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Can we do something about the idiots in highsec already CCP?

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KuroVolt
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#421 - 2013-11-08 00:54:50 UTC
Looks like CCP hosted a live event to do something about those idiots in high sec today. Roll

BoBwins Law: As a discussion/war between two large nullsec entities grows longer, the probability of one comparing the other to BoB aproaches near certainty.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#422 - 2013-11-08 04:20:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
Alduin666 Shikkoken wrote:
Kaaii wrote:


I stopped reading here.



Ziona is known to contradict his/herself in his/her own forum threads just to make a point, badly.

Except its not a contradiction. This character was not ganked. A zero skilled alt in a Velator was.


Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

Tanks don't work. If you tanked your boats, instead of using 1 or two cats they'd use 3 or 4. If they needed 5 or 6 they'd use 5 or 6. Since 5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps) and a Procurer costs around 25m tanked and fitted they'll still win.

This is why New Order exists. They're rich nullbears or carebears (likely miners :) hiding behind alts ganking people because they can and they find it fun and not in anyway risky. If you added risk they'd all vanish back to their mains never to be heard of again.

Yes, cuz any ganker's killboard is full of tanked procs and skiffs, specially the New Order's!

Oh wait, no it isn't... They're full of **** fit Rets and exhumers. Of course they gank a tanked proc/skiff every now and then for propaganda purposes but in general it's **** fit rets and exhumers and the odd idiot that thought it was a good idea to engage them in their non-combat mining ship cuz they went suspect....

WOW. I cry for all the money spent on education. What a waste.

If you had been able to comprehend the first sentence you would have seen that I said "IF". And "5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps). The number 1 in that sentence corresponds to ONE (CAT) while the number 5 corresponds to FIVE (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT). Clearly the sentence "Since 5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps)" refers to the cumalative of 5 (FIVE) (CINCO) (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT) dps... Jesus H Obama.

I'm often embarrassed reading EvE forum posts, not for myself but for the people responding... Its like arguing with a bunch of Elmo's...

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#423 - 2013-11-08 06:15:15 UTC
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.
Tsufuri Ormand
NE Procurement
#424 - 2013-11-08 07:01:52 UTC
High-sec gankers are like somking addicts. They are mad because no everybody likes smoking. So they go into a no-smoking area and start smoking, hoping people will start to like it. No, they won't. What CCP is doing? They just send security:
"- Sir, Im afarid you have to leave this room for 15 minuts. After that you can come back and smoke untill we're back"
Suicide gankers aka smoking addicts should be punished for high-sec ganking (smoking in a no-smoking area) in such way they would start thinking is it really worth doing it.

In my eyes they are losers who cant get any kill on their kb in real pvp. Instead they just kill 0isk shuttles and pods to get their kb filled. After that they dare to wipe their mouth saying "h-sec should not be save oneone!!
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#425 - 2013-11-08 07:14:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Infinity Ziona wrote:
If you had been able to comprehend the first sentence you would have seen that I said "IF". And "5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps). The number 1 in that sentence corresponds to ONE (CAT) while the number 5 corresponds to FIVE (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT). Clearly the sentence "Since 5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps)" refers to the cumalative of 5 (FIVE) (CINCO) (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT) dps... Jesus H Obama.
Not that it matters. 5 cats delivering 1000 DPS is still not enough to kill a Procurer. Now if they did do 1k DPS each, they'd stand a chance (the cut-off is ~700), but since that's not really possible nor what you're talking about, you're way off no matter how anyone chooses to read your claim.

Really, your sentence should read “since 5 T1 cats only do 1000+ dps, and a tanked Procurer survives 3 times that, the Procurer wins”. Even if we mix in the irrelevant measure of cost, the Procurer wins: a 25M loss (minus insurance) against 30M (no insurance coverage) for the 15 catalysts.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#426 - 2013-11-08 07:18:00 UTC
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.

A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#427 - 2013-11-08 07:19:45 UTC
Tsufuri Ormand wrote:
High-sec gankers are like somking addicts. They are mad because no everybody likes smoking. So they go into a no-smoking area and start smoking, hoping people will start to like it. No, they won't. What CCP is doing? They just send security:
"- Sir, Im afarid you have to leave this room for 15 minuts. After that you can come back and smoke untill we're back"
Suicide gankers aka smoking addicts should be punished for high-sec ganking (smoking in a no-smoking area) in such way they would start thinking is it really worth doing it.

