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Has suicide ganking become a problem? Empty freighters being ganked.

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Lady Areola Fappington
#2121 - 2014-07-18 20:24:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Areola Fappington
Proselytos wrote:
Ramming another vessel should cause damage depending on the speed, and count as act of aggression. Arriving and departing from stations and gates could have a invuln timer to enable the pilot to maneuver and stop.

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.



I totally agree, and the more realistic the damage, the better. Really put those gankers in their place.

I mean, it's not like there are weapon systems based on flinging small, dense projectiles at high speed towards (comparatively) larger objects, right?


The equation to figure kinetic force, BTW: Kinetic energy = 0.5 * mass * velocity * velocity spits out some....fun numbers, when you input the stats for a newb ship traveling at MWD speed. So much energy on impact!

7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided. --Eve New Player Guide
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2122 - 2014-07-18 20:26:06 UTC
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.


Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#2123 - 2014-07-18 21:03:18 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.


Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.


People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2124 - 2014-07-18 21:03:59 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.

Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.

People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.

Because ganking freighters is apparently "unrealistic"

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#2125 - 2014-07-18 21:06:08 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.

Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.

People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.

Because ganking freighters is apparently "unrealistic"


Well, of course, the root of all of their arguments is their desire to see PvP stop being possible in highsec.

They will use any argument to justify this, that's what intellectually dishonest people do.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Organic Lager
Drinking Buddies
#2126 - 2014-07-18 21:57:05 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.


Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.


People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.


I think you're nit picking, not saying I agree with him or think they should remove bumping.

The issue isn't with realism obviously it's a video game and there are tons of things that don't make sense or jive with actual physics but we let them go because they make sense in the game. However, having a frig 1/1000 the size of a freighter harmlessly bounce off each other seems to really stretch the bounds. Every other spaceship/flying game i can think of has some sort of collision damage.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#2127 - 2014-07-18 22:05:31 UTC
Organic Lager wrote:

I think you're nit picking


Isn't the entire discussion about "realism" nit picking?

Quote:

The issue isn't with realism obviously it's a video game and there are tons of things that don't make sense or jive with actual physics but we let them go because they make sense in the game. However, having a frig 1/1000 the size of a freighter harmlessly bounce off each other seems to really stretch the bounds. Every other spaceship/flying game i can think of has some sort of collision damage.


The game has fluidic space. It really is that simple.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#2128 - 2014-07-18 22:05:41 UTC
Organic Lager wrote:
However, having a frig 1/1000 the size of a freighter harmlessly bounce off each other seems to really stretch the bounds. Every other spaceship/flying game i can think of has some sort of collision damage.


Add collison damage and a group of us will exploit (as in take full advantage of) it. Jita 4/4 undock I'm looking at you.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#2129 - 2014-07-18 22:10:19 UTC
Organic Lager wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.


Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.


People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.


I think you're nit picking, not saying I agree with him or think they should remove bumping.

The issue isn't with realism obviously it's a video game and there are tons of things that don't make sense or jive with actual physics but we let them go because they make sense in the game. However, having a frig 1/1000 the size of a freighter harmlessly bounce off each other seems to really stretch the bounds. Every other spaceship/flying game i can think of has some sort of collision damage.


Jita 4-4 undock would be a graveyard as countless ships ram into eachother. And we WILL build a wall of freighters on that undock.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#2130 - 2014-07-18 22:17:04 UTC
Proselytos wrote:
Ramming another vessel should cause damage depending on the speed, and count as act of aggression. Arriving and departing from stations and gates could have a invuln timer to enable the pilot to maneuver and stop.

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.
Be careful what you wish for...

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2131 - 2014-07-18 23:18:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Unsuccessful At Everything
baltec1 wrote:
Jita 4-4 undock would be a graveyard as countless ships ram into eachother. And we WILL build a wall of freighters on that undock.


If everyone jumped off the Empire State Building, after a while the fall wouldnt really be that bad....

Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Proselytos wrote:
Ramming another vessel should cause damage depending on the speed, and count as act of aggression. Arriving and departing from stations and gates could have a invuln timer to enable the pilot to maneuver and stop.

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.
Be careful what you wish for...


INB4 UaE causes mass carebear CONCORDOKKEN on Jita undock with a Velator strategically parked just off the undock zone.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Meta Reloaded
#2132 - 2014-07-18 23:18:06 UTC
107 pages Jesus......

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2133 - 2014-07-18 23:18:50 UTC
Liam Inkuras wrote:
107 pages Jesus......


Lets not get this thread locked for religious reasons..mmkay?

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#2134 - 2014-07-18 23:43:37 UTC
The ship impact thing is a lovely idea. CCP should implement it for one day, record and post it.
Just lemme know ahead of time so I can hang out and watch... will bring a 50 gal bucket of popcorn.

