Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I've already dropped something on Twitter to this effect, but perhaps giving the Raven a 7th launcher slot would help differentiate it from the Typhoon; this makes the Raven a flat out damage-spitting murderboat (what could be more Attack than that?), while the Typhoon keeps flexibility and Minmatar tradition via the utility high and better damage application against smaller targets.

This thing right there.

100k EHP, 1155 DPS with faction missiles, 1303 with Rage missiles.

This is the only Torp-ship that can apply its DPS reliably to whatever it tackles.

It can apply full DPS (with faction missiles) on whatever cruiser-sized shield-tanked ship it tackles. It can apply full RAGE DPS on every shield-tanked Battlecruisers and up.

This, is why it's superior to the Raven.

Here's a (somewhat) comparable Raven :



With 4 BCS and a full flight of Hammerhead, it deals almost the same DPS the Typhoon does.

Despite the Typhoon being Armor-Tanked, it flies at 143m/s while the Raven flies at 141m/s.

Despite the Typhoon being DOUBLE-PLATED with 3 TRIMARKS, it has the same alignment time as the Raven and is actually 2m/s faster.

It also has 40mm additional scan res. On a cruiser (135m signature), that's an additional 3.1 seconds of locktime.

Did I mention it has less tank ? The Raven is at 87k EHP (Drake-level EHP) while the Typhoon gets almost 100k EHP.

The Raven needs some buffing here, it's getting obvious.

I will, of course, let you decide how, but here are some ideas thrown around :

- More scan-res (Needs to be at least +30mm with all skills V)
- More speed (Should be around 125m/s with all skills 0, which would bring it to 156m/s with all skills V)
- Less mass (So that it can actually compete with a Typhoon and not be stuck around Abaddon-levels of mobility)
- More shields (Obvious)

- Buff Torp-range and switch the Missile Velocity bonus to a Damage Application bonus, I'll explain this one :

Rockets have a base range of 4.5km. HAMs have a base range of 9km. Torps have a base range of 9km.

There is an issue in this pattern. The issue is that despite having enormous troubles applying its DPS, you also need to literally bump the other ship in order to be in range. Either that or you have to rely on range-rigs or Javelin missiles, both are crappy.

A range-buff (A buff to Torps VELOCITY, not flight time, please) to Torps probably wouldn't fix torps altogether, but it would bring them back in the "Workable" zone. Not only that but it would allow Ravens to get rid of the velocity bonus (No one needs cruise missiles hitting at 200km) in order to get a damage application bonus that would help tremendously the weapon system. Also, you wouldn't need 3 support medslots in order to apply most of your DPS and that would help with your tank, which is very low for a battleship.

- Experimental thing here, more on the topic of "How to fix battleship-missiles".

Sub-battleship weapon systems are alright and don't really need fixing. How about a battleship-only, lowslot module that you could script to either enhance your own ships' damage application or your own ships' missile range ?

That would allow both med-range "kiting" Ravens, close-combat Ravens and "kiting" Torp-ShieldTyphoons.

It wouldn't help too much the rebalanced ArmorTyphoon (which is already good), but it would help all the shield-tanked Torpships.

Please don't miss this chance. The Raven and the Typhoons are the only Missile-spewing platforms that use Torps (If you exclude bombers). You don't take much risks giving a single buff to Torps. It won't make for years and years of unusability, but at least it will help until the true Large Missile rebalance.

Hear the cries Missile-users as they had to cross-train for gunnery because not a single sane person would use large missiles in PVP.

Good change on the Scorpion.

The Raven getting a slight bump to its base shield HP doesn't change one bit why it doesn't work. Please read the post above yours, I spent an hour writing it because Ravens are cool and deserve to be usable

I think I may love you. <3

wahey!

well , many people asking to change missile dmg formula for years , cant see how it will happen now , good luck with it

The Rokh is already a very solid ship.

The Raven is completely unused, it's worse than everything at everything.

The way the raven is even now with the 'updates' i suggest just removing the missiles turrets and add 7 high slots for mining lasers at this point... really a lot of fuss on how craptasic the hyperion was before you revamped it and all you did was buff the shields a little?

As people stated about the raven before, change the bonuses to damage, increase the sensors and agility to at least be feasible to take as an option besides the typhoon.... such a shame as the raven is a sexy model too....

