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Dev Blog: Long-Distance Travel Changes Inbound

First post First post First post
Author
Noelle Civire
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#181 - 2014-10-01 17:43:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Noelle Civire
CCP. There's a distinct difference between listening to your player base and being a slave to them peace-mealing their ******* Mittani.com blog posts into a patch.

You take the fact that groups and people are upset and YOU form your own decisions on how the game should go. You don't rely on interested parties doing your job for you.

Have some accountability.

How about just take jump fatigue and give blackops a bonus obviating most of it? How about make a cyno have a mass limit? How about limit the distance of an "apex force" by further increasing fuel consumption and making jump fuel optimizer mods available as lowslots for all capitals? Make parties have to dump their fuel mods to refit & deal with jump fatigue & deal with multiple fleets/cynos due to mass limits. Coupled together it creates a logistic nightmare for large entities to move without hurting smaller entities.

How about you freaking measure twice and cut once? For once CCP.. measure twice and put some thought into this. I don't mean 4-6 weeks. I mean 2-3 months before you change the game. Don't experiment. Don't blame it on the blogs or the player base you used as a base line. Don't wait to see how the "meta shifts." Do the real work before you release something.

Ignoring that capitals through gates is just idiotic and will just look foolish. Might as well call them Battleships+.
Aebe Amraen
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#182 - 2014-10-01 17:44:10 UTC
While I am in favor of increasing the sense of distance in New Eden, I am concerned about the effect of these changes on Black Ops battleships. In their current form, these ships have one niche in which they excel: covert hotdrops, whether jumping in themselves or bridging other ships. They are mediocre for any other use. The long cooldowns which will be imposed after 2-3 drops (i.e. 4-6 jumps, since you make a jump in and a jump out on each drop) will make this form of gameplay unbearably tedious, effectively making black ops useless until they receive a significant rebalance--something which I have not yet seen any hints at.

As such, I would recommend one of the following:

1. Apply additional fatigue only when jumping to a new unique system which has not been visited during the current cooldown. This would leave the examples in the dev blog unchanged, but un-nerfs the sort of local action that black ops battleships are generally used for. It would allow quicker back-and-forth trips, for example if you want to move a large number of assembled ships one carrier jump, without removing the penalty for trips across New Eden.

For Black Ops, this would mean that they would still accrue fatigue, but only once per drop rather than twice. This may not be enough to save them from irrelevance, but it would be a start.

2. Release a Black Ops rebalance at the same time as the jump nerfs, to make them not completely useless. I'm sure the balance teams are familiar with the discussion around Black Ops, so I won't get into what that rebalance might look like here.

3. Give Black Ops an exemption similar to JFs and Rorquals.

If none of these actions are taken, Black Ops will be in a very very bad place. Please consider doing something to prevent that.
Edwin Wyatt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#183 - 2014-10-01 17:44:14 UTC
Paul Maken wrote:
So, I go out on a small capital op to repair a starbase.

We leave from the capital staging point, and jump 5LY to a system with a POS that we need to rep up. That leaves me a 6 minutes timer and 6 minutes of fatigue. After two cycles of triage, 10 minutes have elapsed and we can jump home. The fatigue has dropped at 0.1 per minute to 5 minutes, but on jumping back it is increased to 30 minutes.

This timer will take 30*10 = 300 minutes or 5 hours to go away. During that time (i.e. the rest of my play time for today) I cannot go on any other fleets because the FC might use a jump bridge and I'll be left behind.

That's going to have a chilling effect on my ability to go on more than one fleet in a day, even if those fleets don't go very far and use only one jump each direction.



Stop fighting so far way from home?

No wait that was to easy :)
350125GO
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#184 - 2014-10-01 17:44:17 UTC
JackEuchre wrote:
So much hate and drama. On the feedback forum, all I saw was reduce force projection. CCP does so and now drama.

OK, point 1. Seems a bit extreme, capping max cool down to 15 minutes would have accomplished the same without causing bobby to quit eve...

Point 2. Bobby should get the Helios out of his ship maintain bay, find a wormhole, hopefully class 5 or even to lowsec...bookmark and hopefully create a path that gets him from 50 ly to 8 ly. Issue fixed.

Wormhole travel is so much more capable. For those in stain, find a c3, it will usually have a high sec or low sec exit. Not that hard.

Jack.



What's wrong with you?! Don't even think about explaining how this issue can be mitigated by players playing smarter. Nullbears want the i win button, they certainly don't want to scan down wormholes, let alone jump into them. I mean, they might die.

OH NOES> NO LOCAL!!!!!

You're young, you'll adjust. I'm old, I'll get used to it.

Igor Nappi
Doomheim
#185 - 2014-10-01 17:44:30 UTC
All the nullbear tears in this thread make me think there's still hope that CCP will be able to shake things up in dullsec after all.

Furthermore, I think that links must be removed from the game.

ulililillia
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#186 - 2014-10-01 17:44:45 UTC
Ai Mei
Starfish Operating Syndicate
#187 - 2014-10-01 17:44:58 UTC
I have a better solution.


ArrowJump range 8 LY with skills.


ArrowChange decay rate to 0.2 / minute

ArrowFinally change fatigue gain to 1 + ( 0.75 * light years traveled)


This provides a nerf but not a super harsh nerf.

MATHS!

so if you travel 10 light years you will have a fatigue of 1 + ( 0.75 * 10) = 8.5

At a decay rate of 0.2 per minute it will take 42.5 minutes to remove all fatigue.


This is not as bad as 85 mins to remove fatigue.


