EVE General Discussion

Well, there are two ways to add "meaningful gameplay". One is in a single stride, Jesus-feature, with masive assets and stuff.

Other is in a humbler way, better fit to the actual resources.

We can build a big cart (the Prototype) and wait to find a horse to drag it, or we can agree that all that's left in the farm is a dog so better we make a smaller cart for starters.

That's my gripe, some players would be happy just having 2 avatars in our prison cells (maybe even 3), and yet we must wait until you can afford to build a whole space station -quite litherally- to kill each other -that original, never seen before activity in EVE- and then maybe we're allowed to create our own content w/o waiting for you to hand it in a platter.

"Meaningful gameplay" are such loaded words. "Meaningful" to whom? To the FW PvPrs who got a whole bunch of clothes for their exclusive use? Or to the people who wrote 10,000 posts about rating the avatar above?

Don't be mistaken: I also would like to see "meaningful gameplay" instead of a glorified chat, but, what's "meaningful" again? How "meaningful" is the Prototype to soloers and casuals? How "meaningful" to hiseccers, carebears or PvErs? Why should someone stop doing FiS PvP to start doing WiS PvP?

I already suggested a way to allow players to trigger events through NPCs (as much as nullsec is about blowing structures), whose assets could be escalable (it could start litherally with the existing CQ) and evolve into something quite sophisticate through mechanics alone. A "meaningful gameplay" that involved people and not ships.

It's not about finding time and a horse to drag that big Prototype cart. Maybe we could just build a dog-sized cart...

There's a huge difference between code that is written on a shoestring budget and quite often in semi-panic mode to get it to solve a single issue and code that is written to be maintainable and reusable.

The latter stands the test of time quite well.

And that is what Carbon is all about, getting rid of old yucky code and bit by bit turning a hard-coded game into a generic game engine.

The avatar part of Carbon wasn't mainly created to solve anything within EvE. It was created because WoD needed it.
But in line with the Carbonification of EvE it was (at least initially) coded to be part of the generic engine.

If CQ was intended as a nice way to use the shared code or if it just was a blatant attempt to use EvE-players to alpha test it is up to everyone to judge for them self.

But keep in mind that it's a tiny little bit of Carbon, the majority of the effort they've invested is stuff that we use every single day no matter what we do.

It's recoded database handling and structure, new UI framework, client/server communication, huge amounts of optimising performance and tons of other "invisible" stuff.

So the effort isn't wasted in any way shape or form.

If the limited CQ/Avatar part of it is still used in WoD or if it's wasted will remain unknown outside of CCP until we get the first demos of WoD.

Overcomplicated goals. I'll be more than happy to be able to just walk in common station halls along with other players, see through station windows (ships and battles outside) and interact with basic station services. And I'd pay for such expansion.

the problem as i see it with avatar gameplay is the tech was so advanced and most eve players use old xp comps and they would not be compatible with avatar gameplay...

so untill the average eve player upgrades thier comps it would be superflous to take the time to make meaningfull avatar gameplay...

but yes i would love to see this done in the future...

I think his point was that to go anywhere beyond the current state is going to require significant resources to develop/impliment... even if it were kept relatively basic. It seems doubtful they will get those resources put at their disposal unless they have a plan to make that investment in time and resources meaningful to the game, as it likely would involve almost as much to develop something relatively trivial.

I know what you are saying, anything is better than nothing, but truthfully any investment of significant resources will bear intense scruitiny from the players... and anything created that isn't somewhat meaningful will be ripped apart by the rest of the player base. We'd be pretty much right back where we started, making sacrifices to the rest of the game with no worthwhile payoff for the effort.

I really hate to say I'd rather wait, but I'd prefer it gets the attention it deserves... and I'd MUCH prefer that when all is said and done that CCP receives praise for their efforts instead of flames.

What Deborah said. I'd really love it if EVE got more support and more iteration out of the subscriptions paying for it. I know that's not 100% possible? But surely if that WoD/DUST avatar stuff is Carbonized...?

Point being, aside from some mostly completed tidbits like clothing, there isn't anything that CAN be developed until some significant resources are devoted to it.

Not to make too big a point of this, but I'd hardly call the last few expansions we have seen "a few fixes and tweaks".

Hopefully Fanfest will provide a clearer picture of the likely time table for this work.

Well, WiS as "new gameplay" faces a serious trhreat of being blown to smitherens by nullsec opposition, roughly as happeend with Incursions, if it as much as is "meaningful" to FiS.

The obvious solution is to not make it compete with FiS, but hey, that would be truly original (= "not meaningful"). Setting goals that don't end up asploding a ship? Heh. Go play something else.

I kind of doubt wreck diving combat would involve losing a ship, unless it was the ship you arrived in if left vulnerable. Instead I imagine the only thing at risk would be your clone, implants and equipment.

I'm not subbed, in case you wonder. CCP has been devaluating the cost of subcription to a point where having a recurring sub is a waste, I can just wait for offers to come and play for 10 euros a month.

So no, I'm not quitting, as I already did that on October. Now, there's a couple games I want to give a try when I grow tired with EVE again so probably i'll be around until Odyssey or the new EP.