Wormholes

I have a thought which.. kind of just occurred to me. I'm writing something up in more detail.. but I'll just throw it here.

1) Return the scanner changes to pre-odyssey (needed for the next two changes)
2) In c4, c5 and c6 space... instant polarization upon jumping a hole. Currently when you jump a wormhole, you get a polarization timer from the side you jumped in (usually 4 to 5 minutes). You can immediately jump back through that wormhole. When you do, you get another polarization timer (from the otherside), for about the same amount of time. If you try to jump the same wormhole again, you cannot, until your timer expires. This change makes it so that when you jump, you are just instantly polarized on both sides of the hole (you jumped in, you cannot jump back for 4 to 5 minutes).

You want to rage roll, you put your ships at risk, you rage too hard, you risk trapping one of the otherside. Chain collapsing is still possible, it just takes about 5 minutes vs 30 seconds.

3) Make Dscan a module (and just to add more pain, make it a high slot module). No dscan module equipped, no dscanning for you. There is a t1 and t2 version, T1 cannot be used while cloaked, T2 one can.

4) Add 2 DScan skillbooks (Direction Scanning and Expanded Directional Scanner, cannot be trained on trial accounts). Each level of this increases your dscan range by 1.5 au (we can't just have a module without having people dedicate time to learning how to use it now can we).



What does all of this do?

a) Makes wormhole space a HELL of a lot more dangerous and scary. You put the pvper's at risk of getting popped when rage rolling, or even just jumping a wormhole (hell wormhole camps rejoice, you now have a reason to bubble a hole).

b) Makes exploration and jumping in a "wormhole" actually dangerous (note the polarization changes only apply to c4 through c6 space, leaving the bar quite lowered for c1, c2 and c3 space (allowing for day trippers, easier fighting, less stress, etc).

c) Makes people who want that early detection system sacrifice something on their ship to get it. It makes dedicated probers and scanners a EXTREMELY important position for a fleet and a corporation.

d) It gives the "hunters", some more viability regarding hunting. This does deter a "solo hunter" as they have to sacrifice a slot to equip a dscan module (or they could go with just a probe launcher, oh yea probes are now more viable). You need a scanner to really get around, it makes retro-fitting in space MUCH more viable, it creates hunting grounds, and it just makes the whole feeling of wormholes.. scary.

e) gives a new training for people who really want to know whats out there. If you don't want to train it or just get the first skill to 4, your dscan range is only 6.0 au.

No longer will a fleet of 30 people all mash dscan at once (because they probably don't have a module equipped). Hunters can potentially be just "offgrid", "Uncloaked", and a fleet never know.

No longer will people almost instantly auto detect probes in space without having a dscan module on (heck you could probe to your hearts content now).

No longer can you just mash dscan to see if someone is probing you out (the hunters can be hunted also).

No longer can you just "roll the hole", without risking something trying to do it.

I would aim towards doing this. You fix combat by making it just THAT much more dangerous (Hell I'd hate to be a carebear that has to sacrifice a slot for a module, hate to have to train yet 2 more damn skills to use that module, hate that I risk losing ships by trying to mass a hole, hate that wormholes don't auto pop up on the overview anymore, hate that I can't detect probes without having a dscan module equipped, hate that I have to sacrifice cargo to haul more stuff.

I'd be pretty gitty to have changes like these for hunting.. that is till I lose my hunting ship because they bubbled the damn hole, threw garbage around it to decloak me and had 3 tornado's 90 km away.

Hey guys, thanks for the feedback so far.

One thing I want to clarify so that people don't panic, this proposal and any potential change on this scale would not be in the cards for the Summer expansion. We want to get the discussion going early with the intent of continuing it over time (especially at Fanfest).

I queried before but I will try to get your attention again:

What problem is it you are trying to fix? Too little PvP? In what class of holes (any, C5-6)? Should mining be culled specifically? Do you want some parts to be saver for PvE runners? Or is it a brainstorm thing with no clear objectives and no clear problem statement?

