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The Shrinking Sandbox - Eve by numbers

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Vic Jefferson
Stimulus
Rote Kapelle
#141 - 2015-04-02 22:26:45 UTC
bonkerss wrote:


lowesc is pvp light. if you want all tactical options available to you you have to do 0.0 or wh pvp.


So null has bombs and bubbles, doesn't change the fact that most actual PvPers tend to congregate in low sec where they may find an actual fight with a worthy, like-minded party. Pound for pound, player for player, I'd wager on lowsec pilots everyday against your typical null sec resident.

Vote Vic Jefferson for CSM X.....XI.....XII?
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#142 - 2015-04-03 01:23:06 UTC
xxxTRUSTxxx wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:

LOL.. the futile attempts to be funny. I hope your trying to be funny,


nope


Sgt Ocker wrote:

if not you are seriously uninformed or have just never lived in a sov nul alliance.
"An Alliance" will only need to hold their own sov if they don't have thousands of allies.


just back from over 3 years in null but you'd know that if your finger was on the pulse, but it's not is it.
so how can anyone take you serious, you're just not arsed anymore. sure you even admit to have not been in a fleet for over a year. so you're more than a little out of touch there buddy Blink

Sgt Ocker wrote:

I can understand the new players not knowing how sov works and how it will continue to work post June but your character has been around a few years. You seem to favour tagging along with blok members, although you don't belong to a sov group and somehow believe these changes are going to remove the tens of thousands of allies that monopolize sov nul.


a few years,, hahahaha feck off troll, 7 years out of 11 isn't a few and stop assuming you know what i agree with or not.

Sgt Ocker wrote:


Oh and multi quoting makes it hard to respond to your drivel, lets just say. People thought a couple thousand supers was a problem, wait till it's thousands entosis links. Nothing changes but the ship type, the ability to field infinate numbers is far more feasible than fielding the same amount of supers. AND THE BLOKS WILL STILL DOMINATE SOV, funnily enough, just as they do now.


how is it hard to respond to more than one quote? lol feckin hell you people do my **** in,, go play the game and stfu or unsub the rest of your 10 accounts and feck off.
you find it hard to respond to more than one quote but you have no problem running 10 accounts. Roll
which you expect us to believe that you paid for in cash. Roll
multiboxers are the back bone of EVE,, don't you remember saying this not so long ago.
aren't you down to 2 accounts now. not long to go before we don't see you around anymore.
or maybe you'll just HTFU and get on with it. EVE changes all the time. move with the change or die.

oh,,, and have a nice day Big smile






Is it hard being so absolutely wrong?
3 years on nul? not with the char you are posting with you haven't. 7 years in highsec with a few dashes into nul to troll others fleets.
why would I know that if I had my finger on the pusle? You are posting with an empire based toon, nothing to do with nulsec, except a few troll kills and losses.

It is hard to respond because you spread out your jokes over so many individual quotes and half need to be deleted to reply..

Eve changes all the time? What has changed as far as nulsec goes recently, except one of the bloks decided to evict yet another unaligned alliance from their sov. What do you think will change post June?

You want credibility? Your not getting it by posting with a nobody toon and expecting people "with their finger on the pulse" to know you.

All I see here is a highsec pubbie who "thinks" he knows whats going on in sov. CCP propaganda is a lie !!

Everything i have said i stand by and CCP metrics back up, unlike you who is trying to discredit what i say with "I know". What exactly do you know?

You've used a lot of space to tell me I'm wrong but not how or why, except I disagree with your uninformed prattle.


Your posting history seems to stink of TROLL. You've had your fun here, go find another thread to ply your wares on.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Uncle Foker
Unquestionable Prosperity
Commonwealth Vanguard
#143 - 2015-04-03 10:39:09 UTC
So, i'll try to put some perspective on the thread.