In my eyes they are losers who cant get any kill on their kb in real pvp. Instead they just kill 0isk shuttles and pods to get their kb filled. After that they dare to wipe their mouth saying "h-sec should not be save oneone!!


Here's this interesting phenomenon again...

"go do real pvp".

PvP is, by definition, "player vs player". Shooting a miner is therefore unconditionally pvp. I mean, unless you're outright admitting that miners are bots?

So, what's the difference? Why is "real pvp" considered shooting at, as best I can tell, people who aren't you?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#428 - 2013-11-08 07:21:18 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?
10.
Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#429 - 2013-11-08 07:30:45 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.

A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?


yeah, that would be 10. So you only get 30k of 40k. Mack lives.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#430 - 2013-11-08 07:31:42 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?
10.


Confirmed. Both that you only get 10 seconds, and that IZ has no clue what he/she is talking about, per usual.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#431 - 2013-11-08 07:38:33 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?
10.

Confirmed. Both that you only get 10 seconds, and that IZ has no clue what he/she is talking about, per usual.

I didn't want to mention it, but now that you did…

…yeah, it looks like a Mac with all slots dedicated to tank gets around 54k EHP. This means 90 catalyst-seconds is required to take one down. So with a bit of luck it could actually survive that same group of five in 0.5.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#432 - 2013-11-08 07:39:12 UTC
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.

A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?


yeah, that would be 10. So you only get 30k of 40k. Mack lives.

No you bring 7 Mack dies.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#433 - 2013-11-08 07:40:58 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.

A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?


yeah, that would be 10. So you only get 30k of 40k. Mack lives.

No you bring 7 Mack dies.


Last time I check, 7 is not 5. So when I say that 5 cats can't kill a fully-tanked mack in a 0.7, it is correct.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#434 - 2013-11-08 07:43:22 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Meilandra Vanderganken wrote:
And as a solo ganker, I can tell you that a near max dps cata (near perfect skills and implants) can't even gank a slightly tanked Mack in 0.5. It really needs to be fully yield fit or anti-tanked (cargo rigs/hold extenders) to be able to take a Mack out solo.

A Mack, the mining ship with the largest Ore hold and high yield and favourite AFK boat of the mining community can only be ganked by going BC or forming a fleet of at least 2 cata's unless you completely shite fit it. In 0.5, go 0.7 or above and you need 3-5 cata's (depending on skills, fittings and implants) to gank you unless you aren't completely idiot fitted.

And those numbers are only a tad bit lower for a Hulk, the yield champion (though not as AFK-able due to smaller ore hold). The only way to solo a hulk with a cata is when it's completely idiot fitted, any half arsed attempt on tanking it and you need at least 2 of them.

Have a flight of ECM drones out while your AFK and you can add +1 to the number of cata's needed...



0.7 system, fully-tanked mack with decent skills cannot be ganked by 5 cats.

A fully tanked mac with all slots to tank gets around 40k ehp, 5 t2 cats do 30k ehp in 10 seconds. How many seconds do you have in a .7?


yeah, that would be 10. So you only get 30k of 40k. Mack lives.

No you bring 7 Mack dies.


As it should be. No one deserves to survive against that many people who have him by the tail.

If 7 reds jump into system and you don't gtfo? Whatever happens, you deserved it.

But you didn't say 7, did you. You said 5. The first guy who was quoted actually said 3-5.

You haven't the slightest idea what you are talking about though, and are just spouting talking points.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#435 - 2013-11-08 07:47:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Infinity Ziona wrote:
No you bring 7 Mack dies.
No, you bring a logi, ecm, shield-boosting command ship — Mack wins.

Oh, and 7×600 DPS for 10s = 42k EHP, which is less than the Mack can tank anyway so the Mack doesn't die regardless.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#436 - 2013-11-08 07:49:55 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
No you bring 7 Mack dies.
No, you bring a logi, ecm, shield-boosting command ship — Mack wins.

Oh, and 7×600 DPS for 10s = 42k EHP, which is less than the Mack can tank anyway so the Mack doesn't die regardless.


Hey, I just thought of a new business...

Selling shield command boosts in ganker areas.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#437 - 2013-11-08 07:56:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Hey, I just thought of a new business...

