry/market needs is more items dumped to an stagnated and oversupplied situation.
Kann Du
Embers Children
#189 - 2014-09-12 17:20:06 UTC
Interesting changes, are the proposed “Invention chance outcome” alterations also going to effect T3 subsystem invention? Specifically:

• Success (exceptional): yields a ME 2 and TE 3 bonus to the outcome.
• Success (great): yields a ME 1 and TE 2 bonus to the outcome.

If so how will a bonus to ME effect Subsystem production? At the moment a better ME has no impact on the build requirements as they can’t go lower than 1. The same way teams giving an ME bonus are also pointless.

Or is my understanding of T3 production flawed?
xenoslave xeno
Doomheim
#190 - 2014-09-14 05:43:37 UTC  |  Edited by: xenoslave xeno
im sorry I have one thing to pipe in about its far over do that there be a capital class mining barge since I started in 08 trit prices alone have gone from like 1.2-1.5 isk each to 5 or 6 isk each mainly due to the fact that mining is not fun nor as profitable as mission running for the high sec pilots or incursions or even trading but there are some who just want to either relax and mine to build ships and the like and lets face it since the ore reprocessing changes mining has become less and less profitable which is why its time for a change after all it is a player driven market like the drake just for an example when I bought my first one it costed me a hole 20 mil back then hard to get but it felt worth it no adays its over 50 mil almost triple the price because those who used to mine moved to mission running because they could make more isk faster and then buy bigger and better ships. and ice also now instead of knowing which systems have ice you have to be lucky and find it at the right time and hope the players with 10-15 alts haven't mined it already. I mean come on all you would have to do is make a t2 orca that would fit 6 strip miners I mean the design is already there for hard points hell you could even make it a kind of siege mode to make things interesting
Maxis Lithium
New Canada
#191 - 2014-09-15 16:41:36 UTC
Not an experienced eve player, but I'm pleased with Advanced Industry. As it effects all things Industry, it impacts my major bottle neck to Industry, which is ME research on BPOs
By my math, I can cut the time needed to research ME on a BPO by 40% at max (Metallurgy 5%/lv. + Advanced Industry 3%/lv.)
POS bonuses bring that further up.
I find the new Industry system fairly intuitive.
Bugsy VanHalen
Society of lost Souls
#192 - 2014-09-16 02:18:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Bugsy VanHalen
my top 5 are


  • Job installation cost reduction, like we have skills to reduce tax, and broker fees, one for the job installation cost would be nice.

  • more research time reduction skills. this will not hurt a new players ability to compete, but could make researching some BPO's from ME 9-10 possible. Some BPO's take over 1 year for this reserch. At least make it resonable, even if still cost prohibitive.

  • more slots per character. the characters skil limitation is the only limitation we now have with industry slot removal, the changes to copy and invention have been a hard hit on slot counts. I would like to see copy and invention share a set of 10 slots, independant of the 10 research slots we already have which would be left for ME and PE research.

  • POS management skill. this would be a corporate skill that would be trained by the C.E.O. to reduce POS fuel costs. and possibly two additional skills to increase POS PG and CPU.

  • clone facility management- this skill would decrease the cost of medical clones. not having it would not hurt new players as their clone costs are very low anyway. Maybe even add an advanced clone facility management skill, with the first one as a prerequisit that reduces it even more.
    • Some verteran players do not participate in small ship PVP only because their clone costs 10 times more to replace than the ship they would be flying. There is no need for this anti PVP isk sink to be so steep. besides, those with extremly high skill point characters are the ones who have the greatest need of additional useful skills to train, these skills would be a nessesity for veteran high skill point PVPers, but in no way be required or hurt newer players.
GizzyBoy
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#193 - 2014-09-17 04:20:51 UTC
A few things.


Your Idea of an exceptional success is some what terrible, an exceptional success should have a much higher ME level to reflect that Idea of exceptional, the minimum level of a successful bpc needs to have 2 me particularly in the case of ships other wise a large number of things that produced a successful bpc would not be worth producing in the competitive eve market.


Failing that, perhaps you'd like to add me and pe level research for tech 2 bpcs, sure it could be double handling from our point of view, but in a number of cases its the only way to make currently un economic bpc's viable to build from.
Komi Toran
Perkone
Caldari State
#194 - 2014-09-17 06:14:28 UTC
Sheeana Harb wrote:
Could you please elaborate more why you think having it tied to a skill is a bad idea? I'm interested.

Because it's UI, and locking UI behind artificial barriers is poor design.
Anthar Thebess
#195 - 2014-09-24 09:01:49 UTC
Remove this skill , without SP reimbursement.

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Rumbaldi
Phoenix Connection
#196 - 2014-09-30 16:09:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Rumbaldi
OK< not skills as such, I think there are enough skills and functionality needs to be cleaned up a bit.

- The more you produce of something the less time it take to build up to a max bonus.

