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Team Avatar and the future of our prototype

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Flamespar
WarRavens
#1941 - 2013-09-22 13:19:56 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:


Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


Especially since time and time again CCP have been told to be clear and unambiguous in their communications with players.
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1942 - 2013-09-22 13:33:26 UTC
Quote:
"This is not the focus for EVE online the game, but CCP still holds the vision. Both me and Hilmar expressed this at fanfest."


Messiah of New Eden. Shocked
I am not a religious person, but i see what you did there. Lol

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1943 - 2013-09-22 14:15:22 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Flamespar wrote:
Just got this from CCP Seagul on twitter.

"This is not the focus for EVE online the game, but CCP still holds the vision. Both me and Hilmar expressed this at fanfest."

Souns like a "no, but we are too afraid to be honest about it".


Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


Having finally passed through denial, it seems you are reaching the last stage of grief: Acceptance.

Or, you could just trash CCP some more and try to convince more players that EVE will certainly die or be killed off by a competitor if they do not produce what you want. That plan has been working really well for you thus far, just look at all of the bipartisan support you were able to muster.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1944 - 2013-09-22 14:44:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
handbanana wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Flamespar wrote:
Just got this from CCP Seagul on twitter.

"This is not the focus for EVE online the game, but CCP still holds the vision. Both me and Hilmar expressed this at fanfest."

Souns like a "no, but we are too afraid to be honest about it".


Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


Having finally passed through denial, it seems you are reaching the last stage of grief: Acceptance.

Or, you could just trash CCP some more and try to convince more players that EVE will certainly die or be killed off by a competitor if they do not produce what you want. That plan has been working really well for you thus far, just look at all of the bipartisan support you were able to muster.


CCP had enough, their reaction was dissapointing, so it's just to play the game in current form or not give a damn about it and the future of EVE, just to pass the time until the subscription ends. "Vision" stuff is overrated.

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#1945 - 2013-09-22 15:11:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
handbanana wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Flamespar wrote:
Just got this from CCP Seagul on twitter.

"This is not the focus for EVE online the game, but CCP still holds the vision. Both me and Hilmar expressed this at fanfest."

Souns like a "no, but we are too afraid to be honest about it".


Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


Having finally passed through denial, it seems you are reaching the last stage of grief: Acceptance.

Or, you could just trash CCP some more and try to convince more players that EVE will certainly die or be killed off by a competitor if they do not produce what you want. That plan has been working really well for you thus far, just look at all of the bipartisan support you were able to muster.


At least I am not being mean to other people to serve myself.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#1946 - 2013-09-22 15:17:57 UTC
Flamespar wrote:

Especially since time and time again CCP have been told to be clear and unambiguous in their communications with players.


Apparently that is a problem even within the company.

Anonymous Employee wrote:
The lack of communication and transparency can be quite frustrating. Managers tend to hide things from the staff and are more reactive than proactive. The company has asked for trust yet has done nothing but hide facts and information from the staff to create a level of distrust and anxiety never seen before.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1947 - 2013-09-22 15:37:23 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
handbanana wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Flamespar wrote:
Just got this from CCP Seagul on twitter.

"This is not the focus for EVE online the game, but CCP still holds the vision. Both me and Hilmar expressed this at fanfest."

Souns like a "no, but we are too afraid to be honest about it".


Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


Having finally passed through denial, it seems you are reaching the last stage of grief: Acceptance.

Or, you could just trash CCP some more and try to convince more players that EVE will certainly die or be killed off by a competitor if they do not produce what you want. That plan has been working really well for you thus far, just look at all of the bipartisan support you were able to muster.


At least I am not being mean to other people to feel better about myself.


I see you bounced right back to denial again. If painting me as some big meanie is what you need to believe to keep your bubble from bursting, I may have grossly underestimated the extent of your grief.

Mean old handbanana... bad puppy.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#1948 - 2013-09-22 15:48:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Shalua Rui
handbanana wrote:
I see you bounced right back to denial again. If painting me as some big meanie is what you need to believe to keep your bubble from bursting, I may have grossly underestimated the extent of your grief.

Mean old handbanana... bad puppy.

Well, as a staunch defender of EVE, you aught to know a thing or two about denial I recon, no? Blink

I'm not saying one game or the other will kill EVE... I also don't thing the game will die at all, any time soon... all I'm saying is, the game stagnates... again... and it is so by design... doesn't take a genius to see that this will result in problems sooner or later.

I, for one, know for myself, that should SC and/or Elite Dangerous turn out to be the better, more complete scifie experiences, I will put good old Shali to rest and start over somewhere else...

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Taiwanistan
#1949 - 2013-09-22 15:50:11 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:

Yay, sounds like "no avatar gameplay in EVE online the game". But then, if I can't take Ishtanchuk (THIS Ishtanchuk, 4 years, 7 months and 13 days old, 66 million skillpoints) to a walk in EVE Online, the game I've given 5 years and 900+ euros, what's in it to me?

No matter if they made EVE Fuckingawezome: Walking in New Eden, my commitment/attachment is to my EVE characters, and in case I looked for other games to use these or other characters, for f*ck's ake! Those would not be any games from a company that cheated on me! Lol

It's CCP nonsense to the point of absurd.


now that's some quality tears, oh ccp come on now stop griefing lol

TA on wis: "when we have a feature that is its own functional ecosystem of gameplay then hooks into the greater ecosystem of EVE as a whole, and it provides good replayability."
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#1950 - 2013-09-22 16:02:32 UTC
Arduemont wrote:
Flamespar wrote:

Especially since time and time again CCP have been told to be clear and unambiguous in their communications with players.


Apparently that is a problem even within the company.

