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High end mineral crisis

First post
Author
Mr Omniblivion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#101 - 2014-09-09 16:53:17 UTC
Kenneth Feld wrote:
As much as I relish hearing goon whine my tear buckets are full


Anyone who counts asteroids to determine belt composition is a, well, I can't say without getting banned, but suffice it to say, what you say after that has ZERO meaning


We told CCP Fozzie at EvE vegas last year that Mex was way out of proportion to everything else, he sneered and said he didn't think it would matter and he would monitor it

fast forward to now, they added Nocx, pyerite and mex to ABC ore's (Yes, I know some were increased, some were added)

That still leaves the OVERALL ratio of everything to mex and somewhat Isogen very skewed, plus the ratio of tritanium is horrid

I mean, sure nullsec has to supply Morphite, Megacyte and Zydrine, I get that, but right now hey are being supplied in a manner that far exceeds the ability to supply Pyerite and trit in nullsec



tl:dr Mexallon is still out of sync with everything else, wether it gets increased in arkornor further or pyro, kernite, plagio or a bit in all of them.

Either way, the ratio of Mexallon mined to Mexallon used in production is out of sync


That is the exact argument we've been behind the entire time, you had to wait until now to reaffirm that? Twisted

I would add that it is too easy to get zyd/mega and that a flat nerf to the availability of high ends would help as well.
Arven Egdald
#102 - 2014-09-09 17:08:13 UTC
I don't understand why it would be a crisis, you can always just mine something else.
Mr Omniblivion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#103 - 2014-09-09 17:36:38 UTC
Arven Egdald wrote:
I don't understand why it would be a crisis, you can always just mine something else.


In order to cycle the "infinite belts" that spawn in null, you have to mine everything in the anom. Therefore, there isn't really an option to not mine out the "high end" ores in the anoms.
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#104 - 2014-09-09 18:27:09 UTC
Arven Egdald wrote:
I don't understand why it would be a crisis, you can always just mine something else.



Then you don't understand nullsec

You can spawn all 5 grav sites, but they only respawn EVERY 4 Days, not daily like regular belts

So, every 4 days you can build like 25% of a SC in trit, but you can build 12 titans worth of Megacyte

So, how do I get more trit you ask, well, you have to mine it out, it will respawn instantly after you mine it out, but that means I have to mine tons of high ends

Don;t worry sad charlie, you can mine it out 4 times and build a SC and have enough high ends to build a fleet of Titans
Kenneth Feld
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#105 - 2014-09-09 18:28:30 UTC
Mr Omniblivion wrote:
Kenneth Feld wrote:
As much as I relish hearing goon whine my tear buckets are full


Anyone who counts asteroids to determine belt composition is a, well, I can't say without getting banned, but suffice it to say, what you say after that has ZERO meaning


We told CCP Fozzie at EvE vegas last year that Mex was way out of proportion to everything else, he sneered and said he didn't think it would matter and he would monitor it

fast forward to now, they added Nocx, pyerite and mex to ABC ore's (Yes, I know some were increased, some were added)

That still leaves the OVERALL ratio of everything to mex and somewhat Isogen very skewed, plus the ratio of tritanium is horrid

I mean, sure nullsec has to supply Morphite, Megacyte and Zydrine, I get that, but right now hey are being supplied in a manner that far exceeds the ability to supply Pyerite and trit in nullsec



tl:dr Mexallon is still out of sync with everything else, wether it gets increased in arkornor further or pyro, kernite, plagio or a bit in all of them.

Either way, the ratio of Mexallon mined to Mexallon used in production is out of sync


That is the exact argument we've been behind the entire time, you had to wait until now to reaffirm that? Twisted

I would add that it is too easy to get zyd/mega and that a flat nerf to the availability of high ends would help as well.


Yeah, well watching you guys squirm was worth it


As long as we separate the discussion into mineral composition away from compressed ore.

I think composition is ******

I think compressed ore is in a good place
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#106 - 2014-09-10 01:38:43 UTC
Mr Omniblivion wrote:


You literally have no clue what you are talking about, this is absolutely incorrect.

