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[Skill Prereq Tweaks] AWU and more!

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Caleb Seremshur
Commando Guri
Guristas Pirates
#41 - 2016-05-30 04:57:28 UTC
Suitonia wrote:
Can you reduce the prerequisites for Guided Missile Precision from Missile Launcher Operation 5 to level 4 too while you're here. All the gunnery support skills are unlocked from Gunnery 5, and only Gunnery 5 is required for Battleship guns, which is true for Battleship missile types too with MLO 5 but it currently is a huge road block for new missile characters as it's the most important application skill and it's walled away.


Bu bu but muh legacy game design.

Stop streamlining my experience you philistine
Eddie Beeblebrox
Unreasonable Neighbours
Hole Control
#42 - 2016-05-30 05:47:53 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

Why?
Lugh Crow-Slave
#43 - 2016-05-30 05:50:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Lugh Crow-Slave
Eddie Beeblebrox wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

Why?


because this way it is not so much easier to train missiles over turrets

this will be a big help to training caldari rail boats in particular

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#44 - 2016-05-30 07:13:41 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

I'd like to see characters able to undock T2 ships with racial ship skill 1 and T2 ship skill 1 and absolute level 1 fitting requirements across the board for a very paper thin ship as a rope-to-hang-oneself type of thing, and any move in that direction is good by me.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Danetta Valens
Phayder Research
#45 - 2016-05-30 07:57:05 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

I'd like to see characters able to undock T2 ships with racial ship skill 1 and T2 ship skill 1 and absolute level 1 fitting requirements across the board for a very paper thin ship as a rope-to-hang-oneself type of thing, and any move in that direction is good by me.

Absolutely agreed.
That way people still will train these skills up to 5 because of bonuses, newbros will not be forced to wait for a 3+ months for their covops/inty/recon/etc.
Primary This Rifter
Mutual Fund of the Something
#46 - 2016-05-30 08:10:37 UTC
Danetta Valens wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

I'd like to see characters able to undock T2 ships with racial ship skill 1 and T2 ship skill 1 and absolute level 1 fitting requirements across the board for a very paper thin ship as a rope-to-hang-oneself type of thing, and any move in that direction is good by me.

Absolutely agreed.
That way people still will train these skills up to 5 because of bonuses, newbros will not be forced to wait for a 3+ months for their covops/inty/recon/etc.

Covops or inty takes less than two weeks.
Danetta Valens
Phayder Research
#47 - 2016-05-30 08:15:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Danetta Valens
Primary This Rifter wrote:
Danetta Valens wrote:
Rain6637 wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hey folks. Just got a small change today about which I want to start gathering feedback.

We're planning on reducing the prereqs for training the Advanced Weapon Upgrades skill from it's current level of Weapon Upgrades 5, to require Weapon Upgrades 4 instead.

If we go forward with it, this change would likely come in our 118.6 release at the end of June.

I have a feeling that the feedback here will be mostly positive, but I'm definitely interested in hearing what you think either way.
Thanks!

I'd like to see characters able to undock T2 ships with racial ship skill 1 and T2 ship skill 1 and absolute level 1 fitting requirements across the board for a very paper thin ship as a rope-to-hang-oneself type of thing, and any move in that direction is good by me.

Absolutely agreed.
That way people still will train these skills up to 5 because of bonuses, newbros will not be forced to wait for a 3+ months for their covops/inty/recon/etc.

Covops or inty takes less than two weeks.

You also need an evasive man / grid upgrades for no reason.
Anyway, numbers may not be accurate, but it's still an issue.
On the way of training these ships you have zero progression. You will hear "skill training completed" but it does nothing except an announcement. T2 ships SHOULD be flyable with racial frigate at level 1 aswell as inty should not have evasive maneuvering V as prereq, level IV is enough. Evasive maneuvering is skill with sufficient per-level bonus.
Eternity Mistseeker
Renegades of Eve
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#48 - 2016-05-30 08:51:39 UTC
Weapons Upgrades 5 was always a pain as you really did not care, you just wanted the weapons power grid reductions to make your fit.

Weapons Upgrades should have prerequisites Gunnery 4 and CPU Management 4, Advanced Weapons Upgrades should have prerequisites Gunnery 4 and Power Grid Management 4.

Weapons Upgrades should be increased from a 2x (because i have an evil side and it makes HACs a bit more effort), and Advanced Weapons Upgrades kept at 6x.

Oh and rename as well.
Arcturus Ursidae
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#49 - 2016-05-30 09:04:14 UTC
Make it weapon upgrades 3. It's new players that This will affect the most, may as well give them a bit of CPU and power grid reduction in less than a day.

Yes to renaming slightly.
Abra Ka Dabra
The Protoss Protectorate
AV0IDLINGS
#50 - 2016-05-30 09:25:55 UTC
Could you please push this forward. WU V is about to start in my queue in a couple of days.

Looks like I should delay it.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#51 - 2016-05-30 09:30:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Morrigan LeSante
So you change the 9 day train prerequisite, but leave missiles with GMP & WU at their existing ranks?

I don't even.
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#52 - 2016-05-30 11:21:46 UTC
This gets the CODE. seal of approval. I'm sure we can find ways to put this change to good use.

But seriously - excellent change, especially if combined with a renaming. AWU 3 is a very important fitting skill.

I also second the request above to change the stupid +agility skill for capitals that never serves a purpose because you need it to 5 to sit in any capital. Let people sit in and pilot freighters, carriers and dreads with ASC 1-3, require 4 for JFs and 5 for supercapitals. ASC 5 will remain a desireable skill but won't be a total roadblock to experiencing capitals.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#53 - 2016-05-30 11:30:52 UTC
Yes please do this, it was a total bind to me when I was a new player to struggle to fit ships because I needed advanced Weapons Upgrade and such a long wait to do level 5 of Weapons upgrade. Very smart move and I hope you do this.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Lugh Crow-Slave
#54 - 2016-05-30 11:39:29 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
So you change the 9 day train prerequisite, but leave missiles with GMP & WU at their existing ranks?

I don't even.




what do you mean WU is at IV just like Surgical strike

GMP should be moved down though

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#55 - 2016-05-30 11:43:43 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
So you change the 9 day train prerequisite, but leave missiles with GMP & WU at their existing ranks?

I don't even.




what do you mean WU is at IV just like Surgical strike

GMP should be moved down though



Sorry, I should have realised the confusion that might cause.

Warhead upgrades. Less bonus, higher rank. GG.
Lord Valian
Aegis Victorium
The Initiative.
#56 - 2016-05-30 12:02:24 UTC
I like it! +1 from me.
BoomBoss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#57 - 2016-05-30 12:07:42 UTC  |  Edited by: BoomBoss
Why do you people point at newbro's when nerfing skill requirements? What benefit is it for them? Remember, this is not a themepark game. What you lose here is gone forever.

The skill requirements are there so they actually value something and make the correct decision on what to train and what they want.

Let the newbro's learn how to use the stuff they have learned sofar instead of making it easier for them to get to use the advanced stuff of which they have absolutely no clue how to use it, only because they could near instantly train into it.
Lord Valian
Aegis Victorium
The Initiative.
#58 - 2016-05-30 12:15:23 UTC
BoomBoss wrote:
Why do you people point at newbro's when nerfing skill requirements? What benefit is it for them? Remember, this is not a themepark game. What you lose here is gone forever.

The skill requirements are there so they actually value something and make the correct decision on what to train and what they want.

Let the newbro's learn how to use the stuff they have learned sofar instead of making it easier for them to get to use the advanced stuff of which they have absolutely no clue how to use it, only because they could near instantly train into it.


Best way to learn is getting into it and fly. Waiting 3 months to train a skill in order to train another skill is not a good system. All these changes which make the game more accessible are great in my opinion.
BoomBoss
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2016-05-30 12:25:55 UTC
Lord Valian wrote:
BoomBoss wrote:
Why do you people point at newbro's when nerfing skill requirements? What benefit is it for them? Remember, this is not a themepark game. What you lose here is gone forever.

The skill requirements are there so they actually value something and make the correct decision on what to train and what they want.

Let the newbro's learn how to use the stuff they have learned sofar instead of making it easier for them to get to use the advanced stuff of which they have absolutely no clue how to use it, only because they could near instantly train into it.


Best way to learn is getting into it and fly. Waiting 3 months to train a skill in order to train another skill is not a good system. All these changes which make the game more accessible are great in my opinion.



Advanced weapon upgrades is used for advanced battleships, dreads and above from the top of my head. What is the point of having a newbro fly one of those if they are not even capable of properly flying a frig?
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#60 - 2016-05-30 13:00:13 UTC
Greygal wrote:
Split them apart, so AWU not dependent upon WU.

At the same time, adjust the training time modifier so they have the same modifier, and it's not a terribly long train. At most should not be more than 3x imho.

And the name change suggestion above is BRILLIANT!

♥

I would second this.

Make them two independent skills both with a x2 or x3 training multiplier. There is no reason CPU should be favoured more over PG.

It is like making people train CPU Management to IV before they can inject and train PG management .