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Incursion changes

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Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#241 - 2012-05-08 18:28:40 UTC
Herr Ronin wrote:
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:

Have you logi'd incursions? Have you ran anything above VG's? Or are you just one of the many people that are commenting on something you know almost nothing about?

P.S. Note to the smart ass that hired a merc corp... I have other characters I can run incursions on... Don't think that a war dec will stop me.


I only fly logistics, sir, easiest ships to fly in incursion tbh.

my FC is ladytomahawk or something, cant really remember


Your FC is well, He flys a CNR, Enough said really.


that's the guy, idk if he still flys it
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#242 - 2012-05-08 18:34:08 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
Herr Ronin wrote:
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:

Have you logi'd incursions? Have you ran anything above VG's? Or are you just one of the many people that are commenting on something you know almost nothing about?

P.S. Note to the smart ass that hired a merc corp... I have other characters I can run incursions on... Don't think that a war dec will stop me.


I only fly logistics, sir, easiest ships to fly in incursion tbh.

my FC is ladytomahawk or something, cant really remember


Your FC is well, He flys a CNR, Enough said really.


that's the guy, idk if he still flys it


He does, I can assure you, There is a lot of factors why i do not like him, The main one is that he thinks he is "L33T" I mean, Pre Patch he never went against us in a site.

He doesn't get the factor of Missile take time to hit and turrets are instant.

Plus back in the day, About 1 year ago, When i was running public fleets, he tried to warp out the wing, From then i have thought of him as a idiot.

There is people who know what they are talking about, He is just not one of them, Maybe he has changed, You never know.

He might of gone into a Scorp Navy Issue ( Sarcasium btw )

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#243 - 2012-05-08 18:36:03 UTC
Xemnus wrote:
Would be nice to allow Command Ships in NCN Cruiser Pocket since Battlecruisers can go there now.



Dude, This is a awesome Idea, I second this post, This really needs to be revisited.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
Asmodes Reynolds
Rayn Enterprises
#244 - 2012-05-08 18:39:19 UTC
Herr Ronin wrote:



Well that's the thing: This thread has turned to crap, All the goodor interesting points have been posted, But now people are just repeating what other players are saying in the past page's, I mean can people just take time and do some reading, It won't take that long to get up-to-date with the thread, But no, They post the same crap over and over.

Tip's to posting:

Make sure the point hasn't been said already.

Post interesting or valid points



I will admit, This thread has had so much fail already, Such a shame that people don't know what common sense is.




I agree with this, there has been five or six good points, a couple of good questions, and a lot of arguments . I am not even above this, but I have a sneaking suspicion that CCP only looks at, the long and most active threads. Assuming that more of the player base actually cares about it. There was a really long repeating thread, the passive and active rig change . that was proposed. After 18 pages, of arguments, and the same three arguments, against it were appearing over and over and over again. CCP actually took notice.
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#245 - 2012-05-08 18:42:47 UTC
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:
Herr Ronin wrote:



Well that's the thing: This thread has turned to crap, All the goodor interesting points have been posted, But now people are just repeating what other players are saying in the past page's, I mean can people just take time and do some reading, It won't take that long to get up-to-date with the thread, But no, They post the same crap over and over.

Tip's to posting:

Make sure the point hasn't been said already.

Post interesting or valid points



I will admit, This thread has had so much fail already, Such a shame that people don't know what common sense is.




I agree with this, there has been five or six good points, a couple of good questions, and a lot of arguments . I am not even above this, but I have a sneaking suspicion that CCP only looks at, the long and most active threads. Assuming that more of the player base actually cares about it. There was a really long repeating thread, the passive and active rig change . that was proposed. After 18 pages, of arguments, and the same three arguments, against it were appearing over and over and over again. CCP actually took notice.



Well the only good points are the first 6 page's, After that it is just pure bollocks.

Its a shame really. There is some Key points in this thread.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#246 - 2012-05-08 18:44:52 UTC
I wonder how many devs have looked at this thread in Iceland and have either laughed or shook their heads in disgust
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#247 - 2012-05-08 18:48:18 UTC
Lyron-Baktos wrote:
I wonder how many devs have looked at this thread in Iceland and have either laughed or shook their heads in disgust


What like your's?