GUYS we are going to get the nerf, but...... it doesnt have to be super harsh. So be reasonable on both sides. Let's just change the formula to be less harsh ok?


Needmore Longcat
Jump Drive Appreciation Society
Jump Drive Appreciation Alliance
#188 - 2014-10-01 17:45:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Needmore Longcat
Can we buy PLEX to make the timer go down faster? Or make in-app purchases on a mobile application?


That's literally where it sounds like you're going. This is no different than "waiting to earn stars" so that you can level up on some half-baked mobile game. Why not just pull the trigger already?
VLAD VIRONS
X-SENSE Security
#189 - 2014-10-01 17:45:21 UTC
Legetus Shmoof Metallii wrote:
My two cents.


I'm not able to use any jump capable ships, but this is my two cents.
Roll
Tung Yoggi
SnaiLs aNd FroGs
#190 - 2014-10-01 17:45:21 UTC
If my analysis of recent changes is correct, CCP is making sov null players quit, and filling the void with French newbies.

Now that's what I call a plan
Prince Kobol
#191 - 2014-10-01 17:45:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Prince Kobol
Just want to say congratulations to the Goonswarm. You have now literately won Eve.

There is no entity that can even get close to matching the size of subcap fleet you can put out.. null sec is all yours.

Enjoy
Hicksimus
Torgue
#192 - 2014-10-01 17:46:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Hicksimus
Simple jump drive change!


Scale up jump time to a cyno by the number of ships in the fleet with that cyno......and in such a way that it cannot be negated by cycling the cyno through multiple fleets of one cap.

1 Capital? X number of seconds
2 Capitals? 2X number of seconds
3 Capitals 3X number of seconds

Do similarly for a bridge.....1 titan, 1 cyno, 60 cruisers.......yeah you can attack that 1 Tengu 10 jumps away if your bait can last 10 minutes.

Blobbing needs a kick in the balls.......the proposed changes have less to do with blobbing and more to do with just sucking.

Recruitment Officer: What type of a pilot are you? Me: I've been described as a Ray Charles with Parkinsons and a drinking problem.

Thead Enco
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#193 - 2014-10-01 17:46:23 UTC
Mike Azariah wrote:
Gonna be a bumpy ride.

I will be collecting relevant comments in this small bag over here, tears in the tanker, over there.

m


Was it necessary to include jump freighters into this mess? Logistics is already **** in 0.0 not withstanding these changes.
Edwin Wyatt
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#194 - 2014-10-01 17:46:24 UTC
onefineday wrote:
Rip eve , every one welcome to 2007. no more quick response fleets no more cap fights every one is gonna sit in its little space corner and take gates all around cos ccp solution to solve bad Hardware is to nerf a game to 2007, as a player am really sad i need to pay money for this game sad its nothing else even similar on a market . Sad to see such a terrible solution you apply to a game i hope you gonna put last nail in a coffin witch nearly happened whit incarnia.



This is absolutely not true, it just takes longer for people to get ready for such large scale battles.

There will be no last minute batphoning, ghost ridding half way around the universe only to do the same thing on the other side of the universe 5 minutes later :)

Adapt or die.

Oh the tears are plenty today :)

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#195 - 2014-10-01 17:46:24 UTC
Removed a post with racist speech. Please keep it civil. Thank you.

ISD Dorrim Barstorlode

Senior Lead

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

Maleenova
Yulai Guard Operations Fleet
#196 - 2014-10-01 17:46:33 UTC
WOW talk about putting the last nail in EVE's coffin. Well think of the money I will save unsubscribing my capital accounts.

McGeeUK
Narukami Federation
#197 - 2014-10-01 17:46:53 UTC
Idea Well that's £30 a month I can save! Idea
bp920091
Black Aces
Goonswarm Federation
#198 - 2014-10-01 17:46:57 UTC
This change will completely destroy the T2 economy of eve, due to incredibly ill-thought changes.

1. The moon distribution for R8 and R32 moons is EXTREMELY regional, with most regions containing not a single moon of a R8/32 type, while containing a massive surplus of another type.

2. These changes make POSs of a type not supported locally being just about impossible to run, due to the massive M3 needed to import/export.

3. R64s wont be affected by tower type, as they can fit several silos and a reaonable defense on them, regardless of race (some do it better, but all are able to do it)

4. The amount of m3 that needs importing/exporting, even just with R8/32 Materials, is unfeasible for going via gates

Since CCP has decided on keeping R8/32 moons regional, a centralized meeting place is an absolute necessity, which is why places like Jita are so good for selling and buying goo for reactions and T2 components.

These changes will do nothing but increase the price of T2 ships and mods by an unimaginable degree, as well as making logistics to any region not associated with a large 0.0 entity (and being part of that large 0.0 entity).

CCP, if you want to do this, make resources (ice and R8/32) universally distributed. It's the only way you can possibly do it WITHOUT completely killing the T2 economy
Techno36
Dirt 'n' Glitter
Local Is Primary
#199 - 2014-10-01 17:47:00 UTC
rip black ops only being to hit one target and then having to wait a long time for the timer to count down
Altrue
Exploration Frontier inc
Tactical-Retreat
#200 - 2014-10-01 17:47:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Altrue
This is gonna be interesting :D

Edit: Okay well actually this is interesting and fundamentally not bad, BUT, I think you're going a LITTLE TOO HARD.

In my opinion for instance, jump freighter range shouldn't be constrained, as well as rorqual range. These ships are of no offensive capabilities and shouldn't have to endure nerfs to power projection. Also rorqual should be included in the 0.1 range calculation factor.

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