EVE General Discussion

Wrong on all counts.

There's a ton of construction going on and perfectly balanced by the destruction. You do know that most of the goods available on the market are made by players right? Destruction breeds construction and without one, there is not much need for the other.

On the issue of skill training, 12 days to a fully functioning PI character, who can actually be in to PI in just a couple of days.

PvP, no great SP necessary to start. You just have to have realistic expectations about what is going to happen, but a lot of skill in PvP is the experience of the player, not the experience of the pilot. So while SP are being trained, skill that helps later is being gained - and that stays with you forever, irrespective of the toon you use.

And finally, the brand new alt that can destroy instantly can also be yours to use against whomever you like. Don't like gankers hitting miners, go get organised and gank the gankers. Take responsibility for what happens to you in game and go dictate it, rather than having it dictated to you.

No downside - go make it. See my last point.
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Yes most of the goods are made by players,but why only ones who make profit should be veteran players ,alliances,why can't newer players make isk too.So why make industrial, trader career in eve if its not available to newer players?
New indies are just ganked straight on undock,while big alliances profit on that,if it will continue like that eve will be left with dude with 100 chars.

EVE needs isk sink,ganking,but make it more hard to do.You are talking about miners hitting back to gankers,lol dude wake up imagine what will happen if miner corp will go attack some big ass gank alliance.

1. this point makes me want to gank someone, hard, for no reason, anywhere. Luckily, i can.
2. Hisec is the safest space. (Edit: for new pilots.)
3. oh who cares?
4. Nobody cares.

Biomassing a negative-sec status alt to remove the pirate status is illegal and stupid

You just run all 3 characters into the negatives and then just start a new account

I want to address this because this is where you're sticking your head firmly and deeply in the sand and yelling nah nah nah so you don't understand the problem right?

At the time security hits were extremely hard to get back up. After going -7 on this character gate camping in low I had to go and spend 3 months in null ratting to get it from -7 back to 0.

This is no longer the case. Hits are lower, hits are easier to repair. To the extent that they don't really matter at all.

Additionally to gank a cruiser you would have needed a 100 million + isk battleship or a bunch of cruisers. Now you need a destroyer or two.

To gank a battleship you would have needed multiple battleships.

To gank a freighter when they came out you needed around 30 battleships. Now you need 30 T1 catalysts worth around 60 million isk vs 3 billion in the past.

In short when he said high sec was supposed to be "relatively safe" he said it in the context that you could gank but the costs involved would be significant, in regards to isk, manpower and security status.

This is no longer the case, the costs are now around 98% less, from 100 million + per ship to 2 million, the sec status loss is much less, the manpower needed is much much less.

High sec given the camps I see, is certainly no where near as safe as it was then and nowhere near as safe as it was intended to be.

CCP has dropped the ball on this.

You are actually complaining about having to be AT YOUR COMPUTER, to play a computer game.
Stop. Think. Biomass and save us your bad posting.

I'm curious where this station is where new indies are ganked straight on the undock? I only fly T1 haulers and have never been ganked in Jita or Dodixie, or any where between the two. I think you are perhaps either using hyperbole or have had your views tainted by pilots who are, charitably, not very good at Eve.

Ganking has been nerfed, nerfed hard, and nerfed some more over the years. The only way to nerf it any more would be to just turn off the safety switch and make everyone's set to Green in hisec.

Would you like to know what would happen if a miner corp attacked a "big ass gank alliance?" They'd win. Defeating miner gankers is easy, its just no one wants to do it because *effort*. They'd rather complain to CCP on the forums while watching Youtube videos and AFK'ing the ice.

None of what you're saying is relevant. If you want to make an argument that ganking costs and sec costs have made ganking too easy, that's fine, but that's not a rational reply to being presented with the fact that you're using that dev quote out of context. My entire post was about the dev post, from 7 years ago. Presenting changes that have happened since then would only be relevant if you're attempting to prove that CCP Oveur was a time traveler. If you want to back up your arguments with dev quotes, then find a dev quote that specifically addresses those changes--and don't respond to me with it, because that would be another non sequitur like your first reply. The dev quote in this subthread is about "Mass security hits for a single aggression, 20 minute+ timer that doesn't allow you to leave the system for an age, no chance of escaping CONCORD in 0.5-0.6 systems", sorry. It's not about these other changes that hadn't even occurred yet. It's hilarious that you need this explained to you.

The above fully answers your argument. However, because your examples are so funny, I'll reply to them as well. Comparing costs without taking into effect the insurance nerf/removal of boomeranging/etc is naive or deceptive. Using catalysts to gank freighters is somewhat uncommon, as gate guns can kill them too quickly. Saying that the manpower needed is less, when your example is 30 to 30, doesn't make any sense.

I've had people try to gank me many times, but they've always failed. Perhaps you should try to figure out how to make gank attempts on you fail too, instead of begging for CCP to save you.

This character is 7 years old and I have never been shot at in high-sec.

The difference is 2 & 3 are actually
2: Not having your POS siphoned by cheap siphons for profit while OFFLINE.
3: Not having your POS destroyed while OFFLINE?

Which makes
1. Well.... your ship isn't going to get destroyed while offline (unless you crash your system to avoid PvP and get probed down)

The only problem with high sec ganking is that CCP doesn't have a logic check on Concord, so you end up with 100 Concord at a gate. Rather than it saying 'already 10 there, just use those 10'

Look at the profile of this character I'm posting with. New and making 400-500 mil ISK per month through PI and trading.

It's not at all about being a veteran or part of a major alliance. It's about having a clue to go find and absorb the information that's there and to try different things.

As to what would happen if you attacked a ganking alliance. You'd probably get wardecced, killed, podded and rage quit. But that seems to be what you'd do, not everyone. Others might find another aspect of play they enjoy.

Go to lowsec and mine. Lowsec is no more of a risk than you seem to think highsec is and more variety in mining too.