EVE General Discussion

EvE was the game for him or her. Played EvE since launch and you're a noob in that respect. The developers who took over failed to grasp the concept of EvE and its quality the ideal have suffered since. And the developers are now suffering the consequences of that failure to keep to the spirit of the game. You think you and your ideas of what EvE is what the original team was aiming at? Toxic players and their desires are the cancer that is strangling EvE.

Hopefully CCP will realise they need to get rid of the vomit that has taken over this formerly great game and the game will flourish again. EvE doesn't need toxic meta gaming sociopaths, it needs players.

I remember back in 2004, one of the worst gankers at the time (Tank CEO) and CEO of Mo0 would come to help channel to help newbs. He was polite and there to help and so was I, even though Id happily kill anyone I came across in null or low that assholery stopped in help and on forums because at the end of he day we are playing a game and all considered toxic personalities out of game to be bad for the future of EvE and bad for our own self respect.

Be nice to go back to that and help CCP to gain subs instead of the pathetic garbage of deliberately chasing off subs because you can't differentiate between pirate in game and subscriber out of game.

Why do you care, I thought you were leaving to play Elite? you know, a game you actually think is fun.

Or was that rant a lie about letting your account lapse? Yet another feeble attempt at manipulation, and one that proves that i am right about you (that you won't leave, but would rather see EVE 'changed' to suit you)?

EVE is clearly a "pvp" game. it's not about the peole doing the shooting, a lot of people are pvping by avoiding the shooters. As another forum goer said (and i put it in my bio) "Ratting is PVE, getting away with it is pvp".

Failing to understand the PVP nature of EVE online (a game where one is vulnerable anytime they are in space, even in 'high security' space) is the number one failure of many non-pvp players. If you people really cared about non-pvprs, you'd be out there teaching them this, not on a forum complaining to CCP about pvp.

Does my leaving Eve, and what I would do if I did have any weight to the facts about this game and your lack of comprehending what Eve really is?

Your ad hominem attacks, which is always your last resort before disappearing from a conversation, are desperation in a losing argument.

Infinity Ziona just called you out, and everything he said was correct. You come here to declare that you have the ultimate understanding of the game and there is something wrong with everyone else... it has become quite clear that you are the one lacking understanding, and you have been propped up by your social circle of people who lack understanding just the same as you.

So, again, who cares if I find Elite fun, or if I leave or not... You refuted nothing about what I said, just gave salty tears and a blatant dismissal of facts to protect your imaginary vision of a game you clearly do not understand.

Define "better".

What I want is what EVE already provides. What you can't understand is that your perpetual unhappiness with the game is a personal problem, not a matter for CCP to fix. The fact that I like the game as it is is proof of that, if none of us liked the game, then you could say that EVE was a bad game.

I think it must burn you (and people like you) that people accept EVE as it is and don't have some psychological need to see it change beyond how it's naturally evolving.




Another example of your personal mental problem, namely psychological projection. I do not have an opinion on how peop-le play EVE Online. I'm a PVEr, i only do combat PVP to help my alliance or defend my pve grounds. My best in game buddies are literally MINERS. I hate mining so i don't do it, but others like it so their choice is none of my business. I dislike ganking too so I don't so it, others do and it's allowed by the rules so have at it.

How is saying "take responsibility for your choices" equate to "play in a way i find aceptable"?

The reason you keep saying "I want others to play my way" is because you know that if you acknowledge the fact that it's not true, it unravels you entire way of thinking. That's really weak man, and deep down you know it.







There is that projection again. I want CCP to keep doing what they are doing and have been doing (minus a few mistakes), provide a backdrop and infrastructure for PLAYER DRIVEN CONTENT. What you want is more themepark "give me 'content' and tell me how to do it" BS that EVE is not about. it's intensely stupid to say I will never get it, CCp is giving it to me right this second.

It's you and people like who CCP should ignore, because CCP should not be in the business of holding people's hands and spoon feeding them 'content'. We make our own content here, which is a more fulfilling experience than anything CCP could provide.

/thread

i quite enjoy doing missions tbh, the thrill of having to watch local in nullsec, the rewards of 10/10's and to be fair i make plenty of isk doing lvl 4 pirate missions, go somewhere more entertaining if you find it boring, interactivity? what do you mean?

Well said. People who complain about PVE in EVE tend to come from other games that have a different form of PVE.
eve's PVE is all about :

-Learning how to use the various tools the game gives to complete the PVE site without dying and after that, using those same tools to make completion times faster and more efficent

-Being able to withstand player interference while doing the above, and beyond that learning how to use the PVE site/mechancis themselves to help achieve this goal.


Examples of the former include things like having a deep knowledge of tanking mechanics and npc aggro mechanics to defend yourself against people who would try to stop you (like this guy almost did, it looks like an "ALOD" at 1st but it was actually a brilliant use of bling except for a couple of pilot mistakes), or using npcs to protect you while you accomplish the objective like you would do in an angel or guristas 10/10 (due to unlocked acceleration gates, which let you leave npcs alive to attack the pvp ships that might come after you) etc

One thing i notice about is that the people who complain about PVE in EVE aslo tend to be extremely horrible at PVE in EVE and don't know how to make the best of it. Coincidence? I think not

i still dont understand why people decide to play an mmo if they seek solo play and wish the game to be catered towards a single player offline game

They don't

The one thing the numbers from Quant tells us is that PVE players also play in groups and fleets...

Just to be clear, you are misinterpreting these numbers. These numbers are per character, not per player. Unless I misunderstood, they are the percent of characters that logged last month that engaged in each of those criteria criteria. Each account has three characters, and many players have multiple accounts so of course only a small fraction of each player's characters engaged in PvP during that month.

Multiply that number by 3 characters per account and the average of 1.7 accounts per player CCP Quant gave us previously and you get a number of ~70% of players engaging in ship PvP. This is likely too high as not every character on account is logged in each month (or even created), and some players have multiple PvP characters. But we don't need to guess CCP Quant already told us at the Fanfest keynote that (if you ignore the "social" players who use Eve as a IM client) ~40-50% of the player base regularly engages in PvP. If you consider firing your modules even once during the month at another player PvP (like the statistic you are citing), I would think 60-70% is not unreasonable.

Eve was conceived, designed and is still developed as a PvP game. Pretty much every player engages in some sort of PvP, and probably the majority of them shoot another player's ship at least once per month on at least one of their characters. Citing a statistic that pretty much just says that players tend to specialize only one of their characters for ship PvP, rather than having multiple alts for industry and mining, does not prove that Eve is not a PvP game. [/quote]

The point of the posting wasn't about number of players engaging in pvp, it was about time investment. It is also an extremely big assumption that people actually make use of said three accounts. It is "People who have logged in". I have all three characters used. This is main, second is my original character I made a week or so before this toon, and last is a character that I use in forums to sarcastically reply to tinfoil posts. People know it is me, I let em know even.

Because those numbers are percentage, it has zero effect on how you look at the numbers. End of the day, only about 14% of character activity is logging in. Doesn't matter if 70% of people combat pvp if they have to spend 85% of the time not doing said combat pvp.

The real PvP portion of eve is the market. It goes back to what somebody said about how Eve has changed. The core concept isn't being developed. Little features, lipstick and makeup are being put on. Hence integration. Drop the idea that eve is a combat pvp game. Eve is only a harsh game. If somebody wants to be a big military organization, they should require pve allies to run security. Ergo npcs reduce your efficiency and break down borders of your sov or something? Gets the mission runners out into null.

Have it so that highsec border systems are not the ideal location for capital manufacturing. I am not talking like how supercaps are, but change minerals and such. Figure out how to improve self sustainability so alliances establish a mining operation.

Suddenly pvp changes. People always will want to roam to take out their neighbours infrastructure and protect their own. Improve star map and add monitoring stations so players can get a more real time analysis for interceptions. The options really are endless with a much lower programming and development side.

This next statement is for Jenn

You were talking about how Eve isn't ours, that it is CCP's. Wrong business mentality. The customer is not always right, but the customer pays the bills. It is a game that has the tools and play style, social structure and such that makes me enjoy it more than other games. I personally would prefer not to take up something new because I like this one. It can be so much better though. From a developmental side, forums are a massive brainstorm. More people discussing points and ideas than CCP's who development team. They can keep doing what they think while ignoring ideas highly discussed by the gaming community and have failures though. Big and massive ideas that have a large time and cost investment without any return because they don't work or add gameplay value.

Eve has a demographic. It isn't made up of the play style CCP imagined and had in the early days of eve. Early eve was different since skills were different. High SP density was far lower, so combat was easier. Fewer players are needed to do the pve and industry to support cruiser and frig combat. Now years have passed and the demographic had changed. A few years ago it changed again when the power imbalance got to a point that the pvp competition was entirely one sided. Players left.

Jenn, your last post as of when I started writing this talked about learning the mechanics and making them more efficient. Unfortunately, those mechanics drive the player base apart. Tasks of eve are divergent, not inclusive. If a person runs pve missioning, focuses on pve missioning, and optimizes that, they get quite far and not wanting to be part of combat pve at all. Same with mining, etc. So many mission runners, so many miners. Why do we not develop that part of it to help encourage positive interaction between the different communities?