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why don't minerbears just fly with logi?
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#141 - 2012-05-31 11:54:53 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Seishi Maru wrote:

You can get into worm space to make isk, you can go into a not populated lwo sec and mine in hidden belts for a reasoanble income and with more safety than high sec. You have option.. you have the sand.. but you decided that only way you want the sand is a massive ammount of it shoved in all your orifices and then complain that is not fun.


Don't you find it's a r3tarded game, when players are schooled to find safety in low / null sec and WHs, since the place funnily called "hi sec" became crapola?


I've been flying around HS completely AFK (well, atk for forums, EvE is minimized) for a few hours now. Nobody's so much as locked me up (have lockback to get sound from that). HS is as safe as you make it.


If only there was that mystery module that lets gate suicide gankers hide their lock on you...

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Joshua Aivoras
Tech IV Industries
#142 - 2012-05-31 11:55:13 UTC
Alpha, silly

95% of the players are loving EVE, the other 5%? On the forums.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#143 - 2012-05-31 11:58:29 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
What did these miners do?


I don't know. Maybe they mined in nullsec. Nullsec just doesn't work the way you think. You can't just go there and mine/rat in complete safety.


Yeah, you can if you have half... a quarter of a brain.

10 Join Renter Corp
20 Warp to Hidden Belt
30 Watch Local
40 Mine
50 IF Neut in Local, GOTO 60, ELSE GOTO 30
60 Warp to POS
70 GOTO 50
80 PROFIT

^^^ How to mine in 0.0 with insignificant risk.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#144 - 2012-05-31 11:58:59 UTC
Joshua Aivoras wrote:
Alpha, silly


It's quite funny when people say 'use Basilisk to rep Hulk's shields' when there's no way to counter Tornado.
Seishi Maru
doMAL S.A.
#145 - 2012-05-31 12:00:47 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Seishi Maru wrote:

You can get into worm space to make isk, you can go into a not populated lwo sec and mine in hidden belts for a reasoanble income and with more safety than high sec. You have option.. you have the sand.. but you decided that only way you want the sand is a massive ammount of it shoved in all your orifices and then complain that is not fun.


Don't you find it's a r3tarded game, when players are schooled to find safety in low / null sec and WHs, since the place funnily called "hi sec" became crapola?



Security in this game is inverse of what people expect. 0.0 is by far safest space. That is because poeple there must use the most powerful asset in game.. contacts... and chat channels. And the mighty power of FRIENDSHIP!


Sometimes its goo d to take a break from 0.0 andlow sec and chill a bit in high sec. But game is not intende dto be all time there
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#146 - 2012-05-31 12:01:11 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
What did these miners do?


I don't know. Maybe they mined in nullsec. Nullsec just doesn't work the way you think. You can't just go there and mine/rat in complete safety.


Yeah, you can if you have half... a quarter of a brain.

10 Join Renter Corp
20 Warp to Hidden Belt
30 Watch Local
40 Mine
50 IF Neut in Local, GOTO 60, ELSE GOTO 30
60 Warp to POS
70 GOTO 50
80 PROFIT

^^^ How to mine in 0.0 with insignificant risk.

OMG HE JUST WROTE A BOT PROGRAM!!!!

And yeah, doing that is a pretty safe way to mine in nullsec, plus you get to BS with other people of like mind due to being in a group who are ALL there for the same reason.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#147 - 2012-05-31 12:10:42 UTC
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#148 - 2012-05-31 12:12:35 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:


No, it's not cool. I chose the two that suck less (battleship mining and mission mining).

You know why they suck?
You know why I keep harpying on you?

Because you and the other chaps just don't get it, that it has to be engaging and fun for both parties.
You only propose that preys stay preys. "Outlive the attack". "Avoid the attackers". And tralala in 12 variations of lose.
It's a suck role.

In 4 seconds, instead, I posted how to improve the game by reusing a now existing mechanic (ally mercs) in order to make the prey into a saw toothed prey that can snap back and all of this using fully human-zero-NPC player made content.

I bet you have never been the paid protector who can do NOTHING to avoid a friend with 4-5 macks lose 1 or even them all.
You were there, ready, with combat ships and yet they can come and do WTF they want. Only -10 gankers can be dealt with before they open fire, and even then it takes some serious SEBOing + alpha ship but that has also to track well enough.

With my idea they come and get butt-r4ped and *I* get 100M for every 10 of them that die. Oh noes they also will have p!ss annoying consequences. All 2.5M per subsidized anyway ship of them.


You want to fight back? Get that rep Rokh on field and have your protection crew SEBOed up ready to shoot the catalysts as they open fire.

If you had some other idea that I missed, sorry, I took some time off from the thread to sleep and might have missed something catching up.