Nyan Cat Away!!!

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
xxanjoahir
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#248 - 2012-05-08 19:04:01 UTC
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:
xxanjoahir wrote:
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:


I fail to see the point you're trying to make with this post? please clarify? it just seems to make my point even clearer?

The null sec mechanics are broken because you can make the same amount in hi-sec, incursions as you do in null sec Ratting .

However the null sec incursions/low sec. Do not pay out enough to justify the logistics headaches.

By all means I'm not saying that high sec incursions shouldn't pay out more than a level 4, because I think they should and I don't think high sec been nerfed because you guys already have a terrible enough. However the gap needs to be widened between between the two to justify the extra hassle.

my opinion on incursions, is quite clear from my original post : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1246349#post1246349 & and here https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1262117#post1262117 (bottom section) Copy here for lazy people"

As far as incursion balancing the CCP must make up their mind what they want incursions to be. So if we want some progress .


Stop kidding yourself - the biggest reason why people move to null sec is because they get pvp, and becuase they are able to make isk easy is a far 2nd reason. The gap between pay out in null sec and high sec is wide enough if you actually looted and salvaged everything rather than just killing for bounties. I could do 100m in a using a tanked ishtar solo with a salvager and scoop loot, shiny ships aside, high sec traditional BS fleets wouldnt make that in VG sites.


You are full of shut, with this comment completely, because doing site even with a shiny ship Ishtar or otherwise, you make about 60-70 an hour, yes if you alt to salvage behind you. You could probably make more. However that is a second character.
Why do that, when you could buy a character and put that second account and dual box hi-sec incursions. Again, that would be safer, make you more money, and the logistically easier Hack if I could afford to buy two characters I'd be doing that now.

Ps: if you want eft warrior this with perfect skills I challenge you, my ratting ship, without drones, puts out 750 DPS, if you can get an Ishtar Up to 750 Dps with enough cargo space to salvage and looting entire site ( is warping off, could possibly losing your site ,and it affects isk) remember it has to have no of guns in the high slots, it needs tractor beams and Salvagers and be able to tank a sanctum. It's not going to happen. But feel free to try. (Salvage only makes you money if you can sell it. Which means moving it to the market system in a hauler)Which is more logistical problems and risk. Further proving my argument.



[Ishtar,]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Damage Control II
Energized Armor Layering Membrane II

Experimental 10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Salvager II
Salvager II
Salvager II
Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I


Warrior II x10
Warden II x5
Warden II x8

Take aggro from room and let sentries do work while you work your tractor beams and salvage... jettison into can and bm for it later.
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#249 - 2012-05-08 19:12:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Herr Ronin
xxanjoahir wrote:
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:
xxanjoahir wrote:
Asmodes Reynolds wrote:


I fail to see the point you're trying to make with this post? please clarify? it just seems to make my point even clearer?

The null sec mechanics are broken because you can make the same amount in hi-sec, incursions as you do in null sec Ratting .

However the null sec incursions/low sec. Do not pay out enough to justify the logistics headaches.

By all means I'm not saying that high sec incursions shouldn't pay out more than a level 4, because I think they should and I don't think high sec been nerfed because you guys already have a terrible enough. However the gap needs to be widened between between the two to justify the extra hassle.

my opinion on incursions, is quite clear from my original post : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1246349#post1246349 & and here https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1262117#post1262117 (bottom section) Copy here for lazy people"

As far as incursion balancing the CCP must make up their mind what they want incursions to be. So if we want some progress .


Stop kidding yourself - the biggest reason why people move to null sec is because they get pvp, and becuase they are able to make isk easy is a far 2nd reason. The gap between pay out in null sec and high sec is wide enough if you actually looted and salvaged everything rather than just killing for bounties. I could do 100m in a using a tanked ishtar solo with a salvager and scoop loot, shiny ships aside, high sec traditional BS fleets wouldnt make that in VG sites.


