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[June] Nullsec Asteroid Cluster and Excavator Drone changes

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Big Feignasse
Feignasse Corp
#381 - 2017-06-02 15:37:59 UTC
Why you change the respawn rate from the Belts?
Would a limitation of the "Industrial Core" per belt be more meaningful?
Amarisen Gream
The.Kin.of.Jupiter
#382 - 2017-06-02 15:42:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Amarisen Gream
Dear CCP,

I sometimes wonder about the foresight you all have or lack there of. Specially regarding player feedback.

Okay you over bonus a ship. You nerfed it twice. Cool beans

Here is my idea on this topic.

-Give spawn able belts a 5-7 day respawn timer from depletion. Give Jump Drives a combat timer.
-Most groups can not mine out a full system of ore anoms before they respawn naturally.
-Increase the size of the belts and put HS/LS ores back in them. (make them like 1k km across, with HS ores as the dominate rocks and LS/NS ores scattered about them)
-Double or triple the amount of rocks in the site, with 80-90% of the rocks being HS ores.

The core issue is this - there is to much ISK coming into the game, and b/c of your over action on buffing a ship, the mineral market has tanked. This isn't bad. What is bad is the over abundance of safety systems and incoming ISK.

There are billions of moving parts in this game, and to balance something doesn't always mean you have to balance that one item, it could be a whole herd of things to change up.
Sometimes what we see as the problem isn't the problem, but it is something else the affects it.
Maybe you should go talk to CCP Snorlax about that drone bug that took months of work by multiple people and then fixed.

Please stop and think about what you plan.

edit: i could also get behind an activation range on the industrial core. probably needs to be 50-75km to be effective.

"The Lord loosed upon them his fierce anger All of his fury and rage. He dispatched against them a band of Avenging Angels" - The Scriptures, Book II, Apocalypse 10:1

#NPCLivesMatter #Freetheboobs
Fl4chz4ng3
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#383 - 2017-06-02 15:45:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Fl4chz4ng3
Hi there,

let's try to be constructive

First, these changes are directed against goons and associated admit it or to be exact against the op rorqual that player use with multiboxing.

People will adapt and just multi-box one more rorqual.

The main issue there is the small/medium corps, if that happen they will just struggle more and will have only small and medium belts to clear cause the big guys will mine the others to quickly and jump away after that

Want to reduce the amount of ore mined in the game?
- What about allowing one or two industrial core per belts?
- Make a rorqual for boost and one for mining like you did with carrier

This way the small/medium corps will be able to play.

Hope you ll read the feedback you ask for and change your mind !

Fly safe !

Fl4
Gallente Citizen 93809614
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#384 - 2017-06-02 15:46:42 UTC
I understand balancing the economy. In order to 'fix' the most underwhelming industrial ship in the game, it was turned into an OP mining platform. Problem is, as the nerfs keep coming in from too many people utilizing it, what about the balance for the pilots? I'm talking about risk vs. reward and return on investment, deploying an 8 billion isk investment for 5 minutes at a time and praying a wormhole gang doesn't roll a hole into your pocket while you can't move.

Give us something back. How about having the Industrial Reconfiguration skill reduce the duration of the Industrial Core by 30 seconds per level, and double the fuel reduction per level to make it even out?
Imagia
Ministry Of Counter Support
#385 - 2017-06-02 15:47:09 UTC
From "This week in Eve"

Watch the amazing video from Adan Dimaloun about the most recent big fight. On June 1, more than 1400 pilots participated in this exciting clash between nullsec alliances. In the end, more than 500 billion ISK got destroyed.

What do you think paid for the 500B isk that got destroyed, and what do you think will pay to replace it.

If CCP want the flashy videos showing super battles then nerfing mining in null sec is not the way to do it.
wpier dolina
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#386 - 2017-06-02 15:48:38 UTC
honestly if u do 5 hours respawn on colosal belts u can as well go and **** you self with your briliant ideas and whole game
elise densi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#387 - 2017-06-02 15:58:13 UTC
u nerf mining this hard and so will pvp become less and less wanted due ships rising in price and rarity due not enough supplies

ccp u destroying ur own game
Genny Chelien
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#388 - 2017-06-02 16:01:54 UTC
This post is from the view point of a multi-boxer with 4 barges and 1 rorqual with plans to add one more barge and a porpoise for hauling and tractor beaming jet cans. I multi-box less for isk/hour but because i enjoy the idea of mining and ability to relax a bit until intel warns me of incoming content but dislike the low action per minute style of mining with just 1 ship.


