Player Features and Ideas Discussion

The sheer amount of negativity in this thread is... well, it's to be expected actually. The OP does, in my opinion, raise a valid point however as a new player his solutions would be less than ideal.

I understand that there are many ways in the game to avoid gatecamps but that doesn't detract from the fact that once you take that gate and are in the middle of the camp you either die because your ship wasn't fit right or you can get away because you're in a cloaky ship or a ceptor. Sure you can scout but who's to say that by the time you go back for the ship you wanted to bring that a camp hasn't formed? This means you need either a friend (or realistically an alt) to be there to scout at the moment you need to pass the gate and the game should not require several accounts to play.

As has been said by many gate camps are a fairly small problem outside of certain choke points where there is little option but to go that way, perhaps a map rework would be enough to open up more paths and make camping a pipe slightly more difficult, maybe require a group to camp several gates at once to lock down an area.

My general feelings on this issue are that your survival chances are too heavily based on your fit, I would prefer if player skill and quick decision making had a larger impact but I can understand if others disagree on that.

So you're saying that once someone has an advantage over you, they have an advantage over you unless you've planned ahead to counteract that advantage! Bit tautological, don't you think?

Where are we drawing the line on that way of thinking?

"I understand there are many ways for an AB brawler to get the drop on a kiter, but that doesn't detract from the fact that once the kiter pulls range and gets a point on the brawler... etc."

"I understand that there are many ways to avoid hotdrop bait, but once you take the bait and the caps land on grid..."

If I find myself in a 1v1, should I stop shooting the guy if he hits structure and I'm still in shield? I mean, it's not fair anymore - I have WAY more HP left!

Good job, you've observed that there's a tipping point in most conflicts where one party is almost assured of losing, absent some contingency. It's an utterly meaningless observation.


No, it doesn't mean you NEED. You're presenting a false dilemma: Either you're 100% certain it's safe, or you can't go at all.

Sure, there's a chance that, if you go back for your ship, a camp will have formed. So what? **** happens, no?

And that's where other risk management techniques come in. You scouted it and a camp formed, but just in case, you travel fit with a cloak and MWD? Problem solved, unless you get unlucky with positioning. The fact that nothing is guaranteed isn't a bug, it's a feature.

Travel Fits...look them up.

If you are in Null or WH...bubbles are just part of the environment. Personally I don't like bubbles, but they are not going anywhere.

This is an arbitrary, self-serving, and largely imaginary distinction. Things happened as soon as you undocked. As others have already noted, most fights are actually over before the pewpew formally begins. Again, this is not Honorable Spaceship Duels Online.




You don't have to. You can choose to do so, in accordance with your level of risk tolerance. In a combat fit, I don't really think much of just checking the map stats for a bloom on a HS-LS border and #YOLOing on in there if it looks okay.
I'll almost certainly get caught doing this some day, when the camp is brand new and no stats have appeared yet. I've accepted this. That loss is already calculated in as a business expense.



If I'm in a heavily laden industrial ship, scouting, MWD/cloak, etc. are utilized. Or, on occasion, I'll just find another option. Find a wormhole near the destination, chain it back to somewhere in contiguous high sec, courier contract the loot to the HS system and then last-mile it myself, for instance. Single trip cargo values are kept below what I consider to be an acceptable loss should the wheels come off.


WHY do you imagine that you simply HAVE to be 100% certain of safety?



No, "pedantic" is saying, "That's not a dinner roll, it's a crescent roll." What you said was factually incorrect.

The scouting does not HAVE to happen when you take the jump for it to be worth anything. That's utter nonsense of the, "You should be embarrassed to have actually said that," variety. As I said before, you're arguing a false dilemma: Either it's perfect, or it's useless. There's a reason it's called "risk management" and not "risk elimination".

Intelligence has an expiration date, but it is not "seconds", and to claim otherwise is flat out lying.

Yes, there COULD be a camp there in the few minutes it takes you to swap, but there probably won't be and that's probably good enough most of the time, especially when coupled with other risk management techniques as contingencies.



I'm a single account, generally solo player. I get by without them. Bonus: Doing heavy industry outside of high sec. How is this possible?!

I moved ~500K m3 out of high sec yesterday, in T1 industrials. The only time I felt remotely concerned? The HS undocks.

Alts are just *A* tool - they're not *THE* answer, as you're suggesting. It's quite doable other ways if you're resourceful and willing to accept that, no, you can't eliminate all of the risk all of the time.

So you didn't actually read the thread before going all, "GRRR, MY FEEFEES!" eh, Precious?

It's hard to take your arguments seriously when you not only go out of your way to sling snarky insults, but you also edit them to make sure they're just right.

Oh really? Your posting seems to indicate the exact opposite.
Because avoiding this my ignorant friend is indeed the challenge.

Well, I am. It's sort of a requirement to exist in lowsec. The fact that I even have to is the issue. My only issue with Eve, really. Other than maybe some cultural weirdnesses, but that's not eating up my game time like gate camps do.

It's much much harder to take you seriously when you say this

in a thread explicitly complaining and pleading for the removal of the one thing synonymous with lowsec and one of its most basic challenges.

In EVE, the challenge is beating back "unfairness" with equal levels of "unfairness." That is the meta-game here.

Stop thinking, "if I jink to the left maybe I can avoid some incoming fire"

Start thinking, "that is the shortest route to my destination. By default I will assume it is camped. Pull up the map... turn on the kill statistics... well now, the route I want to take has 40 kills in the last hour, 200+ in the last twenty four... hmmm... what about that route? Only 5 kills in the last twenty four hours, but it adds 5 systems to my overall journey (which adds about 5 to 10 minutes to my trip)... but i am carrying some pretty valuable stuff... I'll err on the side of caution despite the extra time I have to spend travelling.
Oh, Oh! And I should still fit my ship to blitz past an impromptu gate camp. Those do happen. A few warp stabs, a cloak, a MWD. Oh wait... I need none of that. I'll just call up my corpmate who also lives with me in low-sec and have him scout the gates for me! After all... I have done and always will do the same thing for him. Because if we don't watch each other's backs, no one else will!"