These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Team Avatar and the future of our prototype

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#2361 - 2013-10-01 20:11:36 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
You goonsheep whined so much and threatened to unsub permanently upon Incarna release and got a team fired who was actually working on EVE content. Now are quiet and playing ball watching them waste money and resources on side games. Should have done it to Dust/WoD/Valkyrie dev teams not Carbon. Quit being hypocrites thatz bad fo yo health.


Speaking of hypocrisy, a lot more players than just some goons quit (not threatened to quit), enough that it caused CCP to reassess it's financial outlook and staffing levels. But please, do go on with your goonspiracies and chewing your tinfoil, goons only make-up approx 2-3% of players today, less back then. If the estimated loss of players was 10%, that's 4 times as many goons then there are now. To quote Jesse Pinkman: "There ain't that many smurfs in the world."

As has been explained to you and others several times, players threatening to quit are irrelevant, players who actually do quit, are the ones speaking in terms that CCP notices and acts upon. You want CCP to take notice of you, stop giving them money and plexing your account.

The man at the top even told you so: "we will watch what they do, not what they say...."


Let me quote myself....

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
albeit Incarnageddon was a disaster, 2011 was CCP's best year in terms of increased revenue and comprehensive income.


PCU tells the same story, 2011 was a magnificent year right until Incarna. And then everything has been mediocre after it, despite the assumed truth that the following expansions have been of the best ever... just they barely are keeping up Incarna's numbers, and can't dream to boost income as Incursion+Incarna did.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Crasniya
The Aussienauts
#2362 - 2013-10-01 20:15:12 UTC
We aren't asking for spaceships content to go away (as little as CCP is actually releasing for it). We're asking for like 10% Walking-in-Stations. Your patch notes should be like three pages of spaceships with a paragraph for avatars.

But as long as people like Rhes have a tantrum every time CCP does anything new, CCP is held back. I half wonder if DUST and Valkyrie are loved by CCP devs as chances to do unshackled development. EVE players cry if anything changes, so the devs have to go out and work on something altogether new, rather than improving EVE. Even spaceship content is now held back by players who are unwilling to embrace new and better concepts for the game.

Soraya Xel - Council of Planetary Management 1 - soraya@biomassed.net
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#2363 - 2013-10-01 20:18:28 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
You goonsheep whined so much and threatened to unsub permanently upon Incarna release and got a team fired who was actually working on EVE content. Now are quiet and playing ball watching them waste money and resources on side games. Should have done it to Dust/WoD/Valkyrie dev teams not Carbon. Quit being hypocrites thatz bad fo yo health.


Speaking of hypocrisy, a lot more players than just some goons quit (not threatened to quit), enough that it caused CCP to reassess it's financial outlook and staffing levels. But please, do go on with your goonspiracies and chewing your tinfoil, goons only make-up approx 2-3% of players today, less back then. If the estimated loss of players was 10%, that's 4 times as many goons then there are now. To quote Jesse Pinkman: "There ain't that many smurfs in the world."

As has been explained to you and others several times, players threatening to quit are irrelevant, players who actually do quit, are the ones speaking in terms that CCP notices and acts upon. You want CCP to take notice of you, stop giving them money and plexing your account.

The man at the top even told you so: "we will watch what they do, not what they say...."


Let me quote myself....

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
albeit Incarnageddon was a disaster, 2011 was CCP's best year in terms of increased revenue and comprehensive income.


PCU tells the same story, 2011 was a magnificent year right until Incarna. And then everything has been mediocre after it, despite the assumed truth that the following expansions have been of the best ever... just they barely are keeping up Incarna's numbers, and can't dream to boost income as Incursion+Incarna did.


What does that have to do with "grrr goons" and my rebuttal to that nonsense?

Or are you just responding to posts with anything now?

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#2364 - 2013-10-01 20:30:07 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
You goonsheep whined so much and threatened to unsub permanently upon Incarna release and got a team fired who was actually working on EVE content. Now are quiet and playing ball watching them waste money and resources on side games. Should have done it to Dust/WoD/Valkyrie dev teams not Carbon. Quit being hypocrites thatz bad fo yo health.