Quote:

RubyPorto wrote:

ONE option was given consequences. Only one. Mining Semi-Afk at a belt now has consequences that it didn't have before.


I don't contest it was a stupid option, but "ONE" does not reflect it is the option 95% chose. So, yes, rightly or not, you still practically removed the most chosen option by far and large.
I am not saying you did good or bad, I can totally relate to the reasons to remove it, but still you nerfed the top used option.


The number of people who choose an option is irrelevant.

Logging Supers and Titans off mid battle was the option 95% of dying super-pilots took. CCP nerfed that. 95% of Miners were picking the AFK option? Fine, CCP didn't nerf it, GSF did.

Quote:


I am less poetic than you are - being a EvE and RL finance guy I have my fair experiences in sons of a b*tch.
Had goons openly stated their OTEC interest instead of that Messiah-quasi-Goebels-quasi-James 315 rant by Mittani on that external website, then they'd appear much less epic but more straight and would certainly attracted more sympathy by outsiders and free thinkers like me.


Not that they need to, but they've been pretty dang open with every single one of their mass market manipulations.

Gallente Ice Interdiction, they announced that they had bought spectacular amounts of Oxy Topes.
Caldari Ice Interdiction, same shit, different flavor
Hulkageddon, repeatedly pointing out that each Hulk contains 200m ISK with of Technetium and that GSF is part of OTEC.

Of course they're going to dress it up. The state fair is about selling food and livestock, but you dress it up to make it more fun. The Mittani wrote up a nice little backstory for HAG to make it more fun.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#149 - 2012-05-31 12:14:01 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Joshua Aivoras wrote:
Alpha, silly


It's quite funny when people say 'use Basilisk to rep Hulk's shields' when there's no way to counter Tornado.


You make a lot of money ganking a tanked Hulk with 4 tornados?

Nope. You flush 240m worth of tornados to get 10m in loot, 10m bounty and a little bitty bit of tears.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#150 - 2012-05-31 12:14:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Tallian Saotome
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?

alot easier to watch for hostiles with more eyes, sharing of bonuses(did you know that hulks can benefit from pvp fleet bonuses?), mutual support, and I understand that your per person profit margins go up higher the more people are involved, but I have not seen the math on the last one.

Edit: Oh, and with enough of them, the combined droneswarm has a staggering amount of firepower, and should be able to deal with any threat that doesn't alpha someone before anyone dies.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#151 - 2012-05-31 12:14:45 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Try something that I suggested that you pooh poohed as ::effort::
Remember, kids, pooh-poohing is the road to failure.

Lipbite wrote:
Because logi takes 6+ months to grow or cost 6b to buy and logi won't help against battlecruiser alpha strike anyway. And with 100m per-hulk payouts tornado is still profitable.
No, no, no and no. In roughly that order. A Logi to protect against ganking only really takes the time to get Cruiser to V — you get no useful bonuses (for that purpose) by increasing the logi skill, and you're going to use named reppers/transporters anyway. No battlecruiser can alpha-strike a properly fitted Hulk, so the repping does indeed help. Finally, you don't get 100M per hulk so Tornadoes quickly become hugely unprofitable.

Jorma Morkkis wrote:
It's quite funny when people say 'use Basilisk to rep Hulk's shields' when there's no way to counter Tornado.
…except for repping, of course, since you can't alpha a properly fitted Hulk without being very lucky or using more tornadoes than is profitable. So the latter isn't likely to happen, and in the former case, a Basilisk can quite easily recover the damage dealt by one (or even two) Tornadoes.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#152 - 2012-05-31 12:16:09 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Seishi Maru wrote:

You can get into worm space to make isk, you can go into a not populated lwo sec and mine in hidden belts for a reasoanble income and with more safety than high sec. You have option.. you have the sand.. but you decided that only way you want the sand is a massive ammount of it shoved in all your orifices and then complain that is not fun.


Don't you find it's a r3tarded game, when players are schooled to find safety in low / null sec and WHs, since the place funnily called "hi sec" became crapola?


I've been flying around HS completely AFK (well, atk for forums, EvE is minimized) for a few hours now. Nobody's so much as locked me up (have lockback to get sound from that). HS is as safe as you make it.


If only there was that mystery module that lets gate suicide gankers hide their lock on you...


Last I checked, autotarget lock-back still locks back, making that distinctive sound. I may have my sound turned off though... hmm

Oh well, I chose the amount of risk I am comfortable exposing myself to. I judge my risk of getting ganked to be a low, but acceptable risk.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#153 - 2012-05-31 12:17:34 UTC
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?


Chaff.


If there is 1 Hulk when a gank warps in, that hulk has a 100% chance of being the target of the gank.
If there are 10 Hulks, each hulk has a 10% chance.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#154 - 2012-05-31 12:18:07 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?

alot easier to watch for hostiles with more eyes, sharing of bonuses(did you know that hulks can benefit from pvp fleet bonuses?), mutual support, and I understand that your per person profit margins go up higher the more people are involved, but I have not seen the math on the last one.