I am a new player (3 months active play i think), you are dealing with a paradox here i think. Eve is trying to be a sandbox and as much as possible unscripted and with few as rules possible. But how can you get to satisfy vets and noobs, and high, low and null sec...you can't cause we all want an unscripted game. You can't want something too be rules-free then assume it will always be balanced and that you will satisfy every group in the game. It does not happen in real life it will not happen in Eve, especially if you want player driven world, cause players are humans and they will try to bend the game to their will, so how do you solve this....i think you cannot solve this.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#144 - 2015-04-03 11:14:26 UTC
Uncle Foker wrote:
So, i'll try to put some perspective on the thread.

I am a new player (3 months active play i think), you are dealing with a paradox here i think. Eve is trying to be a sandbox and as much as possible unscripted and with few as rules possible. But how can you get to satisfy vets and noobs, and high, low and null sec...you can't cause we all want an unscripted game. You can't want something too be rules-free then assume it will always be balanced and that you will satisfy every group in the game. It does not happen in real life it will not happen in Eve, especially if you want player driven world, cause players are humans and they will try to bend the game to their will, so how do you solve this....i think you cannot solve this.




Well, historically EVE has lost 90% of all new subscribers, so the way it has worked, is by pleasing 10% of the new guys. So that's not an issue, EVE CAN please to people from very different ranges.

The question, and that's a tough one, is how to replace the people who goes away for whatever reason, be it RL or ingame. And my impression is that EVE just emptied its niche, there's not enough people left to try EVE at this point as to ensure replacement of the departed. Not when what does 90% of everybody who tries the game is to quit...

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Iam The Flash
Doomheim
#145 - 2015-04-03 11:28:30 UTC
CCP Falcon wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
CCP Falcon, I would be really interested to hear whether your perspective of the new and improved "Eve by numbers" has changed your "opinion" as quoted above.


Nope Big smile



Sorry mate but you're a tool.

You and ccp's team are destroying eve and you don't care, you seem to think people hold you in awe, they don't, the majority of our corp holy you and fozzie in contempt.

Ban me, i don't care, this game is becoming a joke, 2003-2007 was the real game, after that ccp hired players and this game went to hell.

Huge power blocs, easy to keep there space, new players suffering non stop, hundreds of players, no thousands, cancelling thier accounts and what do u do? "The great CCP falcon", nothing, you act like a god, and pretend all is well when it's not.

CCP will never grow as long as you lie to us and you are top of that list.

Ban me, i don't care, im cancelling all my accounts, im done with this game.
Reiisha
#146 - 2015-04-03 11:34:35 UTC
I still think that using structures to claim sov in any way should still be abolished. Somehow that thinking became ingrained in the design (there's a structure for that!) in such away that nothing can be done without them, even though they're the core of what's wrong with the system in the first place.

Just reward pure activity... If you're not actively using a system, you will lose it to someone who will use it. If you are, use it more than others to gain the claim.

Because that's all that sov is: Claims! Nothing more, nothing less. Nothing should be dependant on sov to actually execute.


You should have to use a system in order to claim sov, not the other way around as it is now!

If you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all...
u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
Ore No More
#147 - 2015-04-03 11:58:47 UTC  |  Edited by: u3pog
Dersen Lowery wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:

- remembering to take drugs.


Hey, whatever you have to do to make the experience bearable!

EVE IS DYING.


Only in your head...EVE will be here for a long, long time, but not in a galaxy far, far away Big smile

Even though I am not a null sec dweller, it's clear to every player that it has become muddy. It needs to stir a little bit, let some "fresh air" in. We've had like what? One big fight over one year? Alliances stockpiling supplies, even those 10T loss was probably quickly rebuilt. Why do you think people prefer to stay in high sec - we now have more wars, alliances like RvB who wanna have a decent PvP in small scale (yes low sec counts in of course), more gankers than ever...People prefer to stay in High sec (unless you are part of the big coalitions) and looks like it wasn't what CCP had in mind, so they are the ones who are going to stir the water. They've waited long enough for something to happen. Null sec needs some action.

See, EVE is like gravity, all it takes is a little push.
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#148 - 2015-04-03 12:14:04 UTC
u3pog wrote:
Dersen Lowery wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:

- remembering to take drugs.


Hey, whatever you have to do to make the experience bearable!

EVE IS DYING.


Only in your head...EVE will be here for a long, long time, but not in a galaxy far, far away Big smile

Even though I am not a null sec dweller, it's clear to every player that it has become muddy. It needs to stir a little bit, let some "fresh air" in. We've had like what? One big fight over one year? Alliances stockpiling supplies, even those 10T loss was probably quickly rebuilt. Why do you think people prefer to stay in high sec - we now have more wars, alliances like RvB who wanna have a decent PvP in small scale (yes low sec counts in of course), more gankers than ever...People prefer to stay in High sec (unless you are part of the big coalitions) and looks like it wasn't what CCP had in mind, so they are the ones who are going to stir the water. They've waited long enough for something to happen. Null sec needs some action.

See, EVE is like gravity, all it takes is a little push.


But listen comigh sov 5.0 is not enough to be called something really big.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Varathius
Enlightened Industries
Goonswarm Federation
#149 - 2015-04-03 12:31:10 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I did my part, I already pointed out to them that their proposed system ***** all over the small groups and has a barrier of effort that cannot be achieved by them(4 hours per structure across the entire alliance), but people are too busy circlejerking each other over either the death of nullsec entire, the death of the "blue donut", the death of structure sov, and the other various narratives being advanced over the truth of the mattter.

It's up to them to realize that what they're suggesting does not accomplish their goals.


I have to agree with you here and add something to your last sentence, they will accomplish the exact opposite with this change of what they have in mind.
Aphrodite Balum
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#150 - 2015-04-03 14:00:19 UTC
Few days ago, while playing other games, I have met two guys from Texsas and been playing with them almost every day since then. I couldn't resist trying to bring them into Eve. So they downloaded the client, created toons, with some of my guidance managed to find each other in the Space, and that's it, they were lost, confused and agitated. I get it Eve is harsh and unforgiving, I live in Provi and there are fights on an hourly basis. However, in my opinion, ccp are shooting themselves in the foot with not holding new players hand in the first steps in New Eden. The wall of text for the tutorial does no good, partly because it's not emersive. My two friends just skipped through it without giving it much thought and then couldn't even find Aura for their first mission. F*€ing voice over that wall of text for the mission description and objective, make the tutorial more step by step assisting with the HUD, overview, etc, new players have no idea what they are looking at. Really, the harshness of the universe can come two hours into the game, and just doing a **** poor job introducing new players to how to play just sends them to play other games without getting interested in even giving it a chance. I have heard that "Eve is not for everybody" but come on, there has to be a way to explain what is to come with a well done emersive tutorial on what the f@&k is overview and the capsule and "how to warp to something" and actually "why you need to warp to something". Essentially, the confusion after creating your character is absurd! Finish, CQ, start brand new players in the proper pilot school setting, explain what are the skills, what are your basic choices, voice over that sh$t, don't be lazy and stop hiding behind "this is a true sandbox" bullsh., there is no reason why not to make early steps in the sandbox less confusing and actually engaging to a player.
Dots
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#151 - 2015-04-03 14:05:14 UTC

Aphrodite, CCP has made a better non-wall-of-text NPE, but they are play testing it and not all new players have it as an option. It's called New Player Opportunities. Look in my sig to see what it looks like.

Also, I think it is ironic that your own post is a wall of text.

everything is better with ᵈᵒᵗˢ on it

New Player Opportunities: a gallery
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#152 - 2015-04-03 14:10:55 UTC
bonkerss wrote:
Sykaotic wrote:
Quote:
harsh, vicious, relentless and cold, is being replaced with


No its not.

Null is a bunch of Carebears, no damn different than Hi sec. Same with the hi sec gankers... just a bunch of Carebears who dont have the balls for real pvp and think they are a thing because they do pvp in a pvp ship vs a venture.

Low sec is where the true pvp exsists.

I say we (all of null and high sec) meet up down in low sec and get it on.

Lets see who shows up.... bets?


lowesc is pvp light. if you want all tactical options available to you you have to do 0.0 or wh pvp.


Not true. Null doesn't have gate or station guns.
Aphrodite Balum
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#153 - 2015-04-03 16:07:11 UTC
Dots wrote:

Aphrodite, CCP has made a better non-wall-of-text NPE, but they are play testing it and not all new players have it as an option. It's called New Player Opportunities. Look in my sig to see what it looks like.

Also, I think it is ironic that your own post is a wall of text.



Yup, the irony. :)

I've posted from my phone.

I'll try to edit later. Just felt like throwing my opinion out there while it was somewhat fresh in my mind.
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#154 - 2015-04-03 16:18:27 UTC
u3pog wrote:
Dersen Lowery wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:

- remembering to take drugs.


Hey, whatever you have to do to make the experience bearable!

EVE IS DYING.


Only in your head...


Your sarcasm meter is broken.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!
u3pog
Ministerstvo na otbranata
Ore No More
#155 - 2015-04-03 16:18:32 UTC
Aphrodite Balum wrote:
Dots wrote:

Aphrodite, CCP has made a better non-wall-of-text NPE, but they are play testing it and not all new players have it as an option. It's called New Player Opportunities. Look in my sig to see what it looks like.

Also, I think it is ironic that your own post is a wall of text.



Yup, the irony. :)

I've posted from my phone.

I'll try to edit later. Just felt like throwing my opinion out there while it was somewhat fresh in my mind.


So, you say it's hard for the new players? How did we learn? Who taught us how to play? Were there any tutorials, rather than the cold, harsh world out there? Yes, it's harder to attract new players nowadays, so CCP should make it somewhat easier to get into the game, but not too easy, because once they leave the newbie systems they will still enter that cold, harsh world. They shouldn't enter the Matrix as a new player and suddenly realize "Wow, the game reality is totally different" after they take the red pill and see how deep the rabbit hole goes...
Pohbis
Neo T.E.C.H.
#156 - 2015-04-03 16:53:08 UTC
If every super magically imploded in space and left a premium insurance payout in the owners wallet; everyone would be the merrier. Mad, maybe, frustrated, definitely – but finally freed of the "shackles".

Structures aren't the problem – people were finding some morbid satisfaction in grinding HP both before and after Dominion. It wasn't until the supercapital buff that things turned south.
Paranoid Loyd
#157 - 2015-04-03 17:28:49 UTC
Iam The Flash wrote:
CCP Falcon wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
CCP Falcon, I would be really interested to hear whether your perspective of the new and improved "Eve by numbers" has changed your "opinion" as quoted above.


Nope Big smile



Sorry mate but you're a tool.

You and ccp's team are destroying eve and you don't care, you seem to think people hold you in awe, they don't, the majority of our corp holy you and fozzie in contempt.

Ban me, i don't care, this game is becoming a joke, 2003-2007 was the real game, after that ccp hired players and this game went to hell.

Huge power blocs, easy to keep there space, new players suffering non stop, hundreds of players, no thousands, cancelling thier accounts and what do u do? "The great CCP falcon", nothing, you act like a god, and pretend all is well when it's not.

CCP will never grow as long as you lie to us and you are top of that list.

Ban me, i don't care, im cancelling all my accounts, im done with this game.

Glorious. Lol

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
BrundleMeth
State War Academy
Caldari State
#158 - 2015-04-03 18:55:01 UTC  |  Edited by: BrundleMeth
Sgt Ocker wrote:
(Lots of Stuff)...

...prattle.

Heh heh heh...

You said prattle...

Ha Ha...
LolLolLol


Paranoid Loyd wrote:
Iam The Flash wrote:
CCP Falcon wrote:
Sgt Ocker wrote:
CCP Falcon, I would be really interested to hear whether your perspective of the new and improved "Eve by numbers" has changed your "opinion" as quoted above.


Nope Big smile



Sorry mate but you're a tool.