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#2135 - 2014-07-19 00:00:54 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
The ship impact thing is a lovely idea. CCP should implement it for one day, record and post it.
Just lemme know ahead of time so I can hang out and watch... will bring a 50 gal bucket of popcorn.


You may want to fit a couple Popcorn Expander IIs to your ship, because if it happens, 50 gallons wont be enough.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#2136 - 2014-07-19 06:09:04 UTC
Trosh Aumer wrote:
While I agree that suicide ganking is lame, I don't really see this as a way to fix it.. You can buy sec tags to increase your sec status fairly easily.. I've just moved most of my time spent in-game out of High-Sec, and hopefully more players will do the same. In low, null or WH you absolutley KNOW if someone is trying to murder you (everyone is) so it's easier to be aware, as opposed to high-sec, where you just have to avoid 3 people out of a local list of like 150.


So I've been using my CAS starter corp alt to mine with and boost for younger players over the last week.

First of all, by being in fleet, we turn half of local purple which vastly improves the likelihood I can identify a ganker, so I regularly check sec and corp of entrants.

Second of all, fleet members that have been ganked before, have ganking characters on contacts, and identify logons of repeat attackers. I translated those warnings into setting -10s on them, on the CODE alliance, and as I found out by losing my pblrd hauler miasmos alt to a wartarget, I also needed to leave my alt in a safe, and set -10s on pblrd wartargets so I can see wartargets from either account.

Once I did that, I typically had 3 or 4 pilots not 20 in local to review, and today I was mining in my skiff, in the same belt as a fleet mate in a retriever, I identified the destroyer on scan, 30 seconds before it arrived in belt, gave the retriever pilot a heads-up of incoming and I locked and charged it to close drone range with the skiff the moment it showed up. It did not aggress the aligning retriever when faced with an aggressive skiff, the retriever pilot was smart enough to not worry about getting all its drones in which prevented the stand off being prolonged.

ie the "escort miner" as envisaged by CCP works just fine, I could literally have followed the ganker from belt to belt if need be.

Come the 22nd, my obelisk will be no longer required to haul ore further than to the compressor, and I'll be offering contract based compression so people in the area also won't need to use freighters for hauling and can use blockade runners.

ie to my mind the toolset is very complete. early warning local, close-range d-scan, escort miners, improved transport safety via utilizing infrastructure - its all there and it all works, and by being in newbie corp fleets, we are training new players to use these tools instead of trying to break the game.
Cancel Align NOW
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2137 - 2014-07-19 07:32:56 UTC
Lady Areola Fappington wrote:
Proselytos wrote:
Ramming another vessel should cause damage depending on the speed, and count as act of aggression. Arriving and departing from stations and gates could have a invuln timer to enable the pilot to maneuver and stop.

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.



I totally agree, and the more realistic the damage, the better. Really put those gankers in their place.

I mean, it's not like there are weapon systems based on flinging small, dense projectiles at high speed towards (comparatively) larger objects, right?


The equation to figure kinetic force, BTW: Kinetic energy = 0.5 * mass * velocity * velocity spits out some....fun numbers, when you input the stats for a newb ship traveling at MWD speed. So much energy on impact!


Sigh....

Imagine a group of players undocking 20 Freighters and then reducing speed to zero right on undock radius in Jita.


Grog Aftermath
Doomheim
#2138 - 2014-07-19 07:48:08 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Organic Lager wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Proselytos wrote:

This would add a lot of more fun, realism, and stops certain simple minded exploits which are only possible because of a lack of realism.


Yes, the lack of realism in a fictional fluid universe space submarine game is the problem.


People who cry about "realism" in a video game in which players are immortal because cloning + sci fi magic are a special kind of person.


I think you're nit picking, not saying I agree with him or think they should remove bumping.

The issue isn't with realism obviously it's a video game and there are tons of things that don't make sense or jive with actual physics but we let them go because they make sense in the game. However, having a frig 1/1000 the size of a freighter harmlessly bounce off each other seems to really stretch the bounds. Every other spaceship/flying game i can think of has some sort of collision damage.


Jita 4-4 undock would be a graveyard as countless ships ram into eachother. And we WILL build a wall of freighters on that undock.


Wouldn't work anyway, if there was collision damage you would have CONCORD turn up and destroy the aggressor even if it was an accident. CONCORD would probably build that wall quicker than you.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#2139 - 2014-07-19 09:21:36 UTC
Grog Aftermath wrote:
Wouldn't work anyway, if there was collision damage you would have CONCORD turn up and destroy the aggressor even if it was an accident. CONCORD would probably build that wall quicker than you.


That's the wall he's talking about.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Yanada
Demonstrably False
#2140 - 2014-07-19 13:32:53 UTC
I've always rationalized the lack of collision damage as being a function of the ships shielding systems. When ships collide they are not actually hitting each others structures but 'bouncing' off each others shields. Think magnets repelling each other. Hey, it works for me :-)