Here is the Problem with Battleship Class Missiles.
All Skills 0: Rockets 4.5km -> Heavy Assault Missiles 9km -> Torpedos 9km (does not fit with the progression pattern, should be 18km)
All Skills 0: Light Missiles 18.75km -> Heavy Missiles 27.95km (Should be restored back to the way they used to be 37.5km) -> Cruise Missiles 75km

All Skills 0: TORPEDOS
Standard - Mid Range Normal Damage 1,500m/sec X 6s = 9,000m
- Damage 450
- Max Velocity 1,500m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 71m/sec
- Explosion Radius 450m

Rage - Short Range High Damage 1,250m/sec X 6s = 7,500m
- Damage 608
- Max Velocity 1,250m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 61m/sec
- Explosion Radius 774m

Javelin - Long Range Low Damage 2,250m/sec X 6s = 13,500m
- Damage 405
- Max Velocity 2,250m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 71m/sec
- Explosion Radius 450m

All Skills 0: CRUISE MISSILES
Standard - Long Range Normal Damage 3,750m/sec X 20s = 75,000m
- Damage 300
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 20s
- Explosion Velocity 69m/sec
- Explosion Radius 300m

Fury - Mid Range High Damage 3,750m/sec X 15s = 56,250m
- Damage 420
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 15s
- Explosion Velocity 58m/sec
- Explosion Radius 516m

Precision - Short Range Easy Damage Application 3,750m/sec X 10s = 37,500m
- Damage 300
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 10s
- Explosion Velocity 83m/sec
- Explosion Radius 270m

The Main problem here is
1 Explosion Radius
2 Explosion Velocity
3 Range of Torpedos

Here is the proposed changes

All Skills 0: TORPEDOS
Standard - Mid Range Normal Damage 3,000m/sec X 6s = 18,000m
- Damage 450
- Max Velocity 3,000(+1,500)m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 88(+17)m/sec
- Explosion Radius 300(-150)m

Rage - Short Range High Damage 2,500m/sec X 6s = 15,000m
- Damage 608
- Max Velocity 2,500(+1,250)m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 76(+15)m/sec
- Explosion Radius 500(-274)m

Javelin - Long Range Low Damage 4,500m/sec X 6s = 27,000m
- Damage 405
- Max Velocity 4,500(+2,250)m/sec
- Flight Time 6s
- Explosion Velocity 88(+17)m/sec
- Explosion Radius 300(-150)m

All Skills 0: CRUISE MISSILES
Standard - Long Range Normal Damage 3,750m/sec X 20s = 75,000m
- Damage 300
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 20s
- Explosion Velocity 69m/sec
- Explosion Radius 250(-50)m

Fury - Mid Range High Damage 3,750m/sec X 15s = 56,250m
- Damage 420
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 15s
- Explosion Velocity 58m/sec
- Explosion Radius 400(-116)m

Precision - Short Range Easy Damage Application 3,750m/sec X 10s = 37,500m
- Damage 300
- Max Velocity 3,750m/sec
- Flight Time 10s
- Explosion Velocity 83m/sec
- Explosion Radius 230(-50)m

I think this would solve the missile issues on Battleship Size.


As for the Raven, give back its base 7,500 Shield HP, give it 5 more max velocity, give it 7 launchers, and seeing as its an attack battleship, all battleships classed as attack should get a role bonus of 25% reduced cap needed for MWD activation and 25% reduced signature radius penalty on MWD.

I am still not sold on the Ravens 7/7/5 slot layout. The 8/6/5 slot layout with two utility slots can be more helpful than just the one neut slot.

Back in my early years when drones used to be quite a pain, I had an additional large smartbomb on my Raven, to get rid of them.

Anyway, I start to like the idea of making cruise missiles the "game over" missile in the game. They still need to be scrubbed of that tracking stuff that someone put into them in Empyrian Age.
Maybe some sort of a time base damage increase in steps of 3 or 4 seconds in flight time and a damage modfier of 2x, 4x, 6x (example numbers, don't get scared yet).
Anyhow, I would love to see people getting really afraid of cruise missiles.

It wouldn't actually hurt anyone if torpedo ranges (unbuffed) would get increases to 40 or 50km. They are battleship sized weapons and I can hurt people with blasters and Null L at 45km with my Rokh and blasters are short range.
I make an educated guess and say that people wouldn't complain much if torpedos also would be able to make some battlecruiser pilots day misrerable.

On a sidenote I think the game wouldn't break if all battleships had stronger sensor resolutions. They should be somewhere between 150 and 180mm and not at those capital ship ones.

I reserve my thoughts on the Rokh for now.