You are full of shut, with this comment completely, because doing site even with a shiny ship Ishtar or otherwise, you make about 60-70 an hour, yes if you alt to salvage behind you. You could probably make more. However that is a second character.
Why do that, when you could buy a character and put that second account and dual box hi-sec incursions. Again, that would be safer, make you more money, and the logistically easier Hack if I could afford to buy two characters I'd be doing that now.

Ps: if you want eft warrior this with perfect skills I challenge you, my ratting ship, without drones, puts out 750 DPS, if you can get an Ishtar Up to 750 Dps with enough cargo space to salvage and looting entire site ( is warping off, could possibly losing your site ,and it affects isk) remember it has to have no of guns in the high slots, it needs tractor beams and Salvagers and be able to tank a sanctum. It's not going to happen. But feel free to try. (Salvage only makes you money if you can sell it. Which means moving it to the market system in a hauler)Which is more logistical problems and risk. Further proving my argument.



[Ishtar,]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Damage Control II
Energized Armor Layering Membrane II

Experimental 10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Salvager II
Salvager II
Salvager II
Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I


Warrior II x10
Warden II x5
Warden II x8

Take aggro from room and let sentries do work while you work your tractor beams and salvage... jettison into can and bm for it later.



Nice Incursion Fitting.

Sigh..

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
xVx dreadnaught
modro
Northern Coalition.
#250 - 2012-05-08 20:34:44 UTC  |  Edited by: xVx dreadnaught
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

(Trust me, I know that Killmail has always been on my Killboard, because a Corp mate of mine wound me up linking me that mail for about 2 months straight whenever we argued about anything)

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#251 - 2012-05-08 20:50:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Apolyon I
xVx dreadnaught wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(

slave set on bhaal, fail??

EDIT: wrong km, still slave in wh, just prove how tard you are
Frooth
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#252 - 2012-05-08 20:53:51 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey guys

We're looking into the Incursions right now. Our changes had varying degrees of success and this is my view on it currently:

Making NPC groups dynamic and stopping blitzing works as intended for Vanguards. I'm considering reversing the 10% income change, to increase their value slightly again.

For assaults, I think the NPC groups work fine as well, but the difficulty might have gotten a little too high.

Comments?


Dear CCP soundwave,

Would you be able to show us a Graph where we can see the number of player doing incursions before and after the ''iteration''. iam asking this since according to the LP mails we get from concord there has been a drop in LP earned. i assume alot less players are doing Incursions atm. A failiure in my eyes to the changes made to incursions if this is true.

Aswel VG sites are still getting blitzed by the incursion runners who are dedicated to them. with optimal fleet comp sites are down to 4 min again. 4 min a site was acceptable a year ago aswel when ppl started to min/max fits to blitz the VG harder. No reason to assume this will happen again. NMC-NCO's are going to be blitzed OTA's are going to be avoided in the same way legion fleets would avoid a NMC or OTA before the Iteration.

The thing is now VG systems are empty and the sites have become boring in my personal view even when you pilot a OTA with 2 logi there is no real risk and the reward has been now aswel a 10% increase on the payout would not bring me personaly back to run vangaurds but this chance is more of a hint that the number of incursion runners have been indeed decreased by alot.
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#253 - 2012-05-08 21:01:59 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(

slave set on bhaal, fail??

EDIT: wrong km, still slave in wh, just prove how tard you are



Slave's are fail on a Bhaalgorn?

Are you a moron or just a idiot?

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
xVx dreadnaught
modro
Northern Coalition.
#254 - 2012-05-08 21:02:46 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(

slave set on bhaal, fail??

EDIT: wrong km, still slave in wh, just prove how tard you are


Not that I have to explain myself to you... and that really is an appalling choice of words to use, one that shows you to be truly vulgar.

It wasn't my normal WH clone, I'd Jump cloned to do incursions and was returning to the WH. I was getting things sorted because I was about to leave corp for a short time and had dropped roles (which is why I was in my legion and not another PVP ship... because I couldn't access the SMA). Just as I got into the WH we had a little engagement with Lee and his buddies. A Tengu Polarized himself on our hi-sec and I did the same in an attempt to kill him. His backup arrived sooner than we thought and we were unable to get him down and evac. Unfortunately I hadn't JC'd out of my Slave set.