For example you may make Void L ammo for example, for every 250,000 made you get a small percentage in the reduction of time to make up to say a max 10 or 15% time bonus. I would like to think that people that produce more of the same thing they would become specialised in that item or range of items.

- Quick create shopping lists

For example you pull up that T1 or T2 BPC to make something and Bam you are missing some of the components, to have an option (button to click) that puts the missing items and the number needed onto an ingame notepad so you can go to market and purchase those items.

- Enter more than the max number of jobs to determine purchases.

Tied in with option 2, I have say 10 T1 or T2 BPCs over the 10 BPCs I have 100 runs in total, i drag the 1st BPC onto the indy window and I am missing some items, so I will need to buy stuff for all 100 runs, therefore even though the max runs on the BPC is 10, I want to enter 100, then use the suggestion at #2 to create the shopping list.

All this exceptional, standard invention possibilities suggestions are amazingly bad I think, and should die a death before even being disucssed
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#197 - 2014-10-10 16:00:01 UTC
Adding new skill really isn't going to be that easy without adding new types of play for industry... but I will try. Add more depth to manufacturing by adding usable alloys to the game as a creatable product necessary for production of parts (you have a good start on alloy already but it's kind of useless at the moment). Add fasteners and other simple but basic building parts to production to give something necessary but easy for the noobish indie to work on. Some alloy will be harder to create due to required skill level and scarcity of materials, other alloy not so hard. Add skills to the game for this type of production. There are a lot of basic elements that can be mixed and match in different ways to make entirely new stuff. Make metallurgy and field of study with some skill required create things needed to build.

It would be nice to have some more minerals in the game.. with new skills required to mine them.. (Ideally some added type of mining would be nice too) Sometime look up the number of real mineral we actually mine in the real world.. there are more than just 20.

I grow weary of rebalance and changes to the changes you've made to the UI and graphics.. It's time to start thinking of additional play with new lines of skilling. Dark matter mining, solar mining, comet mining, ... and new commodities for each. This in turn will spawn need for new types of ships and construction (which will also require new skills).

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#198 - 2014-10-11 03:07:51 UTC
Barbara Nichole wrote:
Adding new skill really isn't going to be that easy without adding new types of play for industry... but I will try. Add more depth to manufacturing by adding usable alloys to the game as a creatable product necessary for production of parts (you have a good start on alloy already but it's kind of useless at the moment). Add fasteners and other simple but basic building parts to production to give something necessary but easy for the noobish indie to work on. Some alloy will be harder to create due to required skill level and scarcity of materials, other alloy not so hard. Add skills to the game for this type of production. There are a lot of basic elements that can be mixed and match in different ways to make entirely new stuff. Make metallurgy and field of study with some skill required create things needed to build.

It would be nice to have some more minerals in the game.. with new skills required to mine them.. (Ideally some added type of mining would be nice too) Sometime look up the number of real mineral we actually mine in the real world.. there are more than just 20.

I grow weary of rebalance and changes to the changes you've made to the UI and graphics.. It's time to start thinking of additional play with new lines of skilling. Dark matter mining, solar mining, comet mining, ... and new commodities for each. This in turn will spawn need for new types of ships and construction (which will also require new skills).

Yes, there's already something we could mine for this...

ring mining


Er, what happened to it?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Major Trant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#199 - 2014-10-16 09:26:51 UTC
Not really a skill, but would it be possible to remove the click button 'Deliver' step to a job?

You have paid for the job, supplied the mats, the factory knows were to shove the finished product and any remaining BPC/BPO, so why do you have to click a button to 'Deliver' it? Can it not be automatic?
Dyexz
Comrades in Construction
TOG - The Older Gamers Alliance
#200 - 2014-10-17 14:17:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Dyexz
I don'k know if this idea has been mentioned before and I am sure that, I am not the only one who thinks that the limit (max 11) of simultaneous jobs is a bit too small. Especially when you take into account of how many Blueprints and how long each job can take in the game. Obviously it is of your own choice, but as it is today it just seems to be inadequate to be limited to 11 jobs at max skills across 3 types Research jobs (Research, Copying and Invention). While copying is not the most time consuming type of job it does take up a lot of your available slots.

You might say, why not just create multiple alts?, well to answer that question.. I do have multiple alts for exactly that purpose in mind. Although I do not have a very large pile of Blueprints at my disposal (maybe 75-100) but that is just a small fraction of what is available in New Eden.

So, I propose a slight change of the Skills:


  • Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.
  • Advanced Laboratory Operations - Ability to run 2(+1) additional research job per skill level.


and possibly also the skill:

  • Mass Production - Ability to run 2(+1) additional manufacturing job per skill level.


edited:
In addition, it would be nice if the [Scientific Networking] skill was defined by the number of lightyears between job location and your current location. this should solve the annoyance of the skill as it currently is, let's say that you have the skill at level 4 which allows you to start jobs within 20 jumps from your location, yet the job you want to start is only 5 jumps away, but the region changes within those few jumps and it therefore becomes impossible for you to start the job.