I think the rorqual is in need of yet another overhaul a la the carrier overhaul into carrier/fax. The rorqual loses the indy core and panic mode but gains a fighter interface for the excavator drones. excavator drones gain large speed(mwd like fighters), moderate ehp boost and yield boost for the loss of the IC2. The rorqual no longer needs to sit at 0 with all drones on a single asteroid but can send drones out to their own asteroid.

Add the narwhale mining fleet support capital same boosting ability of rorqual today. add a Frequency enhanced AI responder (f.e.a.r) module that affects one target and causes the drones of the target ship in increase their yield by 100%. Industrial core increases the total boost amount to 300% and IC2 pushes that boost to 400%. new module last 90 seconds (not sure on proper time but I feel like 1:30-4:00 minutes would be a ideal range) makes the target unable to warp.

Quick math before june nerf:
1 rorq currently: 850,000 m3/hour
1 hulk currently: 250,000 m3/hour
10 rorq currently: 8,500,000 m3/hour
1 rorq + 9 miners: 3,000,000 m3/hour
suggested rorq + narwhale: 3,500,000 m3/hour


I think this would solve a part of the multi-boxing one person running 10-20 man fleet issue. I'm not 100% sure of what the ore anom respawn nerf is attempting to solve? with my questionable math above.

with 4 rorquals and 10 hulks a col will be gone in 3.8 hours. enormous in 2.8 hours and large in 1.9 hours. That means 14 people with a mixxed fleet will out mine the re-spawn timers by 18 minutes.


OverLord V1C70RY
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#389 - 2017-06-02 16:04:05 UTC
Urist Mcflyship wrote:
Hey can we get a 5 month respawn timer on terrible fozzie balance suggestions? Food for thought.

E: :page4snypa:


+1 on that
Napalm Morning
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#390 - 2017-06-02 16:08:20 UTC
Big Feignasse wrote:
Why you change the respawn rate from the Belts?
Would a limitation of the "Industrial Core" per belt be more meaningful?

No. Lets not pooo on the only change that makes perfect sense and encourages more fights, balancing economy at the same time.
Axhind
Eternity INC.
Goonswarm Federation
#391 - 2017-06-02 16:14:16 UTC
Blaad Booyashaka wrote:
JonasML wrote:
Blaad Booyashaka wrote:
Tobias Frank wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:

These changes will only have a significant impact on the absolute busiest nullsec mining systems. The vast majority of nullsec miners will not be negatively impacted. The pilots mining in those few extremely busy systems will have the option of staggering when they mine, or simply spreading out to a few extra systems.


If only really a few miners are affected by this, why introduce this respawn cooldown at all? Do this tiny group of people have that big economical impact?

Have you been to Delve recently?


As someone who only recently came to Goons.... yes, we metagame the f**k out of EVE. But that's not going to change. And we are far from being the only alliance doing it. Looking at the economic reports, there are several runners up. This won't actually cause Delve to make any less.

To be clear: I have nothing against Goons abusing the **** out of CCP mistakes. Actually I admire it. And I know you will just spread a bit more (which I consider a plus) and still mine a **** ton. I was just responding to a guy wondering why a few miners as he put it have that big economical impact.


Except it is not a few miners. Imperium is huge so ofc we mine a lot. Tons of people playing this terrible game.
Gennosuke Kouga
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#392 - 2017-06-02 16:17:10 UTC
OverLord V1C70RY wrote:
Urist Mcflyship wrote:
Hey can we get a 5 month respawn timer on terrible fozzie balance suggestions? Food for thought.


+1 on that


Sounds good, ship it.
Epif
Easy Company Logistic Command
#393 - 2017-06-02 16:30:03 UTC
Epif’s Disposition on How to Fix CCP’s Industry Ass Hattery

So we all know that CCP’s got some screws loose, especially with all the Rorqual See-sawing and now the proposed Ore Anomaly timers. I also noticed that Excavator drones are STILL 1+ billion isk each. You really fixed that one CCP, I am so impressed.

To fix all this ridiculousness, I’ve got a few ideas. First off, the one good thing about all this crap is the introduction of the Porpoise. It’s cheap, can be built without capital components and is basically a cheaper squishier version of the pre-shenanigan’s Orca. Love it, keep it, no changes necessary.

