EVE General Discussion

You can't seriously be suggesting alts be counted? That just helps vote rigging. I would be very interested to know exactly how many people did bother to take 30 seconds to vote and where did they all vote from?

If the majority of Eve players did not vote - and I see no suggestions to prove they did - then only the minority of overall playerbase voted. If you do count alts then that's the same as people going to a voting booth and wearing a false moustache or wig and voting repeatedly.

It really wouldn't surprise me if that is in fact what has happened - the majority of Eve players did not vote. Out of the minority who did vote, blocks of them banded together to rig it. Whatever the case may be I don't believe majority of players - alts or otherwise - reside in null.

For example, if out of 1000 people only 10 vote and out of those 10 90% vote for the same person then it won't change that 9/1000 voted for the "winner" and the other 991 did not.

My experiment still stands.

as an older player i feel the removel of learning skills was a mistake, yeh ok i got 5mil sp's back on most of my accounts, but the filter on what a character can train in a certain time has been removed, you can bump a 1 plex alt into a ganking machine and chuck it away after the first 51days, making the -10 sec system a joke.
looking at the graphs of the number of players over the last 2 years, i can say that imo it failed to help retain players in the same as spending the programming time actually on the FIS part of eve would have done.

ccp imo should in the next patch only buff things with the exception of scaps and fix bugs, forget any other plans, fix and buff the **** we have. too many nerf's have hurt this game in my 6 years playing imo

I hope you're being ironic because you just proved my point.

But I'm not. It's the people who keep on trotting out guff like "90% of EVE is in hi-sec" who are very seriously suggesting that alts be counted equally to mains

I don't know a single 0.0 or low-sec player that doesn't have at least one hi-sec alt. Most have more (At any one time, I have 2-4 characters in hi-sec out of 6 total). Numerically speaking, I'm more of a hi-sec player than I am a 0.0 player - which is obvious nonsense because of course not all characters are equal. A player who keeps his main and capital alt in 0.0, but has 9 R&D alts in hi-sec and a cyno alt in a lo-sec staging point isn't 75% hi-sec, he's 100% 0.0. But numerically, he adds 4 times as many to hi-sec numbers as he does to 0.0.

However very, very few hi-sec players keep an alt in low or null.

As I advised before: add up the total membership of the nullsec alliances, then figure that at least another 50% of that sum are alts in empire. I think you might find that nullsec players aren't such a small minority as you assume, and that the representation of 0.0 on the CSM isn't quite as unfair as you think.

What are you smoking dude.

I voted for Seleene for because he's a long term eve player turned dev turned player again who I know from way back at the beginning of Eve. Reasons for voting because he "gets" the kind of eve I wanted to play. I loved the player drama and storytelling of the Mercenary Coalition period and frankly he deserved my vote for well thought out campaign and good blog site too. Seleene and I are on the same page when it comes to the "romance of eve".

I voted for Trebor because he did good work on the previous CSM and is a mature guy with a rl history in gaming industry who proved his ability to keep his head and do the admin work as part of the CSM process. He keeps things ticking along. He's not particurly partizan about the "dream of eve" I subscribe too in terms of vision and grandeur but he does work hard and keeps his head. Deserved the vote.

I voted for Meissa as my "special interest" candidate I guess, because he understands small unit pvp, lowsec, game mechanics and is part of an alliance that I rate highly for their technical knowledge and approach to the game "rooks and kings". They won me over years ago with superbly narrated videos showing smaller numbers winning fights against large groups using superior tactics/fittings and fc command. I also liked Meissa's honest approach to any question and general attitude. So far I've not been disappointed.

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Seleene is pretty well known by eve players and particularly eve players who have been around a bit and get what eve is about - people who like the player-driven narrative and buy into the mystique this game is sold on. Trebor worked his ass off appealling to literally all players for votes on their specific issues and is an excellent admin candidate - I think he tries extremely hard to reach out to everyone no matter how new to the game. And meissa, well, admittedly less famous unless you know Rooks and Kings perhaps - but did good work on previous csm and did a good campaign this time around.

Sure you can say "I don't know those people" and claim the CSM is unrepresentative because you don't care about eve in general or eve history but if thats the case what are you even arguing here?

I've indicated the three candidates I selected and I'm happy with the work all of them has done. I think they try very hard to represent Eve as a whole and in this time of crisis for the game I have trust in them to do the right thing and keep pushing CCP for the changes we need to keep this universe alive.

The argument that forum-posters are a minority of the game and thus any "known by forum" players are irrelevant and unknown to the majority of the game is piffle. Real world elections are decided often by minority of the registered electorate. Democracy without mandatory voting is a "get-off-your-ass-ocracy" and decisions are made by those who turn up to meetings.

Crying about the lack of legitimacy of the people who win elections because the inactive majority couldn't be bothered to vote is a crass nonsense.

CSM does represent the Eve player base because it gives EVERYONE the opportunity to vote. ANYONE deciding not to vote is saying "we are happy with what other people decide"

Perhaps I misspoke. I'm not asking you to indulge every whim, just to look after the general welfare of the game as a whole. We all play Eve right now because we like it. The CSM should work towards maintaining and growing that, not bickering about which group of players (high, low, null, wh, etc.) gets the cookie this year. I, for one, would be happy if you guys just pressured CCP to hold to their own schedule, since it seems they are doing NOTHING at all at the moment.

It's amusing. On the "Mittani Declares War" thread a CSM person is engaging in a discussion with a handful of folks that view themselves as the "real EVE community" (meaning the rest of us are chopped liver), and completely ignores posts by anyone but this chosen few.

I never lent creedence to the cool kids table in the middle school cafeteria. This CSM thing I hold in less regard. The combine of CCP and CSM has more to do with the mutually delusional psycho-drama the participants are indulging in than anything that exists in the real world. If it weren't so nauseating it would be laughable.

This really.

The way it was sold to us at the fanfest's where it was announced was as "free bonus spinoff" from WOD development that we were getting as an addition to continuing and enhancing core eve development. That was the kind of thing nobody in their right mind would sneer at.

"So we get to walk around in stations and show off with pretty dresses while still getting all the great things promised for core eve development?"

"Great!"

Of course as things went along and WIS turned to Incarna turned to CQ the mesage got worse. With a sinking feeling we got told that Eve devs were moved to other projects, that in space would suffer while incarna was finished, that there were no longer art assets to finish in space content, that CQ was ultimately Eve's sacrifice to WOD rather than a free gift the other way around.

Like Rodj, sure, I can dig the idea of Incarna for free. But if you asked me to choose between Incarna and a patch full of engine trails, cyno effect and Faction warfare iteration (completion) then it'd be a no-brainer completely

In fact there are few content iterations in Eve I'd not decide for over and above Incarna and since seeing the horrible thing in the form of this summer's CQ release I'm even less interested in it than I ever was before. (As many did I turned it off immediately because its an ugly graphic card killing resource hog)

I'm hoping they finish the 4 CQs code a pub and drug store and then just call it done and move back to space (perhaps leaving 2 guys and a dog to iterate furniture by 2015.)

But that's pretty much the point isn't it? Someone said that Incarna was something people wanted. I disagree, given what Incarna turned out to be.

Sure, I would have loved it if Incarna turned out to be an amazing experience, but it didn't, it turned out to be a waste of the time spent downloading the patch. So, I think it's silly when people try to pretend that people are happy with what we received.

Quite a few of us wanted what we were told Incarna was going to be. I don't know of anyone who wanted what Incarna turned out to be.