But please, continue telling us about how to live in nullsec based on your vast experience there.

Please tell me how they are different that I haven't already discussed oh great Goon.
I was talking about risk, in the context of your previous posts claiming that mining in static belts was stupid.
Both can be warped to without probing now, so the risk is identical.

I know all the respawning mechanics around industrial anoms and the composition differences. I've talked about them in this very thread. But hey, go ahead and take it totally out of context. Lets you continue to pretend like there is a crisis when the solution is sitting right in front of your face already.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#107 - 2014-09-10 16:22:55 UTC
Zifrian wrote:
Furthermore, the anoms are not just for people mining ABC. I know many miners (and myself) that mine out the mex ores so they can build things but what do you do when it's all gone? You need to flip the belt to refresh the supply of mex ores you really want and then you end up with a bunch of ores you don't need or want ie. zydrine and megacyte. Hence, an oversupply of high ends greater than the demand.


Thats what you get for cherry picking. Mine the rest. Compress it. Ship it to hisec.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY

Ranamar
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#108 - 2014-09-11 23:07:16 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
Zifrian wrote:
Furthermore, the anoms are not just for people mining ABC. I know many miners (and myself) that mine out the mex ores so they can build things but what do you do when it's all gone? You need to flip the belt to refresh the supply of mex ores you really want and then you end up with a bunch of ores you don't need or want ie. zydrine and megacyte. Hence, an oversupply of high ends greater than the demand.


Thats what you get for cherry picking. Mine the rest. Compress it. Ship it to hisec.


Crash the high-end mineral market in the process? Twisted
Electrified Circuits
Predator Ewoks
#109 - 2014-09-14 20:58:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Electrified Circuits
Yeah this is not good as ABC are meant to be more worth your while, moving in upgrading space dealing with threats etc so that you are able to mine them should be worth it.

2 solutions to this and yes it is a problem albeit an unwanted side effect of for the most part great industry changes.

Increase the amount of high ends required to make Items..

Give us more mex so we can use the high ends to make things in nullsec
Drago Shouna
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#110 - 2014-09-14 21:45:39 UTC
Electrified Circuits wrote:
Yeah this is not good as ABC are meant to be more worth your while, moving in upgrading space dealing with threats etc so that you are able to mine them should be worth it.

2 solutions to this and yes it is a problem albeit an unwanted side effect of for the most part great industry changes.

Increase the amount of high ends required to make Items..

Give us more mex so we can use the high ends to make things in nullsec


If you get more mex, I want more nocx..You're not the only ones with mineral issues.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.

Electrified Circuits
Predator Ewoks
#111 - 2014-09-14 22:23:11 UTC
I'm talking about the universal balance of minerals ie the whole market % ratios of demand for whats needed drives market prices, imo they are skewed wrong many mineral issues have been fixed in null i can get what i need to make things except Mexallon.

The value of the rares should remain high to keep nullsec a good pull away from lowsec thats whats going wrong here. Don't argue you have mineral issues you are supposed to only get high sec ores in high,lowsec. Nullsec gets all ores for good reason, to drive player driven content
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#112 - 2014-09-14 23:46:46 UTC
Electrified Circuits wrote:
I'm talking about the universal balance of minerals ie the whole market % ratios of demand for whats needed drives market prices, imo they are skewed wrong many mineral issues have been fixed in null i can get what i need to make things except Mexallon.