Speaking of hypocrisy, a lot more players than just some goons quit (not threatened to quit), enough that it caused CCP to reassess it's financial outlook and staffing levels. But please, do go on with your goonspiracies and chewing your tinfoil, goons only make-up approx 2-3% of players today, less back then. If the estimated loss of players was 10%, that's 4 times as many goons then there are now. To quote Jesse Pinkman: "There ain't that many smurfs in the world."

As has been explained to you and others several times, players threatening to quit are irrelevant, players who actually do quit, are the ones speaking in terms that CCP notices and acts upon. You want CCP to take notice of you, stop giving them money and plexing your account.

The man at the top even told you so: "we will watch what they do, not what they say...."


Let me quote myself....

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
albeit Incarnageddon was a disaster, 2011 was CCP's best year in terms of increased revenue and comprehensive income.


PCU tells the same story, 2011 was a magnificent year right until Incarna. And then everything has been mediocre after it, despite the assumed truth that the following expansions have been of the best ever... just they barely are keeping up Incarna's numbers, and can't dream to boost income as Incursion+Incarna did.


What does that have to do with "grrr goons" and my rebuttal to that nonsense?

Or are you just responding to posts with anything now?


The fact that 2011 was CCP's best year casts a different light on the whole post-Incarna issue. And the poor performance of everything since also casts a different light on the benefits of preaching to the choir in terms of game development.

There is no need that we quit personally when the people who should be enthusiastic (and often, they are) about CCP's way of developing EVE since 2011, actually are not doing CCP any financial favor.

WE don't give them our money (buy PLEXes with amassed ISK, unsub, or take comeback offers with juicy discounts), and YOU aren't doing it neither...

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#2365 - 2013-10-01 20:37:13 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
What does that have to do with "grrr goons" and my rebuttal to that nonsense?

Goons? Goons are of no consequence... but the name has become quite a synonym for a very vocal, very conservative group of players that are, out of principle against any changes to "their EVE"... not because they actually care about the game, mind you, but because they care about their questionable position of superiority within it's community... to what lengths these people go can be seen every day, right here in the forums... that's why they spend hours and hours of bashing down critics and undermining discussions.

...that's what bleating goonsheeps are ...and they are quite predictable, and rather funny to watch, actually. Blink

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#2366 - 2013-10-01 20:42:03 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:

What does that have to do with "grrr goons" and my rebuttal to that nonsense?

Or are you just responding to posts with anything now?


The fact that 2011 was CCP's best year casts a different light on the whole post-Incarna issue. And the poor performance of everything since also casts a different light on the benefits of preaching to the choir in terms of game development.

There is no need that we quit personally when the people who should be enthusiastic (and often, they are) about CCP's way of developing EVE since 2011, actually are not doing CCP any financial favor.

WE don't give them our money (buy PLEXes with amassed ISK, unsub, or take comeback offers with juicy discounts), and YOU aren't doing it neither...


Wat™?

Maybe it's time to refill your meds again or take some deep breaths, but I'm not that kind of doctor. Perhaps then you can refute the points I actually made using coherent sentences (sans gibberish) and we can later discuss when you aren't so hysterical.



☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2367 - 2013-10-01 20:54:14 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Crasniya wrote:
But balancing has nothing to do with WiS, WiS is a completely different type of effort, and would not harm subscriptions, as long as CCP continued to rebalance and iterate spaceship gameplay.


I don't know how I can make this concept any more simple. If they spend resources on WiS it means they are not spending those resources on real Eve content. Ship balancing is content when it means that hulls that nobody ever flies become viable options again. If you guys could stop obsessing over bathrobes and dance parties you'd see that Eve has been expanding and getting better since Incarna.


Speaking about incoherence, seems your buddy Rhes has a case of that. He keeps going on about dance parties and bathrobes when no one ever mentioned such things.
This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.  Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless
Syds Sinclair
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2368 - 2013-10-01 20:57:07 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Syds Sinclair wrote:
I've read some of the Star Citizen devblogs. I gather that they have procured approximately 20m dollars for their game development.

Things are not looking good.

Prediction: SC will fall on its face. 6 months in - become Freemium. 1.5 years in - close the servers and pocket some cash.