I've not actually gotten round to replacing them because I've been spending more time in the WH than in incursions. But I will eventually when I get around to it. I never seem to be able to keep my isk, as soon as I see something shiny that I can afford I buys it
Asmodes Reynolds
Rayn Enterprises
#255 - 2012-05-08 21:04:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Asmodes Reynolds
xxanjoahir wrote:


[Ishtar,]
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Medium Armor Repairer II
Damage Control II
Energized Armor Layering Membrane II

Experimental 10MN Afterburner I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Salvager II
Salvager II
Salvager II
Small Tractor Beam II
Small Tractor Beam II

Medium Trimark Armor Pump I
Medium Trimark Armor Pump I


Warrior II x10
Warden II x5
Warden II x8

Take aggro from room and let sentries do work while you work your tractor beams and salvage... jettison into can and bm for it later.


I thank you for trying but you failed utterly. My reasoning

Your Fit imgur link - in Pyfa all level 5 skills, does 337 DPS well repairing its armor by 118 hit points per second. resistances : thermal 79.3% kinetic 89.6%....... that is barely enough to tank the old sanctums never mind the new ones..... And you have to come back in an additional ship to pick up the salvage. More logistics work.

My fit without the faction or tech 2 missile rig ( I'm going to play fair ) imgur link in Pyfa all level 5 skills, does 652 the DPS ( yes I know I boasted 750 I was wrong I didn't look before I posted that .) and and regeneration shields at 126 hit per second, with resistances of thermal 91.0% kinetic of 86.5%..

are you saying taking a DPS loss of 52%(rounding up to the nearest whole percent) which means each site takes that much longer. Than turning around spending more time Moving it to a market systemand selling it. Will make me more money? you're insane.

I rest my argument, you no longer had any legs to stand on. ( this is not counting faction loot because I pick that up anyways and is not counted)
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#256 - 2012-05-08 21:05:21 UTC
Herr Ronin wrote:
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(

slave set on bhaal, fail??

EDIT: wrong km, still slave in wh, just prove how tard you are



Slave's are fail on a Bhaalgorn?

Are you a moron or just a idiot?


talisman on bhaal, nuf said
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#257 - 2012-05-08 21:08:48 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
Herr Ronin wrote:
Apolyon I wrote:
xVx dreadnaught wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

And yet I do not see any of those losses on your kill board. Perhaps you would like to screen cap them? I find it especially odd your HG slave clone does not show up, given that you are API verified, or have Sansha begun podding pilots now?


http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=15444001

well, the HG slave set was lost in PVP, but still. I couldn't have bought it if it wasn't for incursions

http://gyazo.com/872b7881331eff7e59035e5ecb8076cd

http://gyazo.com/03fa7b0f67fb6e1bd772a1882d17418a

http://gyazo.com/c8f0d8e51380d8ad4fbcc92e728c35ec

http://gyazo.com/091ad9dea5833fa2f08f924c53bec263

Not that I need explain, but I don't think battleclinic is the best system for API verification. I also don't think Battleclinic updates NPC kills at all.

Lol, I almost forgot about my poor Hakim's stasis web. :(

slave set on bhaal, fail??

EDIT: wrong km, still slave in wh, just prove how tard you are



Slave's are fail on a Bhaalgorn?

Are you a moron or just a idiot?


talisman on bhaal, nuf said



Are you aware that people fit ships different, Not like a little lamb like yourself.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#258 - 2012-05-08 21:11:31 UTC
Herr Ronin wrote:


Are you aware that people fit ships different, Not like a little lamb like yourself.

are you even aware the role of bhaal in fleet fight vs capital or guardian support???
ChemicalQueen
Perkone
Caldari State
#259 - 2012-05-08 21:17:55 UTC
Is anyone aware this is an incursion nerf feedback thread?
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#260 - 2012-05-08 21:45:43 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
Herr Ronin wrote:


Are you aware that people fit ships different, Not like a little lamb like yourself.

are you even aware the role of bhaal in fleet fight vs capital or guardian support???


Exactly, It is used in many events, High sec, WH, Etc this does not mean you MUST have Tali's. If you go into a WH ofc.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear