Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Hi

Rephrasing your explanation - you didn't "fixed" the farming problem. You just removed it. And also removed what can be called "PvP sites". So don't know how that change helds anything good in it. Just a tricky explanation to keep good face.

As for PvP spots you've mentioned - they really need to give something except PvP. To keep people in those spots. And it was given by a chance to run a plex from time to time and get some ISK. So the system you might be considering is actually the same plexes, but in different package. So the question rises again - why it was done in the first place? :) Several solutions to "farming" problem were suggested. Some were pretty good ones.

As for the very problem of "farming". One of the key things were that those plexes were never really introduced to new players properly and ingame. I'm a teaching manager in EUNI and personally did classes about those 1/20 and 2/10s for our students. And I can assure you that 90+% of people had no clue about them. But as soon as they were introduced to mechanics - a lot of them went and started actually running them.

Devs are busy with merging dust bunnies into Eve, probably we have to keep this thread alive for next month or so before seeing another post with blue badge. In the meantime I will happily farm L4s in hisec.

Would it be possible to have a "deactivated beacon" in DED complexes that a player can activate once they're scanned down?

Once activated they can act like Faction Warfare beacons that show up on everyone's overview. Then corporations that like using these for size controlled fights can scan, warp, and activate beacons.

I think it would also be useful to *not* allow players to DE-activate beacons and have activated beacons prevent the deadspace area from despawning until downtime.

I think this is obviously more difficult than Fozie's suggestion but keeps the things most people want. Exploration is still needed, there are still rewards in these DED complexes, and they can be used to control ship sizes in specific areas.

Thoughts?

^this

It was especially nice training for a carrier and gathering enough dough to afford 2 so me and some friends could bounce around to the static systems with all the new destroyers and redesigned frigates. We expected epic pve content because of the other people in this thread not because the rats were fun to shoot at....and with no high value loot in them there would have been no incentive to plan such a thing.

More time was spent on fireworks and snowballs...sad.

The problem wasn't with botters. The problem was that two 2/10s in Molden Heath and many more in other regions were being perma-afk-cloak-farmed in the third room by people like Djambul (Hrober).

However this wasn't a real problem, in the sense that it should have made for the static plexes being removed. It was an abuse of game mechanics, which should have been fixed by changing game mechanics (not letting ships fitting cloaks into the plex ect, or spawning webbing scramming rats on top of those who are in the plex for more than an hour) and not removing something who's net benefit was far greater than a 1 dimensional metric based on years old intentions could measure.

If they replace the static 2/10s with something different, to fix this, they will still have to modify game mechanics to prevent farmers. The difference is the methods being used to farm the old sites were well known....and the possible exploits for a newly created bandaid static will be unknown to most until they are widespread. CCP will have to fix this problem either way. Bringing back the static 2/10s is known quantity and fixing them a known quantity (more or less) and balancing and exploit fixing new replacement 2/10s an unknown quantity.

::rubs haired chin:: Hrmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Also...CCP Fozzie, I'm looking at Battle Cruiser changes posted for the spring (obviously preliminary).....why does CCP hate Minmatar now? First the Jaguar gets stealth nerfed, and now the Hurricane gets nerfed again. Racist much? ; p

Wow a lot has been talked about since I last was here (just read 80+ posts to get myself up to date).

Also before I get onto my main topic for this post, I want to point out something I just did, I just read the 80 posts that I missed so that I could keep up with and understand the entirety of this conversation. Now CCP Fozzie (and others), I love you as much as the next player, but I must insist that anyone looking to contribute meaningfully to this thread give a read from the beginning. From the start we assumed many of the reasons as to why the plexes were removed and gave some good ideas and some ways to fix the content, and some of those ideas still stand (imho) as good fixes. So just because page 1 happened so long ago, don’t forget it exists. Now you might indeed have read the entire post, in which case I would just like to point out that we all ready discussed and said that we didn't want them as you have proposed.

The Reason I bring that up is because it has been said many times that WE DON’T WANT ARENAS. Or rather we don’t want complexes that are dedicated arenas. The DED sites provided enough incentive for people to risk fights for isk, and for others it provided places that people could expect to find fights due to the inherent value of these places. As it has been pointed out, beacons all ready exist in low sec such as ruined minmatar outposts, and not to mention things like planets or asteroid belts. The issue is that there is no monetary incentive to these. I will admit to farming these complexes, but here is the thing, I was 100% willing to give them up to someone who could best me in a fight, or have the connections to bring enough people to take me down. But the thing is, I loved them most for the PVP, and the reason that happened was because of the PVE, not because it was at a beacon, or the terrain of the accel gates, but because of all of the above combined.

Not to be too self serving but I made what I thought was a decent suggestion on how to fix the complexes back on page one, so I will restate it here in bullet form:
1. If someone is in the final room, all the gates are unlocked leading to that room (if someone is in the second room, all gates are unlocked, third room all gates.... etc)
2. Cloaks do not work beyond the third room
(read full post on page 1 for more details, also there are a lot of other really good ideas back there as well that warrant consideration)


I think that this really sums it up. It stops AFK cloaking for farming, and if anyone intends on camping the third room they can be attacked the entire time. Of course there are other suggestions that work well, but the main point is we want them back.

Lastly Michael Harari has it right, your metric at least seems to be broken. There used to be soooo many kills in Heild, and systems containing these complexes did in fact see a lot more frig action. It is unfair to look at high sec and then make a change to lowsec.

Bye bye Turgey

Can I haz your stuff?

No, I'm using what I got to burn what I can in high sec but I'll gladly give ya back all of your stuff...and Sailor's...and Vol's...and Xyne's (btw thanks for leaving him to farm for faction mods)...and Amber's...and...hey when did Tuskers start accepting bads?



(Just think Fozzie, without that static plex me and this guy would have no reason to screw with each other, weeks and months worth of fighting would have never happened, the Celestis of doom would have never existed and good ol' Xi'Xar here would have never figured out how to defeat a frigate killer cruiser with a frigate.)

I've had many good fights at the 2/10 in Gerper. I farmed this myself a little bit, but after a while, it became evident that the loot from it simply wasn't enough for a capsuleer of my age. For newbies, however, the frequent 10-20 mill drops was a fortune. Since Gerper is in a dead end close to high sec, there's a frequent surge of newbies coming through here, making for quite a lot of fights (although many of them rather ganks).

So my two cents: Keep 2/10 small money for vets and a fortune for newbies. And have them close to high sec in less frequented areas.