Oh 'come on, atleast be an educated troll, hm?

First: The budget it totally irrelevant... EVE's development only took 2.6 mil.

Second: SC has no subscription fees, only a chash shop, that offers nothing that cannot be bought with ingame cradits.
What the game already has, however, are 260k backers that pledged an average of 60$... and all those will be players.


Eve's development only took 2.6m you say? Seems about right, as Eve ten years ago was a giant piece of crap. What it DID do right, though, was be a no rules sandbox when there was no other no rules sandboxes around.

SC's 20m, no subscription (lol F2P already, those games do great) and entering a field with a giant (Eve), I think my statement holds true. SC is in trouble.

Good luck to them.

Only time will tell, but get ready for a big fat I told ya so.

♠ Sinclair Consulting ♠
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#2369 - 2013-10-01 20:59:26 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Doc Fury wrote:
What does that have to do with "grrr goons" and my rebuttal to that nonsense?

Goons? Goons are of no consequence... but the name has become quite a synonym for a very vocal, very conservative group of players that are, out of principle against any changes to "their EVE"... not because they actually care about the game, mind you, but because they care about their questionable position of superiority within it's community... to what lengths these people go can be seen every day, right here in the forums... that's why they spend hours and hours of bashing down critics and undermining discussions.

...that's what bleating goonsheeps are ...and they are quite predictable, and rather funny to watch, actually. Blink


Um, O.K...

The question was not directed at you, nor did you provide any new or clarifying information to refute the tinfoil accusations made by your delusional counterpart. C O N T E X T, please look up that word. I am very well aware of who goons are and what they do, thank you. I've been here longer then you and them both. Yes, there once was EVE without goons.

Some of you seem to be getting so worked up, you just start posting whatever random crap crosses your mind whether it is on topic or not.

☼

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#2370 - 2013-10-01 21:04:02 UTC
Syds Sinclair wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Syds Sinclair wrote:
I've read some of the Star Citizen devblogs. I gather that they have procured approximately 20m dollars for their game development.

Things are not looking good.

Prediction: SC will fall on its face. 6 months in - become Freemium. 1.5 years in - close the servers and pocket some cash.

Oh 'come on, atleast be an educated troll, hm?

First: The budget it totally irrelevant... EVE's development only took 2.6 mil.

Second: SC has no subscription fees, only a chash shop, that offers nothing that cannot be bought with ingame cradits.
What the game already has, however, are 260k backers that pledged an average of 60$... and all those will be players.


Eve's development only took 2.6m you say? Seems about right, as Eve ten years ago was a giant piece of crap. What it DID do right, though, was be a no rules sandbox when there was no other no rules sandboxes around.

SC's 20m, no subscription (lol F2P already, those games do great) and entering a field with a giant (Eve), I think my statement holds true. SC is in trouble.

Good luck to them.

Only time will tell, but get ready for a big fat I told ya so.


CCP is a one-hit wonder. Chris Roberts is Tom Jones. Lol

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#2371 - 2013-10-01 21:06:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Shalua Rui
Syds Sinclair wrote:
[quote=Shalua Rui]Only time will tell, but get ready for a big fat I told ya so.

Maybe... although, EVE is hardly a giant, with it's meager ~20 k players and it's highly specialized game play model and extremely unwelcoming community... not exactly my observation, but the general consensus one get's when mentioning the game to other people. Blink

So, if anything, EVE is in trouble... but then again, it has been for years... sometimes more, sometimes less. *shrugs*

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Syds Sinclair
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2372 - 2013-10-01 21:10:31 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Syds Sinclair wrote:
[quote=Shalua Rui]Only time will tell, but get ready for a big fat I told ya so.

Maybe... although, EVE is hardly a giant, with it's meager ~20 k players and it's highly specialized game play model and extremely unwelcoming community... not exactly my observation, but the general consensus one get's when mentioning the game to other people. Blink

So, if anything, EVE is in trouble... but then again, it has been for years... sometimes more, sometimes less. *shrugs*


..Ok. Let's end it on that.

♠ Sinclair Consulting ♠
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#2373 - 2013-10-01 21:15:41 UTC
Well...

This is productive.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2374 - 2013-10-01 21:36:36 UTC
Crasniya wrote:
I support ship balancing. Ship balancing requires one guy. How many devs does CCP have?


This is a shockingly ignorant comment. Do you understand how difficult it is to balance things in complex competitive online games? Even then, ship balancing isn't the only thing being done in the expansion.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Crasniya
The Aussienauts
#2375 - 2013-10-01 21:40:43 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Crasniya wrote:
I support ship balancing. Ship balancing requires one guy. How many devs does CCP have?


This is a shockingly ignorant comment. Do you understand how difficult it is to balance things in complex competitive online games? Even then, ship balancing isn't the only thing being done in the expansion.


Yes, we got two ships, ... four deployable space objects, I believe, and an achievement system that isn't cool enough to offer any cool achievements.

Soraya Xel - Council of Planetary Management 1 - soraya@biomassed.net
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2376 - 2013-10-01 21:45:17 UTC
Crasniya wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Crasniya wrote:
I support ship balancing. Ship balancing requires one guy. How many devs does CCP have?


This is a shockingly ignorant comment. Do you understand how difficult it is to balance things in complex competitive online games? Even then, ship balancing isn't the only thing being done in the expansion.


Yes, we got two ships, ... four deployable space objects, I believe, and an achievement system that isn't cool enough to offer any cool achievements.


You forgot about high sec POCOs. The content generation from that alone was enough to make me happy about the expansion. You also missed the first part of CCP Seagull's intro where she explained that Rubicon is the first step in the next phase of the game where the great empires will be assaulted by the capsuleers. You should go back and rewatch the entire announcement...good stuff there.

But I guess if all you care about is space outfits and emotes...

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Crasniya
The Aussienauts
#2377 - 2013-10-01 21:50:17 UTC
Rhes wrote:
You forgot about high sec POCOs. The content generation from that alone was enough to make me happy about the expansion. You also missed the first part of CCP Seagull's intro where she explained that Rubicon is the first step in the next phase of the game where the great empires will be assaulted by the capsuleers. You should go back and rewatch the entire announcement...good stuff there.


Oh, yes. They are making something formerly not shootable shootable. "w00t".

See, that's the thing, that's what makes YOU happy. Not the literally hundreds of millions of MMO players who think this game isn't worth $15 a month. And it really isn't. The amount of change is this expansion could be paid for by a few people buying monocles or some stupid crud, and is hardly worth the $200 a year all of us pay for it.

The game is horribly static, because any time CCP wants to introduce something that truly adds gameplay, people like you cry about it.

Soraya Xel - Council of Planetary Management 1 - soraya@biomassed.net
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#2378 - 2013-10-01 21:53:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Arduemont
Rhes wrote:
You also missed the first part of CCP Seagull's intro where she explained that Rubicon is the first step in the next phase of the game where the great empires will be assaulted by the capsuleers. You should go back and rewatch the entire announcement...good stuff there.


You didn't buy that did you?

As for the POCOs. Sure, it will make things interesting for a little while. But it's not new content. They did the same for lowsec a good while ago now. All they've probably done is run an SQL statement.

Some Dev wrote:
UPDATE PocoTable SET IsDestroyable=true;

Done, lovely job.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2379 - 2013-10-01 22:15:19 UTC
Crasniya wrote:
The game is horribly static, because any time CCP wants to introduce something that truly adds gameplay, people like you cry about it.


I'm not the one in this thread crying. I staged my protest during the summer of rage and got what I wanted and I'm happy with the direction the game is taking.

Team Avatar doesn't exist anymore and WiS wasn't even mentioned in the expansion announcement. It's time for those of you who can't live without more WiS nonsense to actually do something about it. If there as many of you as you seem to think somebody at CCP will notice all of your subscription cancellations.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#2380 - 2013-10-01 22:41:53 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Doc Fury wrote:

Speaking of hypocrisy, a lot more players than just some goons quit (not threatened to quit), enough that it caused CCP to reassess it's financial outlook and staffing levels.


Brah, you and your herd should be doing Summers of Tantrum this year when they launched Dust514 and next year when they launch Valkyrie, not when they launched Incarna. Worse than releasing unfinished content to the game you pay for is only halting the work on it to make other games.