Giving us a little more clear info, preferably without words open of interpretation would really help the cause.

There's already a delay of a minute or so. You have to actively spam the 'show anomalies' button to see new sigs immediately. This is as it should be.

The net result of this change will be that the big wh alliances will roll into hole after hole, catching and killing anyone escallating or farming anoms. It will greatly increase the risk, without any increase in reward. WH life is already risky enough.

This will force all smaller wh corps to join the big alliances to be able to stay in the wh, and they often came here because they didn't want to deal with the politics and pressure and required ops in the nullsec alliances.

I don't think this is a change that's either desirable or needed.

It'd be very similar to removing, or delaying, local chat updating in Nullsec, and I'm guessing that would be an unpopular move.

Although I appreciate your answer - and the quote does clear it up a wee bit - I would like to get the official CCP opinion. Because you, and this is said with respect, do not have the power to make that interpretation. Neither do I.

But lets for arguments sake say that the safety ladder you mention is correct. Then it clearly means that there should be no class difference between holes. Any delay should be the same for all the holes, since that ladder do not state classes of holes...

And before anyone argues why I'm wrong... me asking CCP Fozzie was just trying to help us not fall into interpretations like that.

If you haven't got the context from the OP and the resulting conversation, if you don't understand the goals of the purposed changes by now then i'm afraid there is nothing anyone can do for you at CCP or in life. I could recommend some adult learning centers in your area though if you wan't to join the rest of us with basic comprehension.

---- THIS IS THE PROBLEM

The goal is therefor this not to be the case ie it being EASY, this would then logically mean that CCP intend to make it NOT EASY.

-------- THIS IS WHY NO FEED BACK

They want the community opinion the the purposed change, they have no interest on guiding the discussion because that is OUR job as the customer.

------THE CHANGE


Iv referenced the Key points for your convenience, i have also underlined the specific few words you need to focus all your powers of focus and comprehension for. I sincerely hope this helps you in your never ending struggle to work out what the **** is going on.

All my love MadbaM

Go to eve-census.com and see for yourself. I deem it unfair that there should be some sort of entry bar for peoples opinions to matter. How long, how much etc.

No we can't agree on that. Apart from numbers 'safety' might also a feeling and therefore open to opinion. My opinion is that W-space is to safe and the sigs popping up without any effort is a major reason for this. Others might go with their feeling that they want to PvE in peace... ( Curse them! )

It's small interpretations like that that really requires CCP Fozzie to state what the goal the change should reach. And again, is that the goal of all Classes, some classes, some type of activity, ships etc...

Ah, an expert. Well then, define 'safety' in regards to all classes of w-space and all different activities that can be done therein. Please do it in terms that that can not be interpreted for us.

I see people running sites every week. And that is just me, roaming solo in a Manticore, using K162s if I can but mostly opening wormholes myself. Either way, many people's opsec is lousy. So, if they wanted to, those "big wh alliances" could be rolling holes and slaughtering people right now. That they are not any more than they are suggests that they want more incentive to do so. Fozzie is proposing to create more incentive.


Wrong. Risk and reward are mediated via the market. (This is not true of blue loot, which sells to unquenchable NPC orders, but it is true of sleeper salvage, gas, and to a slight extent minerals.) You wonder why melted nanoribbons have dropped in price? Because it is so easy to zip up your system and farm anoms in perfect safety.

If PVE fleets start getting ganked, then the supply of melted nanos declines. Price therefore rises and those who take adequate precautions gain. If the ganked fleets contains T3s that are replaced, then demand rises as well, again increasing price. This is bad, of course, for the gankees, who lose far more in their ganked fleet than they make up in the increased price of wormhole stuff. But it is good for the rest of us.


No. It isn't. That's what I believe, and that is evidently what Fozzie believes too. And what I think most wormholers believe. Most parts of WH life are plenty risky: that is basically anything that requires moving between systems. Transporting stuff, scouting, hunting. What is not risky enough is the PVE. (At least not in C1-C4.) You seal off a system and it is almost perfectly safe.