You and ccp's team are destroying eve and you don't care, you seem to think people hold you in awe, they don't, the majority of our corp holy you and fozzie in contempt.

Ban me, i don't care, this game is becoming a joke, 2003-2007 was the real game, after that ccp hired players and this game went to hell.

Huge power blocs, easy to keep there space, new players suffering non stop, hundreds of players, no thousands, cancelling thier accounts and what do u do? "The great CCP falcon", nothing, you act like a god, and pretend all is well when it's not.

CCP will never grow as long as you lie to us and you are top of that list.

Ban me, i don't care, im cancelling all my accounts, im done with this game.

Glorious. Lol

Absolutely...
CoolCoolCool
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#159 - 2015-04-03 18:59:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Varathius wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I did my part, I already pointed out to them that their proposed system ***** all over the small groups and has a barrier of effort that cannot be achieved by them(4 hours per structure across the entire alliance), but people are too busy circlejerking each other over either the death of nullsec entire, the death of the "blue donut", the death of structure sov, and the other various narratives being advanced over the truth of the mattter.

It's up to them to realize that what they're suggesting does not accomplish their goals.


I have to agree with you here and add something to your last sentence, they will accomplish the exact opposite with this change of what they have in mind.



CCP has done that before lol. And the response is always the same, people start cheering because they think people they dislike will start getting hurt by something. They end up cheering their own misfortune, because what happens ALWAYS affects them way more than it does the people they thought were about to be screwed.
xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
#160 - 2015-04-03 23:05:00 UTC
Sgt Ocker wrote:

Is it hard being so absolutely wrong?
3 years on nul? not with the char you are posting with you haven't. 7 years in highsec with a few dashes into nul to troll others fleets.
why would I know that if I had my finger on the pusle? You are posting with an empire based toon, nothing to do with nulsec, except a few troll kills and losses.

It is hard to respond because you spread out your jokes over so many individual quotes and half need to be deleted to reply..

Eve changes all the time? What has changed as far as nulsec goes recently, except one of the bloks decided to evict yet another unaligned alliance from their sov. What do you think will change post June?

You want credibility? Your not getting it by posting with a nobody toon and expecting people "with their finger on the pulse" to know you.

All I see here is a highsec pubbie who "thinks" he knows whats going on in sov. CCP propaganda is a lie !!

Everything i have said i stand by and CCP metrics back up, unlike you who is trying to discredit what i say with "I know". What exactly do you know?

You've used a lot of space to tell me I'm wrong but not how or why, except I disagree with your uninformed prattle.


Your posting history seems to stink of TROLL. You've had your fun here, go find another thread to ply your wares on.


yes 3 years in null, 1 with IRC 1 with ROGUE 1 with SMA, i don't pretend to know how to fix EVE like you do, you're the idiot jumping up and down about a system that's only being talked about and not set in stone, you refer to my comments as jokes so why should i take the shite you type serious. take your 10 account and go and gather all the other bitter shites and take them with you, you seem to think having so many accounts entitles you to have the game as it is now and never changing, and when the change happens you better have a say in it because you pay for 10 accounts and when it's not going your way you'll unsub.
well here's a wake up call, the rest of us have a say too.
your answer is to leave?
this stops number shrinking how?
your logic is flawed.
you then insult my main account,.
yes, i have a fecking backbone and don't hide behind an alt, a nothing account, like the one you're using now, you cheeky gobshite.
lol if this is the quality of intel you bring to the table then everything you say has to be taken with a pinch of salt buddy Blink if you where even in game you could check my corps alliance history, doesn't take but a minute and anyone can see clearly where we've been.
your claim that EVE is going to die is full of shite. do you know how many whining shites like you i've kick from corp over the years, little jumped up nobodies dictating their terms to everyone or else they'll take their 10 caps and leave,,, lol das boot!
my posting history is there for all to see, i don't troll nobody, i comment,, if i'm wrong i withdraw it, but in this case, i believe i'm not wrong in saying you're in a state of panic, calm down, take a deep breath and realise, it's just a game,, why you have to be so mad?