Anonymous Employee wrote:
The lack of communication and transparency can be quite frustrating. Managers tend to hide things from the staff and are more reactive than proactive. The company has asked for trust yet has done nothing but hide facts and information from the staff to create a level of distrust and anxiety never seen before.


Well, CCP is a funny company. You may notice how the lack of middle rank controllers is a chronical peeve of reviewers since 2006, even although CCP implemented SCRUM since Incarnageddon (2011) and SCRUM relies heavily on middle rank controllers to prevent chaos and ensure that development goals are achieved... Lol

So far, EVE development is a rat race, where some rats may run accidentally in the same direction and then the top brass will draw a line in that direction, label it "Goal" an begin hyping the next expansion.

Doing anything else would require middle ranks, you know, those higher paid dudes telling the sprint teams what to do (so authoritarian!) and the top guys what's going wrong (so pessimistic!) and assigning help to teams who run into trouble (so not HTFU!) and even making sure that team A is not taking down what team B is doing (so not funny!).

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1951 - 2013-09-22 16:03:25 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
handbanana wrote:
I see you bounced right back to denial again. If painting me as some big meanie is what you need to believe to keep your bubble from bursting, I may have grossly underestimated the extent of your grief.

Mean old handbanana... bad puppy.

Well, as a staunch defender of EVE...


[citation needed]

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#1952 - 2013-09-22 16:13:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Shalua Rui
handbanana wrote:
[citation needed]

*looks back over the last couple of pages* ...no, you don't.

Then again, I can never tell if "you people" are really defending the game, or just, out of pronciple, trolling people that have other opinions then you... Blink

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#1953 - 2013-09-22 16:22:22 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
This Anonymous Employee person's statements somehow sound more honest than the speeches coming from other CCP people.

Anonymous Employee for president \o/
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1954 - 2013-09-22 16:22:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Bagrat Skalski
We, players, can't defend the CCP, or the game. Even when we will shoot Jita. You know they didn't do anything with the NEX store right? Only CCP is able to defend their game, by the development and communication with players. Now they didn't developed WIS, and are not going to do it, and "visions" were good in 2006, not post Incarna. Somebody need to realize it here and in CCP. We were told, no WIS, so "visions" of it are meaningless.

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1955 - 2013-09-22 16:40:57 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
handbanana wrote:
[citation needed]

*looks back over the last couple of pages* ...no, you don't.

Then again, I can never tell if "you people" are really defending the game, or just, out of pronciple, trolling people that have other opinions then you... Blink


Common mistake that, labeling people who do not agree with you as trolls and then using that as the justification to dismiss their opinions.

CCP can defend themselves if necessary, they don't need me for that and I have no interest in doing so. Besides, their attempts at damage control after they screw-up are often very amusing.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#1956 - 2013-09-22 16:48:11 UTC
raven666wings wrote:
This Anonymous Employee person's statements somehow sound more honest than the speeches coming from other CCP people.

Anonymous Employee for president \o/


Well, until today I hesitated to bring that stuff here, because candid reviews are a tricky tool. But I am used to browse through such reviews because of my trade (Tripadvisor is one of my tools, and you better learn to cut through bullshit there! Lol ) so, albeit some of the reviews are dubious, what's left paints a inner view which is coherent with the outside view.

Being honest, waiting to finish WoD and then make a EVE themed avatar game based on what they learn from WoD is a sensible thing to do... but it's third to make a EVE- themed avatar game instead of a WoD one, which in turn is second to build avatar content into the core game after promising it for 5 years.

It was THEIR idea to have avatar gameplay in EVE, not ours. Certainly I didn't joined the game for avatars, but i quickly learned of them and was very excited... enough to start this character with WiS in mind, waiting to see her walk in stations Soon (TM).

Now CCP is not honoring that and they have a ingame featureless feature which is both a fantastic teaser and a horrendous lie, and anyway we still don't know what's the Hallelujah plan to keep internet spaceships interesting after 10 years.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1957 - 2013-09-22 16:52:57 UTC
Seagull answer is clear, no WIS in EVE online, all they have is vision of many games, all located in New Eden. o/

Custom ship skins, character creator style "repaint". Bring it!
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#1958 - 2013-09-22 19:32:52 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
I too have visions when I look at those many games, visions of regret.
Tanthalassa
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1959 - 2013-09-22 19:33:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanthalassa
There's also a possibility that CCP simply denies that it has any plans for WiS for one simple reason - the cries and sheer amount of rage as a result of the likes of Rhes and Co. That WiS demo cost them 20% layoffs, but if nothing is released in relation to avatar game play, they'll still retain plenty of customers, simply because of people being attached to the characters. The skill system is ideal in that regard.

Then again if they still continued working on WiS or anything related, noone should expect it coming any time Soon(TM) or any amount of Soon(TM)s for that matter Lol

Even before reading those employee reviews everyone playing Eve for some time should know that this game developer loves to "reinvent the wheel."

They won't tell us whether they are scraping WiS development or not, because they want both opponents and proponents subbed for the most time.

As long as there's any hope left for both sides of the argument it is a win-win for CCP.
Ariel Dawn
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1960 - 2013-09-22 19:54:14 UTC
WiS/Incarna like stuff however is needed in order to keep EVE relevant and prevent it from becoming stagnant. Ship balancing for the last 2 years has been nice, but in terms of game-change mechanics that keep players interested in their product, new stuff has been very, very minimal. Refinement can only go so far.

Look at WoW, their system of "level cap and bunch of raids" has worked well for them, but it's starting to fail as people are tired of the same content dressed up in different graphics.

Plus, people on the forums are always the loudest/cry the most. If you ask the average normal EVE player, they'll tell you that they would have liked more stuff along the lines of Incarna if it was delivered properly. A single room with no player interaction was a flop; if they had introduced bars, mini-games or relevant activities along side of it then it would have been a completely different ball game.