Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The only "benefit" is see is that you can now
sell the few b-type shield boosters you have left
for a ridiculous amount of isk.

I mean, c'mon on...100mill for a frig mod?

It makes no sense.

Bump for Lowsec Justice, Gank'em Style.

So I stop playing for a month and it's only gone got worse.

Bumped out of frustration.

Just went thru Bos and Heild and nobody.

Whats the proper channel/thread to start rallying behind a canidate for lowsec non Fw PvP?

Lowsec outside of FW is irrelevant.
POS revamp would serve only small number of players.
Metrics show nothing is wrong.

Not bumping cuz Ded's were camped and farmed in lowsec too (by locals, but still ) especially the profitable - shield mod dropping ones. If you want 'combat grounds' why not ask for more static 'anomalies' with warp gates and ship restrictions (with some rats inside and occasional, once in a million faction spawn).

What I'd like to see is more low-level Ded's spawning in explo system. I have actually yet to see ANY 1 and 2's since the changes and I've had a decent number of the 3,4 and 5's. It's kinda silly .

So, let's see, as far as I understand all the whining here comes to 'oh they took our PvP grounds away' argument. So what I proposed provides:

- ship restrictions - check
- potential for good loot (much rarer compared to DED tho), incentive to enter and check it out w/o farming - check
- potential for 'emergent gameplay' - check

So how is that bad?

Sorry but static ded's were just good isk w/o or with very little effort for a lot of people (I know cuz I used to run them too). Their removal actually happened in good part because of the abuse that was going on and now people reap the rewards of their behaviour. Introduce anomalies with rats having decent ISK bounites into them, occasional faction spawn too, what not, but don't allow for it to be a 24/7 farmers haven. Make them spawn beacons like FW plexes do, or make em static, whatever.

Also, to suit the purist crowd these new plexes could be called '(Faction) non-consentual elite PvP staging point'

Your ability to discuss the issue at hand using adequate arguments instead of turning this into an analysis of personal KB's makes your opinion even more valuable...
Also, most impressive KB record on your side if I may notice.

Thanks for tl;dr and I see your point.
The thing is - the title of this thread is sort of a misnomer, and all the people just bumping it would be providing support for a system that was obviously broken. So if title was "replace 2/10 plexes and this is how.." with changes taking into account all that you said there wouldn't be a single person not supporting you I guess (me included).

Being in FW, I know about the goodness plexes can provide for small gang PvP aficionados and I think they are a good mechanic. So, if re-introduced, these new 'sites' should be conceptualised in a different way from what static DEDs provided. What the difference(s) would be I haven't really thought out completely but it could include removal of site's static nature (spawns spreads across systems in a region), maybe lower but more frequent rewards (in terms of bounties perhaps or lower level faction modules) and obviously all the changes which would prevent farming. There is a lot that could be done in a better way, but just returning it to what it was before would be pretty bad, that's all I was trying to say ;).

The tl;dr nature of this thread is shining in all its glory here, which is a testament to how much the removal of these plexes have effected game play (in that we could generate over 28 pages of responses, albeit the last two are almost just bumps... almost).

Randomized spawn locations was discussed a long while back, and it was obvious to all that it is a bad idea given what these complexes were used for. We want a ground to fight on, and a place to fight at, if you make a PVE site that despawns after being run then you are getting just that, more PVE content that isn't generating much or any PVP since the site can be run in such a short period of time and will subsequently despawn. Its the static nature of the complexes that made the fights happen.

Now here's the catch when it comes to making the sites less valuable with the chances of faction spawns (referring to what you said in a previous post), it won't work. There used to be a 1/10 angel run minmatar biofarm (or something along that line). It was a fairly terrible complex with the chance that it would occasionally drop faction loot. Anyone who lived in the areas that these things existed can attest that they were never run, because no one wants to put in time for such a small chance of getting something worth while. My point is that it would not be worth fighting over, and that's the real driver of this game, "worth." The fights you have need to be worth it. More often than not the 2/10's would not drop loot, but they did make good isk when you had some success. But reintroducing a site that is essentially a place for "elite pvp" will not work. There are all ready ruined minmatar outposts that act as beacons in several systems, and they see almost no activity as well.

There have been many and more suggestions on how to fix the broken aspects of the complexes as Angelus Ryan pointed out. It's just a matter of digging through our many pages of content (sorry about that).

There really hasn't been any development on how to improve the complexes since well before CCP Fozzie told us we are all better off now that they are removed. This is not because we are unwilling to discuss the topic, but rather we the content users were so into making a sensible fix that we exhausted most of the good ideas well before CCP actually looked at the thread. I'm not saying that there aren't any good ideas out there now, its just that we have all put a lot of time into trying to come up with plausible ideas all ready.

In short: I have not proposed anything new or groundbreaking in this post here, I am just acting as a reminder that the "problems/fixes" that you proposed have all been discussed thoroughly.