Selling shield command boosts in ganker areas.

It's not exactly new — I've seen plenty of offers of that kind in local. Or, well… they were offers for Orca boosts, but the idea is much the same and just requires a different (or another) ship.

Also, I don't know if enough people are at their keyboards to notice the offer, but other than that, it's a great idea. P
Tsufuri Ormand
NE Procurement
#438 - 2013-11-08 07:57:06 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Tsufuri Ormand wrote:
High-sec gankers are like somking addicts. They are mad because no everybody likes smoking. So they go into a no-smoking area and start smoking, hoping people will start to like it. No, they won't. What CCP is doing? They just send security:
"- Sir, Im afarid you have to leave this room for 15 minuts. After that you can come back and smoke untill we're back"
Suicide gankers aka smoking addicts should be punished for high-sec ganking (smoking in a no-smoking area) in such way they would start thinking is it really worth doing it.

In my eyes they are losers who cant get any kill on their kb in real pvp. Instead they just kill 0isk shuttles and pods to get their kb filled. After that they dare to wipe their mouth saying "h-sec should not be save oneone!!


Here's this interesting phenomenon again...

"go do real pvp".

PvP is, by definition, "player vs player". Shooting a miner is therefore unconditionally pvp. I mean, unless you're outright admitting that miners are bots?

So, what's the difference? Why is "real pvp" considered shooting at, as best I can tell, people who aren't you?


Real pvp involves a risk, even a little. Suicide ganking cant be called "any fancy name" or real pvp. Suicide gankers killing shuttles and pods are special kind of loosers tho.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#439 - 2013-11-08 07:58:48 UTC
Tsufuri Ormand wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Tsufuri Ormand wrote:
High-sec gankers are like somking addicts. They are mad because no everybody likes smoking. So they go into a no-smoking area and start smoking, hoping people will start to like it. No, they won't. What CCP is doing? They just send security:
"- Sir, Im afarid you have to leave this room for 15 minuts. After that you can come back and smoke untill we're back"
Suicide gankers aka smoking addicts should be punished for high-sec ganking (smoking in a no-smoking area) in such way they would start thinking is it really worth doing it.

In my eyes they are losers who cant get any kill on their kb in real pvp. Instead they just kill 0isk shuttles and pods to get their kb filled. After that they dare to wipe their mouth saying "h-sec should not be save oneone!!


Here's this interesting phenomenon again...

"go do real pvp".

PvP is, by definition, "player vs player". Shooting a miner is therefore unconditionally pvp. I mean, unless you're outright admitting that miners are bots?

So, what's the difference? Why is "real pvp" considered shooting at, as best I can tell, people who aren't you?


Real pvp involves a risk, even a little. Suicide ganking cant be called "any fancy name" or real pvp. Suicide gankers killing shuttles and pods are special kind of loosers tho.


So, you attempt to redefine an industry term to discredit an activity you personally do not approve of? Is that about the gist of it?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Meilandra Vanderganken
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#440 - 2013-11-08 12:26:12 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:

WOW. I cry for all the money spent on education. What a waste.

If you had been able to comprehend the first sentence you would have seen that I said "IF". And "5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps). The number 1 in that sentence corresponds to ONE (CAT) while the number 5 corresponds to FIVE (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT). Clearly the sentence "Since 5 T1 cats only cost 10 million (doing 1000+ dps)" refers to the cumalative of 5 (FIVE) (CINCO) (CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT, CAT) dps... Jesus H Obama.

I'm often embarrassed reading EvE forum posts, not for myself but for the people responding... Its like arguing with a bunch of Elmo's...

Let me tell you a little secret: many miners DO tank their boats to at least some extent and they DO work. Which is why the vast majority of ganked miner boats are shite/yield/idiot fitted...

Your claim that 'they' would simply use more cata's. I doubt it, you don't 'just bring more cata's'. That requires more buddies/accounts/trained alts and more coordination and is more time consuming. The result of all that would be that there would be less ganks, which translates to a (much) lower risk of getting ganked.

So unless you are able to create buddies/accounts/trained alts out of thin air tanks DO work.


Again, I'm a solo ganker. If everyone would max tank their barge/exhumer I'd be pretty much done, the only gankable target for a near max DPS catalyst would be Covetors in 0.5, barely. Which would mean I'd have but a few kills on my killboard instead of dozens.