The value of the rares should remain high to keep nullsec a good pull away from lowsec thats whats going wrong here. Don't argue you have mineral issues you are supposed to only get high sec ores in high,lowsec. Nullsec gets all ores for good reason, to drive player driven content

That's why you bother mining out all the low & mid ores in Null Sec static belts to balance your ratio's... Oh wait you don't!
Also no area of space is meant to be independent. So if you get more Mex, what are you giving to high sec to keep the interdependencies going.
Electrified Circuits
Predator Ewoks
#113 - 2014-09-15 00:19:52 UTC
Well you are entitled to your opinion too
Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#114 - 2014-09-15 01:43:39 UTC
Heaven forbid there be a symbiotic relationship between Null and High-Sec.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#115 - 2014-09-15 21:26:36 UTC
Electrified Circuits wrote:
Well you are entitled to your opinion too

That's an officially stated CCP Dev statement that no area of space should be able to be independent.
Not just my Opinion.
Mr Omniblivion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#116 - 2014-09-15 22:32:03 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Electrified Circuits wrote:
Well you are entitled to your opinion too

That's an officially stated CCP Dev statement that no area of space should be able to be independent.
Not just my Opinion.


Mexallon is only one of hundreds of items we source from high sec; so yes, your (horribly unrealistic) comments about filling our mineral gap from static belts is your opinion and not a statement from CCP.

A change is going to be made to null mineral supplies because the system is currently broken. I don't know why you keep saying it's fine as it is, because it isn't (and the supply should be reduced, but balanced). Look forward to an update after the CSM meeting this week.
Dorian Wylde
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#117 - 2014-09-15 23:03:50 UTC
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Welcome to the free market.

People have over supplied the market for the highends, and undersupplied the lowends.

So the lowends are worth more than you'd have thought they were.



This. It's not CCP's job to regulate the market. That is why they have been systematically eliminating NPC supplied goods over the years.
Retar Aveymone
DJ's Retirement Fund
Goonswarm Federation
#118 - 2014-09-15 23:06:58 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Electrified Circuits wrote:
I'm talking about the universal balance of minerals ie the whole market % ratios of demand for whats needed drives market prices, imo they are skewed wrong many mineral issues have been fixed in null i can get what i need to make things except Mexallon.

The value of the rares should remain high to keep nullsec a good pull away from lowsec thats whats going wrong here. Don't argue you have mineral issues you are supposed to only get high sec ores in high,lowsec. Nullsec gets all ores for good reason, to drive player driven content

That's why you bother mining out all the low & mid ores in Null Sec static belts to balance your ratio's... Oh wait you don't!
Also no area of space is meant to be independent. So if you get more Mex, what are you giving to high sec to keep the interdependencies going.

we continue to throw you wretches pennies in exchange for trit
Retar Aveymone
DJ's Retirement Fund
Goonswarm Federation
#119 - 2014-09-15 23:08:59 UTC
Dorian Wylde wrote:
Steve Ronuken wrote:
Welcome to the free market.

People have over supplied the market for the highends, and undersupplied the lowends.

So the lowends are worth more than you'd have thought they were.



This. It's not CCP's job to regulate the market. That is why they have been systematically eliminating NPC supplied goods over the years.

it is ccp's job to create a good game and as such they lay the ground rules. they don't "regulate" the market, they affect it on a much more fundamental level and do so routinely

here, the price of zyd clearly demonstrates they've failed at this balancing and revisions are needed.
Felicity Love
Doomheim
#120 - 2014-09-16 04:10:52 UTC
Electrified Circuits wrote:
I'm talking about the universal balance of minerals...


Minerals are balanced through EVE.

The fact that some players insist on an imbalanced approach to mining, especially in the much-lauded "Land of Milk and Honey" of Null, to achieve ridiculous ISK/hour goals... well, please continue.

I don't mind the fact that Mega and Zyd are crashing to near-historical lows -- saves me the trouble of mining them myself, never mind the tedium of hauling. So, please, keep flooding the Empire markets with those.

I don't mind the fact that Null's ongoing idiocy of ignoring it's own vast quantities of low-end minerals is allowing many people to sell the compressed ores, mined in Empire, at a significant premium over actual mineral value.

I don't mind the fact that, once again, CCP has made industrial life easier for people in Null and all that some of the Nullbears have done is get even more lazy. And whaddayaknow... here were are -- AHHHHHHHGAIN -- whine and cheese time.

But, please, continue with the "imbalance" preaching... you're making alot of us rich.



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