Now then, moving on to the Orca. The expanded ore hold is nice, but really, do we need it? Honestly, in High Sec, a Porpoise will get the job done. Hell, even with my proposed changes, it could still be used exactly as is (maybe make it a bit more expensive, but not by much). Only, now we are turning it into an industrial carrier or an OrCarrier! One light fighter squadron with no buffs, and two Excavator squadrons (ice and/or ore). Let it mine 1.5 to 2 times as much as a hulk (I mean really, it will cost 2-3 times as much anyways) with the same limitations that it can’t hit Mercoxit. The Orca wouldn’t be as hardy as a carrier, wouldn’t have the DPS of a carrier but could still defend it and its fleet mates while also providing capital class mining. AND WOULDN’T BE STUCK IN ONE PLACE FOR FRIGEN CENTURIES WHILE COSTING 10-15B. Seriously, wtf where you thinking CCP? Give the poor miners the same chance that carrier ratters have to GTFO when frenemies show up. Orca’s still don’t get jump drives, and still can go to High Sec (I mean really, they have 1 squadron of combat fighters that MIGHT, just BARELY equal a battlecruiser for dps, and especially in high sec with tiny roids, if you’re not paying attention, its constantly going to have idling excavators) Also, fleet mining buffs still don’t affect excavators (I’d be willing to let em have all other fleet boosts though).

That brings us to the huge elephant in the … space room? The Rorq. Honestly, the rorq is a good support ship, especially with the New PANIC modules. It is basically an Industrial FAX with great fleet bonuses, great rep’s, a siege ability, compression, and an industry wide invulnerability button. Except it can also mine a **** ton of ore. Well, it was sold to us as being able to mine a **** ton of ore…. Then some Ass hats started back pedaling because they were too incompetent to see what we would do with it. So what do we do? We get rid of the Rorq’s ability to field excavators (those get turned into Orca Excavator squadrons instead). Other than that (and cutting down on the massive size of the Rorq’s drone bay cause it doesn’t need all that space without the excavators), we leave it pretty much alone. I mean it’s still a beast at everything else and has those pretty sweet drone dps bonuses.

Now all we need to add is one last touch to keep those rorq’s out in the belts. New Ore transmission and reception mods! Probably have the transmission modules be mid slots for sub caps only (sorry orca’s but rorq’s have to have SOMETHING to use those Capital Tractor Beam’s on). The reception mod would be another Rorq exclusive. What do they do? Exactly what it sounds like. The transmitters send ore from the transmitters ore hold to the receivers ore hold. Probably limit the number of transmitters per receiver to like 5 or so (get more of those rorq’s out in the belts yo!). This eases mining for Hulks tremendously, eats up a bit of their ability to tank (or if low slot, hurts their yields a tad) and even makes them a bit more complacent. Which makes them easier targets for roaming gangs because they might not be paying attention as much as they should. Rorq’s still pull in 5 times as much ore as a hulk (so what if it’s because they are using 5 hulks >.>) and can still hit that PANIC button to save the day! Well, sort of, Hulks are a lot easier to kill once the PANIC button wears off, but that’s just more content yeah? We would need one new interface (Transmission interface for barges and exhumers which would be a simplified version of the Reception interface for Rorq’s, think of it as a sort of Bluetooth pairing window only rorq’s can have up to 5 pairs while barges only get one). I got nothing for ranges though, I’ll leave that up to the dev’s (I really shouldn’t I suppose, but hey, they the dev’s they can figure some of this **** out yeah?).

One last bit… for the love of all that is holy, get rid of those ore anomaly timers! Seriously, only the big bastards can get the good ore with that mindset! Everyone else gets f***ed most of the time!
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#394 - 2017-06-02 16:31:02 UTC
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Ubundu Hakaari
Player Vs Ore
Miners Of Independence
#395 - 2017-06-02 16:44:31 UTC
okay nerf the rorq's a bit that i could live with

But damm remover thoses timeres man, i think you are shooting yourself there.

It's amazing that you can keep people playing with all the Fuc* up nerf thing you do
Lakutus Borg
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#396 - 2017-06-02 16:46:07 UTC
Confesions wrote:


CCP need to understand one thing the "community" pay to play this game "community = the individuals who pay the green dollas to play it now ive got everyone attention excellent.

Rorqual went on field to make the pvpers happy then the market goes to **** then nerf then nerf the nerf for the nerf. So can CCP nerf the nerf that did rorqual nerf ?

So the Question is whats the next nerf


RIP the Rorqual



Next nerf is super ratting 1100%%%
elise densi
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#397 - 2017-06-02 16:47:23 UTC
Lakutus Borg wrote:
Confesions wrote:


CCP need to understand one thing the "community" pay to play this game "community = the individuals who pay the green dollas to play it now ive got everyone attention excellent.

Rorqual went on field to make the pvpers happy then the market goes to **** then nerf then nerf the nerf for the nerf. So can CCP nerf the nerf that did rorqual nerf ?

So the Question is whats the next nerf


RIP the Rorqual



Next nerf is super ratting 1100%%%



propably already planned
Lakutus Borg
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#398 - 2017-06-02 16:50:11 UTC
Epif wrote:
Epif’s Disposition on How to Fix CCP’s Industry Ass Hattery

So we all know that CCP’s got some screws loose, especially with all the Rorqual See-sawing and now the proposed Ore Anomaly timers. I also noticed that Excavator drones are STILL 1+ billion isk each. You really fixed that one CCP, I am so impressed.

