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Dev blog: Skill trading in New Eden

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Corraidhin Farsaidh
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#321 - 2016-01-18 22:01:56 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
X Minx wrote:
Sincerely really happy that CCP is implementing this.
The present skill system needs a boost and Eve being such a long standing game can result in a skill tree that 'looks' like a grind too far as a new capsuleer.

Kudos for following through.



One of the best things about eve is that its one of the few games left that doesn't cater to instant gratification


I have to say that 'following through' describes this mechanism perfectly...
Aerious
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#322 - 2016-01-18 22:02:39 UTC
Querns wrote:
Aerious wrote:
Querns wrote:
Zee Zaugg wrote:

Lots of players will lose a lot of expirience. We all had to claw our way into better ships, dying and learning along the way. When we get into capitals, unless you are laser focused, it comes from years of dedication to this game.

I had my first capital capable pilot and ship before I was more than a year old in the game. The Character Bazaar exists.



Well, leave it at that, i've bought and sold many a character this way for profit, the only reason CCP™ are smiling at skill trading is they will be able to sell the skill extractor on the new eden store and make more money, why not raise the monthly subscription and put this stupid idea to bed.

Uh, what?

The only way I can think of how this makes sense is if you're a career character trader who's angry about his business taking a hit.


LOL im doing fine on my jump freighter alts, profit!

"They worried we would eventually offer not just vanity items, but ones that would give the Haves an unfair advantage over the Have-Nots."
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#323 - 2016-01-18 22:04:20 UTC
Aerious wrote:
Querns wrote:
Aerious wrote:
Querns wrote:
Zee Zaugg wrote:

Lots of players will lose a lot of expirience. We all had to claw our way into better ships, dying and learning along the way. When we get into capitals, unless you are laser focused, it comes from years of dedication to this game.

I had my first capital capable pilot and ship before I was more than a year old in the game. The Character Bazaar exists.



Well, leave it at that, i've bought and sold many a character this way for profit, the only reason CCP™ are smiling at skill trading is they will be able to sell the skill extractor on the new eden store and make more money, why not raise the monthly subscription and put this stupid idea to bed.

Uh, what?

The only way I can think of how this makes sense is if you're a career character trader who's angry about his business taking a hit.


LOL im doing fine on my jump freighter alts, profit!

Nailed it.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
Mikron Alexarr
New Age Solutions
#324 - 2016-01-18 22:05:09 UTC
Erotisk Folkdans wrote:
Zee Zaugg wrote:

Lots of players will lose a lot of expirience. We all had to claw our way into better ships, dying and learning along the way.


Ooh I was waiting for this one. You really can't stand the thought of new players getting something you didn't get, can you? They must be denied! Please CCP, don't let new players be competitive!

They can die in their new ships and get experience just as easy. You just can't kill them as easy.

I would suggest before you fall asleep tonight, think long and hard about all those new players having fun with a little more SP. Hurts, doesn't it?

Pathetic.


As I see it, the concerns are not about being able to grind noobs into dust. There are a couple of real concerns related to the market. I understand that you might not care about those concerns. But if you read the rest of that guy's post, newbros would still be able to catch up. The point of his post was to limit the damage this kind of a change could do to the market.
Valkin Mordirc
#325 - 2016-01-18 22:06:59 UTC
If anyone watches Totalbiscuit's YT channel he just recently did a video on 5 Gaming related sayings he hates, Pay To Win was one of them. And made a fairly solid point that a lot of P2W games are more along the lines of Pay to Skip. Like someone not wanting to wait 20 days to have Medium blasters to V or something.


Honestly if it was P2W CCP would release Aur only ships that had stupidly powerful bonuses. Like a Diemost with a Role bonus to Scram ranges or a Moa with a 20% Shield hit point bonus.

And just like the Bazaar, all the SP is trained on the character, the only difference is you don't have to buy the toon itself for the SP, just the SP. 
#DeleteTheWeak
dravenski
Black Wormholes of Apocrypha
TOGETHER WE STAND
#326 - 2016-01-18 22:09:10 UTC
Too many negatives in the old thread, so they started new one with CCP propaganda at work...

This is a perfect idea for alliance leaders who get bil isk per month for every system they rent. They will only buy and buy more skill injectors ( yes, maybe that will cost 40 bil per million SPs, this is pocket cash for big alliances ).

Nor that I care much, because I have started selling my chars and closing my accounts since the supercap nerf series, but I think this is the worst idea of all. Players that are still in this game because they are clinging to their hard earned skills will have no reason to stay anymore.

Besides, why bother to pay subscription when you can experience 75% of all the best this game offers with an one month trial account ?
jason hill
Red vs Blue Flight Academy
#327 - 2016-01-18 22:09:54 UTC
And they are going to make a bucket load off valk they are first to market with valk.... I know this cos I'm one of them ...then they throw this into the mix ...meh
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#328 - 2016-01-18 22:10:34 UTC
Erotisk Folkdans wrote:
Zee Zaugg wrote:

Lots of players will lose a lot of expirience. We all had to claw our way into better ships, dying and learning along the way.

Ooh I was waiting for this one. You really can't stand the thought of new players getting something you didn't get, can you? They must be denied! Please CCP, don't let new players be competitive!

They can die in their new ships and get experience just as easy. You just can't kill them as easy.

I would suggest before you fall asleep tonight, think long and hard about all those new players having fun with a little more sp. Quicker than you had. Hurts, doesn't it?

Pathetic.

Ooo snap.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Valkin Mordirc
#329 - 2016-01-18 22:13:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Valkin Mordirc
Also,

If I say I want to take 5mil SP from an 80mil+ SP alt, but suddenly I decided I don't want to that, but I've already extracted the SP. Is there a refund system that will allow the SP go back into the Skills I extracted? Or is it a once you do it, there's no going back?
#DeleteTheWeak
Max Kolonko
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#330 - 2016-01-18 22:13:31 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Nana Skalski wrote:
CCP, when do you plan to ban character selling?

I presume character name change service is not talked about anywhere, because we all know why?


Never character selling costs plex and so gives them money


They will now get money from extractors, sooo....

Read and support: Don't mess with OUR WH's What is Your stance on WH stuff?
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#331 - 2016-01-18 22:13:40 UTC
Ralph Drake wrote:
Please, CCP, let us be able to remove 0-skill-points skills from our sheet. I don't want the skill book back or anything, I am just obsessive.

This whole proposal relies on existing players selling their SP - You just keep retraining those skills to sell on over and over - Or the proposal falls flat on its face in 3 months when all have sold off unwanted mining skills.

Face it, there is a finite amount of "unwanted" SP - So unless tsp's are good isk spinners (nice profits to be made) the available SP will soon deplete.




One question for Devs though; I know your mockup in the blog is just that but you are turning skills that are prerequisites for other skills into a TSP - Is this to be a thing? You can sell prerequisite skills?

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#332 - 2016-01-18 22:17:22 UTC
Max Kolonko wrote:
They will now get money from extractors, sooo....
That somehow means they would get rid of one avenue for giving them money why?
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#333 - 2016-01-18 22:19:28 UTC
Sgt Ocker wrote:
One question for Devs though; I know your mockup in the blog is just that but you are turning skills that are prerequisites for other skills into a TSP - Is this to be a thing? You can sell prerequisite skills?

Prereq skills can not be extracted.
Kisloved Algaert
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#334 - 2016-01-18 22:19:56 UTC
CCP

You can't just change the core concept of the game that deals with people's sense of value that they associate with the game.

You seriously think that mechanic would work back in 2003 making eve online what it is now? If you had made something like that back then,then you would have be in trouble by 2005 and surely be bankrupt by the emergance of P2W, F2P nonsense.

And let's not even argue about whether it is TECHNICALLY P2W. I personally do not care if it is P2W TO THE LETTER of the term.
That's just idiotic arguing about that. You are dealing with sense of value people put in the game and you don't even understand what you are doing, CCP.

It's all just calculations and statistics to you.

The world around it harsh, all those P2W, F2P trying to make a buck...

Good luck CCP!
Soleil Fournier
Fliet Pizza Delivery
Of Essence
#335 - 2016-01-18 22:21:46 UTC
Please give us the option to delete unwanted skills from our head. Maybe if the skill has 0 points allocated to it, there's a delete button to press.

Also, would like to see a cap on number of skill points a player can add. This was a popular request in the original feedback thread that the blog doesn't address.

Add time-limited skill resets for people that don't want to buy/sell their skill points but want to reallocate their own skills instead. Thank you.
Tamazaki
Doomheim
#336 - 2016-01-18 22:25:49 UTC
A Ingus wrote:
Stupidity reigns.

True, nothing lasts forever.

Thanks for all the fish.

7o

PCryEvilUghArrow


Drama queen much?

You won't leave Big smile
shaun 27
Brothers of Tyr
Goonswarm Federation
#337 - 2016-01-18 22:27:13 UTC
Well by the sounds of it they had this planned whatever the community said. I mean feb release wow so quick how long did it take to sort 0.0 oh wait its still not done most of its still blue and it didn't involve £$£$.


Gl all.
Tyberius Franklin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#338 - 2016-01-18 22:32:23 UTC
shaun 27 wrote:
Well by the sounds of it they had this planned whatever the community said. I mean feb release wow so quick how long did it take to sort 0.0 oh wait its still not done most of its still blue and it didn't involve £$£$.


Gl all.
How reasonable is it to expect CCP to design a game that both rewards cooperation and at the same time expect it to some how break up stable coalitions in the first place?

I mean really, selling SP is easy while breaking up coalitions is more like rewiring the human brain.
Jugular Vein
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#339 - 2016-01-18 22:32:27 UTC
Accounts that have had any kind of ban should be unable to extract skills, just as they are currently unable to be sold/transferred via the character bazaar.
Memphis Baas
#340 - 2016-01-18 22:34:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Memphis Baas
Training a "do it all" combat pilot:

Newbie (4 months): 5 million SP, has a number of support skills at 3, and 1 race's ships to battlecruiser.

Year 1: 20 million SP, support, T1 weapon, and T1 ship skills at 4 (int/per)
Year 2: 40 million SP, prerequisites for T2 ships trained to 5 (int/mem)
Year 3: 60 million SP, T2 weapons, a nice selection of T2 ships finally trained (per/wil)

Year 4: 80 million SP, prerequisites for carrier/dread, 1 race's dread/carrier trained to 4 (int/per)
Year 5: 100 million SP, take all the important skills for carrier/dread to 5 (jump range, T2 siege/triage, fuel, etc.) (int/mem)
Year 6: 120 million SP, multiple races' carriers / dreads, or whatever (per/wil)

There's a major breakpoint at 60 million SP / 3 years, where we are either done with T2 subcaps, or we went straight for capital ships and have 60 million SP in those, so would you please consider changing the second breakpoint from 50 million SP to 60 million SP? To match the point where we shift focus, and also the most likely "re-spec" point.


Also, veterans will buy the skill injectors as soon as they're made available on the market; prices are pretty much going to skyrocket way past what a newbie can afford. Meaning that true newbies will never be able to take advantage of this system. Would you consider implementing a donation bin similar to plex4good where we can donate injectors and have a reasonable expectation that they'll be given to actual newbies, rather than being market-speculated / overpriced?