Edit: Oh, and with enough of them, the combined droneswarm has a staggering amount of firepower, and should be able to deal with any threat that doesn't alpha someone before anyone dies.
…also, as someone pointed out in one of these threads, a school of Hulks can spider-web (hah!) each other and mine aligned while floating along at a mere 25m/s — at that pace, it'll take you 20 minutes to fly out of range of your strip miners (and by then, the rock should be gone, your cargo hold should be full, and you should have moved on to the next asteroid anyway).
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#155 - 2012-05-31 12:18:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
Tippia wrote:
…except for repping, of course, since you can't alpha a properly fitted Hulk without being very lucky or using more tornadoes than is profitable. So the latter isn't likely to happen, and in the former case, a Basilisk can quite easily recover the damage dealt by one (or even two) Tornadoes.


We need a proof that Basilisk can rep Hulk's shields after 5-6 Tornado volleys.

There's time for 2 volleys per Tornado in 0.5. Three volleys if you know what you're doing.
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#156 - 2012-05-31 12:20:17 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?

alot easier to watch for hostiles with more eyes, sharing of bonuses(did you know that hulks can benefit from pvp fleet bonuses?), mutual support, and I understand that your per person profit margins go up higher the more people are involved, but I have not seen the math on the last one.

Edit: Oh, and with enough of them, the combined droneswarm has a staggering amount of firepower, and should be able to deal with any threat that doesn't alpha someone before anyone dies.

Ah.. well, i get the mining links bonuses. Just not sure about any increase on survivability when doing them in groups.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#157 - 2012-05-31 12:21:13 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…except for repping, of course, since you can't alpha a properly fitted Hulk without being very lucky or using more tornadoes than is profitable. So the latter isn't likely to happen, and in the former case, a Basilisk can quite easily recover the damage dealt by one (or even two) Tornadoes.


We need a proof that Basilisk can rep Hulk's shields after 5-6 Tornado volleys.

Why would he wait 5-6 volleys?

He has 6 reppers, stagger the start 1 second apart, and suddenly his target becomes immune to any death other than an alpha strike.

And it takes enough alpha to kill a properly tanked hulk that no one can afford to keep that up for long, unless they have a PERSONAL Tech moon(as opposed to the 60 total that is help by all 8000 members of GSF).

Some people will still do it, but it will not be a viable profession the way it is now.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#158 - 2012-05-31 12:22:45 UTC
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?

alot easier to watch for hostiles with more eyes, sharing of bonuses(did you know that hulks can benefit from pvp fleet bonuses?), mutual support, and I understand that your per person profit margins go up higher the more people are involved, but I have not seen the math on the last one.

Edit: Oh, and with enough of them, the combined droneswarm has a staggering amount of firepower, and should be able to deal with any threat that doesn't alpha someone before anyone dies.

Ah.. well, i get the mining links bonuses. Just not sure about any increase on survivability when doing them in groups.

Not just mining bonuses, also agility(make it quicker to align) resists, you know, all the same ganglinks we get in PVP fleets. Hell, even a sigrad bonus means they have another second to get out before the ganker locks.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#159 - 2012-05-31 12:23:22 UTC
Seishi Maru wrote:
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Seishi Maru wrote:

You can get into worm space to make isk, you can go into a not populated lwo sec and mine in hidden belts for a reasoanble income and with more safety than high sec. You have option.. you have the sand.. but you decided that only way you want the sand is a massive ammount of it shoved in all your orifices and then complain that is not fun.


Don't you find it's a r3tarded game, when players are schooled to find safety in low / null sec and WHs, since the place funnily called "hi sec" became crapola?



Security in this game is inverse of what people expect. 0.0 is by far safest space. That is because poeple there must use the most powerful asset in game.. contacts... and chat channels. And the mighty power of FRIENDSHIP!


Sometimes its goo d to take a break from 0.0 andlow sec and chill a bit in high sec. But game is not intende dto be all time there


Friendship is indeed Magic

Highseccers look at the safety of deep Sov space and don't realize that keeping that safety requires effort on everyone's part.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#160 - 2012-05-31 12:24:13 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Sarah Schneider wrote:
Could someone explain to me the "mine in group" thing? I don't do suicide gank much so i probably have no idea, but what's the point? is it so that miners can go on and PANIC together with a bunch of other miners instead of PANIC-ing alone?


Chaff.


If there is 1 Hulk when a gank warps in, that hulk has a 100% chance of being the target of the gank.
If there are 10 Hulks, each hulk has a 10% chance.

Good point, thanks Porto.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave