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Do not train to fly battleships
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baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#321 - 2015-06-13 12:34:32 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
Aza Ebanu wrote:
I don't count blobs as successful PVP especially when you are in a battleeship It is the easiest/safest form of EVE gameplay there is


Take a battleship on an assault frigate fleet vs tengus and live. I look forwards to seeing you try.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#322 - 2015-06-13 12:35:32 UTC
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
And as usual, baltec1 delivers the proof via video... which is apparently absolutely not admissible due to being, well... proof.
Also these vids made me want to pew with my ravens. Sadly, my alliance is all about the armor... so I'll just fit up a geddon instead.


I tried an armour raven before, very funny anti-frig ship.
Omar Alharazaad
New Eden Tech Support
#323 - 2015-06-13 12:49:43 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Omar Alharazaad wrote:
And as usual, baltec1 delivers the proof via video... which is apparently absolutely not admissible due to being, well... proof.
Also these vids made me want to pew with my ravens. Sadly, my alliance is all about the armor... so I'll just fit up a geddon instead.


I tried an armour raven before, very funny anti-frig ship.

That's just trollish.
'Shields are down! We got this! ....dafuq?!?'

Come hell or high water, this sick world will know I was here.
Stitch Kaneland
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#324 - 2015-06-13 14:32:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Stitch Kaneland
Fairly certain this has become a troll. Pretty sure he knows he's wrong probably past page 2, but keeps moving the goal posts of his arguement to keep the conversation going.

Ive provided plenty of proof as well as others that ive killed everything smaller than a BS with my BS. This includes AF, 10mn T3d, cruisers, and BC. If i had a fight with a CS, im fairly sure i could win as well, except maybe against a sleip/claymore as those are extremely powerful ships when equipped with links/implants (most are).

I am a solo BS/BC pilot that flies in LS looking for fights, fighting blobs and generally being a pain in the ass to my targets. They cannot longpoint me to hold me. With current fit, i am extremely hard to jam and probe down. They have to dedicate scram fit ships which i will quite literally vaporize in a few shots. Right now im on a 18 person kill streak and am 5th on top character on the KB for typhoon FI (was 3rd but week changed).

So the whole arguement about BS dying to smaller things everytime is wrong. When you fly your BS with t1 fittings, no skill, and even poorer understanding of game mechanics, you die. As OP has experienced.

Note: When i say solo, i mean full on solo. No scouts, no links, no blob hiding 1j out.

Give Battlecruisers range to fullfil their Anti-Cruiser role - OP SUCCESS

Make the Muninn great again!
Tusker Crazinski
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#325 - 2015-06-13 14:38:33 UTC
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


hmm 3 tornados?
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#326 - 2015-06-13 18:40:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Aza Ebanu
Let's face it. T1 battleships are not superior in any way with all the T2/T3 cruisers, battlecruisers, and frigates running around. The saddest part: a blob of smaller ships easily overwhelms them. Now blobs of medium sized hulls are the most effective, as numerous killboards demonstrate. I invite all naysayers to just look at the killboards. How many people are getting kills with battleships, vs cruiser gangs? There is a reason for this.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#327 - 2015-06-13 18:52:51 UTC
Aza Ebanu wrote:
Let's face it. T1 battleships are not superior in any way with all the T2/T3 cruisers, battlecruisers, and frigates running around. The saddest part: a blob of smaller ships easily overwhelms them. Now blobs of medium sized hulls are the most effective, as numerous killboards demonstrate. I invite all naysayers to just look at the killboards. How many people are getting kills with battleships, vs cruiser gangs? There is a reason for this.


Yet we see videos of battleships crushing said smaller ships.
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#328 - 2015-06-13 18:53:54 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Aza Ebanu wrote:
Let's face it. T1 battleships are not superior in any way with all the T2/T3 cruisers, battlecruisers, and frigates running around. The saddest part: a blob of smaller ships easily overwhelms them. Now blobs of medium sized hulls are the most effective, as numerous killboards demonstrate. I invite all naysayers to just look at the killboards. How many people are getting kills with battleships, vs cruiser gangs? There is a reason for this.


Yet we see videos of battleships crushing said smaller ships.

Yet we see killboards of cruiser sized hulls all over the place.
Valkin Mordirc
#329 - 2015-06-13 19:17:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Valkin Mordirc
Aza Ebanu wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Aza Ebanu wrote:
Let's face it. T1 battleships are not superior in any way with all the T2/T3 cruisers, battlecruisers, and frigates running around. The saddest part: a blob of smaller ships easily overwhelms them. Now blobs of medium sized hulls are the most effective, as numerous killboards demonstrate. I invite all naysayers to just look at the killboards. How many people are getting kills with battleships, vs cruiser gangs? There is a reason for this.


Yet we see videos of battleships crushing said smaller ships.

Yet we see killboards of cruiser sized hulls all over the place.


HEY. CRUISERS ARE POPULAR! WTF I DIDN'T KNOW THIS. IT'S LIKE MY LIFE IS A LIE!

And for some reason I'm specced into Cruisers...Waaiiit.

Regardless 'snark' aside.




https://beta.eve-kill.net/kill/47211135/

https://beta.eve-kill.net/kill/47217304/

https://beta.eve-kill.net/kill/47160968/


Literally the first page for Solo kills with Ravens shows kills on Cruiser,

And the only solo losses are PVE fitted Ravens.

Also! https://zkillboard.com/kill/47235026/

Sig tanking sure did save this dude. Died in two volleys.
#DeleteTheWeak
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#330 - 2015-06-13 20:18:54 UTC
Flying in a battleship means wasted ISK and time. Cruiser blobs are where the action is. Most battleships do not/ can not survive them. Almost all null sec fleets use T2/T3 crusier doctrines. Just look at the killboards.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#331 - 2015-06-13 20:59:57 UTC
Aza Ebanu wrote:
Flying in a battleship means wasted ISK and time. Cruiser blobs are where the action is. Most battleships do not/ can not survive them. Almost all null sec fleets use T2/T3 crusier doctrines. Just look at the killboards.


Im looking at the Imperium doctrines. Our main doctrine is currently Dominix fleet.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#332 - 2015-06-13 21:21:42 UTC
Tusker Crazinski wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


hmm 3 tornados?

Or one Sig tanked ishkur with a small neut.
I would not be quick but it would work.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#333 - 2015-06-13 21:27:34 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Aza Ebanu wrote:
Flying in a battleship means wasted ISK and time. Cruiser blobs are where the action is. Most battleships do not/ can not survive them. Almost all null sec fleets use T2/T3 crusier doctrines. Just look at the killboards.


Im looking at the Imperium doctrines. Our main doctrine is currently Dominix fleet.

I'm sure it is.
Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#334 - 2015-06-13 23:47:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniela Doran
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


Ashimmu and 1-2 Svipuls. You're welcome. Also works against marauders solo farming c4s.


Is that really all it takes to down a Paladin? If so then the passive Rattlers are far and away the best ships for soloing C4's.
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#335 - 2015-06-13 23:50:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Aza Ebanu
Daniela Doran wrote:
Lloyd Roses wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


Ashimmu and 1-2 Svipuls. You're welcome. Also works against marauders solo farming c4s.


Is that really all it takes to down a Paladin? If so then the passive Rattlers are far and away the best ships for soloing C4's.

But we aren't talking about t2 battleships are we?
Blackfeathers
Unholy Knights of Cthulhu
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#336 - 2015-06-13 23:56:30 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tusker Crazinski wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


hmm 3 tornados?

Or one Sig tanked ishkur with a small neut.
I would not be quick but it would work.


I don't think a small neut would be enough to turn off enough reps to make the Ishkur's dps matter. I suspect the Hype's drones or a lucky hit would finish the fight, or they'd be sitting around forever.

Nados - They don't have high enough sustained dps to kill BS's unless there are more of them.

Ashimuu + svipuls *Shrug* I guess?

In any case - I think Battleships are a viable option for training. They offer a number of things to anyone who trains them.
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#337 - 2015-06-13 23:59:19 UTC
Blackfeathers wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Tusker Crazinski wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:
At 500mil isk total, show me a solo or even 2-3man gang that can take a dual or tri-rep Hyperion.


hmm 3 tornados?

Or one Sig tanked ishkur with a small neut.
I would not be quick but it would work.


I don't think a small neut would be enough to turn off enough reps to make the Ishkur's dps matter. I suspect the Hype's drones or a lucky hit would finish the fight, or they'd be sitting around forever.

Nados - They don't have high enough sustained dps to kill BS's unless there are more of them.

Ashimuu + svipuls *Shrug* I guess?

In any case - I think Battleships are a viable option for training. They offer a number of things to anyone who trains them, like.....

Come on. I know you can complete that statement.
Blackfeathers
Unholy Knights of Cthulhu
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#338 - 2015-06-14 00:09:35 UTC
Blackfeathers wrote:

Show me a single ship that will reliably alpha enemy logistics off the field. (One shot - not 2 or 3 - if there's one logi, there will be more - so multiple shots can be repped through.)
Need a Maelstrom or Tempest for this. Mega? I dunno - I haven't done much with those.

Show me a ship that can neut out an enemy triage carrier while being focused by an enemy fleet? Need a Geddon for this, and it contributes dps or ewar drones to the fight as well.

Then there are spider tank domis... find me three ships that will tank and dps as well as those for equitable cost and skillpoint investment.

You need a T1 Battleship to AoE jam a fleet and survive. Scorpion. The alternative is many cruisers or frigs.

You need Battleships to pipe-bomb a fleet. (Unless you are going to dump caps/supers to pipe-bomb - which is far more skill / cost intensive)

You need a battleship to hit at extreme (200-250km - Entosis sov, this may become a thing) range. Rokh etc.

Then, training Battleships gets you Pirate battleships, Marauders, Blops, Faction Battleships, and leads nicely into dreads. Training cruisers won't get you those - so you need to train BS.

Battleships wouldn't be the first thing I advise a newbro to train for - they are better off training for closer goals, and work their way towards the bigger things. I would definitely have battleships on the list of things to work to - ESPECIALLY if you are planning on Null / Wormhole life.

If you are in a position where moving isn't a big option (Entosis sov? No remote reps, so that buffer is gonna be important) Battleships will hold a field far easier than frigs, cruisers, dessies or BCs. And they'll do it cheaper.

If you have the guys - anything will work. If you have a limit on the number of guys you can bring, but need to fill many roles on the fly - Battleships have the utility to do this.

I'm not terribly experienced in pvp - but these are the things I would say Battleships are needed for.

Having said that, I would like to see Battleships warp a little faster - but rigs / macharial / lowslots / implants can fix this.




These?
Daniela Doran
Doomheim
#339 - 2015-06-14 00:10:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Daniela Doran
Stitch Kaneland wrote:
Fairly certain this has become a troll. Pretty sure he knows he's wrong probably past page 2, but keeps moving the goal posts of his arguement to keep the conversation going.

Ive provided plenty of proof as well as others that ive killed everything smaller than a BS with my BS. This includes AF, 10mn T3d, cruisers, and BC. If i had a fight with a CS, im fairly sure i could win as well, except maybe against a sleip/claymore as those are extremely powerful ships when equipped with links/implants (most are).

I am a solo BS/BC pilot that flies in LS looking for fights, fighting blobs and generally being a pain in the ass to my targets. They cannot longpoint me to hold me. With current fit, i am extremely hard to jam and probe down. They have to dedicate scram fit ships which i will quite literally vaporize in a few shots. Right now im on a 18 person kill streak and am 5th on top character on the KB for typhoon FI (was 3rd but week changed).

So the whole arguement about BS dying to smaller things everytime is wrong. When you fly your BS with t1 fittings, no skill, and even poorer understanding of game mechanics, you die. As OP has experienced.

Note: When i say solo, i mean full on solo. No scouts, no links, no blob hiding 1j out.


A rare samurai eh, there are only a few people like you left in eve. Having a falcon, or logi in waiting when soloing is one thing, but a link booster is still a valid option for a true soloist, so nothing at all wrong with a link booster Stitch. My old 2012 toon died countlessly due to not having links, so today I don't go anywhere without them. Also could you send me a message in game about this statement you made "With current fit, i am extremely hard to jam and probe down". Almost everyone uses an ecm and logi ship in small gangs, please tell me how you overcome these cheap tactics when soloing in your BS/BC?
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#340 - 2015-06-14 00:13:41 UTC
Blackfeathers wrote:
Blackfeathers wrote:

Show me a single ship that will reliably alpha enemy logistics off the field. (One shot - not 2 or 3 - if there's one logi, there will be more - so multiple shots can be repped through.)
Need a Maelstrom or Tempest for this. Mega? I dunno - I haven't done much with those.

Show me a ship that can neut out an enemy triage carrier while being focused by an enemy fleet? Need a Geddon for this, and it contributes dps or ewar drones to the fight as well.

Then there are spider tank domis... find me three ships that will tank and dps as well as those for equitable cost and skillpoint investment.

You need a T1 Battleship to AoE jam a fleet and survive. Scorpion. The alternative is many cruisers or frigs.

You need Battleships to pipe-bomb a fleet. (Unless you are going to dump caps/supers to pipe-bomb - which is far more skill / cost intensive)

You need a battleship to hit at extreme (200-250km - Entosis sov, this may become a thing) range. Rokh etc.

Then, training Battleships gets you Pirate battleships, Marauders, Blops, Faction Battleships, and leads nicely into dreads. Training cruisers won't get you those - so you need to train BS.

Battleships wouldn't be the first thing I advise a newbro to train for - they are better off training for closer goals, and work their way towards the bigger things. I would definitely have battleships on the list of things to work to - ESPECIALLY if you are planning on Null / Wormhole life.

If you are in a position where moving isn't a big option (Entosis sov? No remote reps, so that buffer is gonna be important) Battleships will hold a field far easier than frigs, cruisers, dessies or BCs. And they'll do it cheaper.

If you have the guys - anything will work. If you have a limit on the number of guys you can bring, but need to fill many roles on the fly - Battleships have the utility to do this.

I'm not terribly experienced in pvp - but these are the things I would say Battleships are needed for.

Having said that, I would like to see Battleships warp a little faster - but rigs / macharial / lowslots / implants can fix this.




These?

All those thingscould be done by a T2/T3 cruiser/BC/. Besides, that requires a fleet for half of those things, and it doesn't matter what you bring to the blob.