To fix all this ridiculousness, I’ve got a few ideas. First off, the one good thing about all this crap is the introduction of the Porpoise. It’s cheap, can be built without capital components and is basically a cheaper squishier version of the pre-shenanigan’s Orca. Love it, keep it, no changes necessary.

Now then, moving on to the Orca. The expanded ore hold is nice, but really, do we need it? Honestly, in High Sec, a Porpoise will get the job done. Hell, even with my proposed changes, it could still be used exactly as is (maybe make it a bit more expensive, but not by much). Only, now we are turning it into an industrial carrier or an OrCarrier! One light fighter squadron with no buffs, and two Excavator squadrons (ice and/or ore). Let it mine 1.5 to 2 times as much as a hulk (I mean really, it will cost 2-3 times as much anyways) with the same limitations that it can’t hit Mercoxit. The Orca wouldn’t be as hardy as a carrier, wouldn’t have the DPS of a carrier but could still defend it and its fleet mates while also providing capital class mining. AND WOULDN’T BE STUCK IN ONE PLACE FOR FRIGEN CENTURIES WHILE COSTING 10-15B. Seriously, wtf where you thinking CCP? Give the poor miners the same chance that carrier ratters have to GTFO when frenemies show up. Orca’s still don’t get jump drives, and still can go to High Sec (I mean really, they have 1 squadron of combat fighters that MIGHT, just BARELY equal a battlecruiser for dps, and especially in high sec with tiny roids, if you’re not paying attention, its constantly going to have idling excavators) Also, fleet mining buffs still don’t affect excavators (I’d be willing to let em have all other fleet boosts though).

That brings us to the huge elephant in the … space room? The Rorq. Honestly, the rorq is a good support ship, especially with the New PANIC modules. It is basically an Industrial FAX with great fleet bonuses, great rep’s, a siege ability, compression, and an industry wide invulnerability button. Except it can also mine a **** ton of ore. Well, it was sold to us as being able to mine a **** ton of ore…. Then some Ass hats started back pedaling because they were too incompetent to see what we would do with it. So what do we do? We get rid of the Rorq’s ability to field excavators (those get turned into Orca Excavator squadrons instead). Other than that (and cutting down on the massive size of the Rorq’s drone bay cause it doesn’t need all that space without the excavators), we leave it pretty much alone. I mean it’s still a beast at everything else and has those pretty sweet drone dps bonuses.

Now all we need to add is one last touch to keep those rorq’s out in the belts. New Ore transmission and reception mods! Probably have the transmission modules be mid slots for sub caps only (sorry orca’s but rorq’s have to have SOMETHING to use those Capital Tractor Beam’s on). The reception mod would be another Rorq exclusive. What do they do? Exactly what it sounds like. The transmitters send ore from the transmitters ore hold to the receivers ore hold. Probably limit the number of transmitters per receiver to like 5 or so (get more of those rorq’s out in the belts yo!). This eases mining for Hulks tremendously, eats up a bit of their ability to tank (or if low slot, hurts their yields a tad) and even makes them a bit more complacent. Which makes them easier targets for roaming gangs because they might not be paying attention as much as they should. Rorq’s still pull in 5 times as much ore as a hulk (so what if it’s because they are using 5 hulks >.>) and can still hit that PANIC button to save the day! Well, sort of, Hulks are a lot easier to kill once the PANIC button wears off, but that’s just more content yeah? We would need one new interface (Transmission interface for barges and exhumers which would be a simplified version of the Reception interface for Rorq’s, think of it as a sort of Bluetooth pairing window only rorq’s can have up to 5 pairs while barges only get one). I got nothing for ranges though, I’ll leave that up to the dev’s (I really shouldn’t I suppose, but hey, they the dev’s they can figure some of this **** out yeah?).

One last bit… for the love of all that is holy, get rid of those ore anomaly timers! Seriously, only the big bastards can get the good ore with that mindset! Everyone else gets f***ed most of the time!


I also propsoed the Orca to be a mining barge would be awesome tbh if we could use lasers and drones and mine 2-3 times the hulk.. but ye will prob not happen..
Ingress
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#399 - 2017-06-02 16:51:10 UTC
While you're at it can you make the Industrial Core I & II consume 15 and 17 plex per cycle?

Thank you.
Zajian
Fearless Unicorns
Pan-Intergalatic Business Community
#400 - 2017-06-02 17:08:25 UTC
Respawn rates of the nullsec icebelts is one thing which pisses me off about mining. Better downgrade Rorqs again to a booster ship, remove for that the 5 minutes cycle, thats what i would prefer. :)