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EVE has a problem with its reputation. What can or should be done?

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Sentamon
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#141 - 2014-07-15 01:02:53 UTC
EVE doesn't have a problem with it's reputation, all the other useless MMO's that flame out after 6 months are the ones that have a problem with their reputation.

Forced friendships through game mechanics, and games sold on pure hype is the highest form of greifing.

~ Professional Forum Alt  ~
Nathaniel Raynaud
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#142 - 2014-07-15 01:08:10 UTC
Sentamon wrote:

Forced friendships through game mechanics, and games sold on pure hype is the highest form of greifing.

to be fair, eve kind of requires you to make friends with people while starting out, and it's generally accepted as being a necessary part of actually accomplishing anything
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#143 - 2014-07-15 01:18:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Sibyyl
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Defiance isn't *that* bad (particularly for a game with no subscription fee).

But it's basically violenceporn. Highly appealing if you have no attention span.

I've seen him play it and visually it looks amazing.. a devastated San Francisco.. freeways torn up by earthquakes and an out of control oceanside.. Arkfalls.. zombie soldiers.. a voice in your head. I don't think it's bad that my friend enjoys it very much.

I guess to me personally, I'd rather watch "Wait Until Dark" in horrible, pixellated quality than Transformers 4 in 1080p with Dolby.

And to make a similar comparison.. he loves Minecraft 20x more than Defiance.. and Minecraft (to me) does not look visually appealing in comparison. I guess I can just chalk it up to EVE being a type of game he's not keen on playing.

Btw, he paid full price for the pre-release version on Steam. They just pacified him with a bunch of items in game when it went free.

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#144 - 2014-07-15 01:19:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Christina Project
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Nope. It wouldn't be around long enough for it to become your 'better place'. What works for other companies and other games doesn't work for EVE, because EVE is INTENDED to work against the grain of what players can expect. That's where its appeal lies. Don't know why it's so hard for you to understand that EVE isn't every other game on the market.
Imagine you live in a shallow world,
surrounded by people who always are nice and friendly, (hypocrites and liars)
and only care about your own interests.


You see people who are like you, who play all these games.


You join EVE.


You don't get it. In your world, this game is upside down. All the other games have far more people
and much less "hostility" and no "scams", so obviously CCP is doing something wrong.

In your mind, CCP should change the game to be more like the others,
because obviously it would be a good thing for the game.


Now here comes your blindness.


What you don't see is the fact that these people aren't actually necessarily good people,
or even good players. You can't see that, because you identify with them. They play the
games you play, you talk to them, you play with them. Not so much in EVE though.

I'd say that actually, most of these people are incredibly smug, self centered,
self entitled and just wannabe good people. They kill NPCs and feel great from this,
doing the "good" work as the "good" people they are.

((Like a reallife friend of mine, who plays these games. And then he started playing GTA V ONLINE
and I made a thread about him in OOPE when I was at his place. He kept raging about how
the others are cheating by bumping him and how they are griefers and whatever.
GTA V ONLINE, ladies and gentlemen!))


EVE goes against what you understand and want. Things work differently in EVE and
it's actually dangerous. Players can kill you anywhere, so you have to watch out.
Loss is meaningfull.


In your perspective, everyone who wants to take stuff from you must be a bad person.
Obviously, as you wouldn't take away the stuff from others and you see yourself as a good person!

Again, here, these "good" people most often don't realize that they aren't actually good,
but just hypocrites who tell themselves that they are good people.


Like ... in the USA ... the f*...* up religious type, as broad example.
Pretty much everybody knows these exist and I bet there's an xkcd for that too!


The fact that the OP tries to roll this around "reputation" doesn't really change anything.
In the end, this thread is the same **** as all the others, made by the same *...* person like all the others.
(not necessarily the actual same person, but ... you know what I mean. :p)




Will this become a new threadnaught?
I like how CCP started to let these happen, it's seriously awesome for gathering intel! :D

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#145 - 2014-07-15 01:22:07 UTC
Lets all take into account the case of the Mithril Bikini i.e. end game armor. Why is it that this protects so much better against a wall of fire than a level 2 full body suit of armor? Does this not bug you? Reality states that the full body armor would protect you wayyy better... its full body! That Mithril Bikini would only protect your naughty bits from the fire. Now believe me, I'm all for full mythical protection of my bits, but not at the expense of the rest of me! Now, you combine this end game armor with a sword so big that it dwarfs me. Why the hell would I choose this? Why is the giant sword that is clearly made for a giant given to a normal sized person? I can't even make a chop without jumping to gain leverage! Bah! Whatever happened to the efficiency of normal weapons? It seems like the higher my level, the more awkward my choices of defenses and offensive hardware. I start the game looking like a normal warrior... I end the game looking like a warriors younger brother wielding his hand me downs.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Christina Project
Screaming Head in a Box.
#146 - 2014-07-15 01:23:06 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Lets all take into account the case of the Mithril Bikini i.e. end game armor. Why is it that this protects so much better against a wall of fire than a level 2 full body suit of armor? Does this not bug you? Reality states that the full body armor would protect you wayyy better... its full body! That Mithril Bikini would only protect your naughty bits from the fire. Now believe me, I'm all for full mythical protection of my bits, but not at the expense of the rest of me! Now, you combine this end game armor with a sword so big that it dwarfs me. Why the hell would I choose this? Why is the giant sword that is clearly made for a giant given to a normal sized person? I can't even make a chop without jumping to gain leverage! Bah! Whatever happened to the efficiency of normal weapons? It seems like the higher my level, the more awkward my choices of defenses and offensive hardware. I start the game looking like a normal warrior... I end the game looking like a warriors younger brother wielding his hand me downs.
Dude ... paragraphs, seriously!

And good night!

[i]"Don't look into another human's bowl to see how much he has ... ... look into his bowl to see if he has enough !" - Sol[/i]
Sibyyl
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2014-07-15 01:23:38 UTC
^^I agree with you about the Mithril bikini, but who wouldn't want a big ass sword, especially one that looks like a helicopter blade with a gun inside it?

Joffy Aulx-Gao for CSM. Fix links and OGB. Ban stabs from plexes. Fulfill karmic justice.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#148 - 2014-07-15 01:24:23 UTC
Sibyyl wrote:

And to make a similar comparison.. he loves Minecraft 20x more than Defiance.. and Minecraft (to me) does not look visually appealing in comparison. I guess I can just chalk it up to EVE being a type of game he's not keen on playing.


Minecraft used to be pretty fun. I was disciplined when I built a gigantic penis in the skyline of someone who mouthed off to me on their forums though. Totally worth it.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#149 - 2014-07-15 01:26:03 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Lets all take into account the case of the Mithril Bikini i.e. end game armor. Why is it that this protects so much better against a wall of fire than a level 2 full body suit of armor? Does this not bug you? Reality states that the full body armor would protect you wayyy better... its full body! That Mithril Bikini would only protect your naughty bits from the fire. Now believe me, I'm all for full mythical protection of my bits, but not at the expense of the rest of me! Now, you combine this end game armor with a sword so big that it dwarfs me. Why the hell would I choose this? Why is the giant sword that is clearly made for a giant given to a normal sized person? I can't even make a chop without jumping to gain leverage! Bah! Whatever happened to the efficiency of normal weapons? It seems like the higher my level, the more awkward my choices of defenses and offensive hardware. I start the game looking like a normal warrior... I end the game looking like a warriors younger brother wielding his hand me downs.

Now I have the image of you in a bikini talking to a muffin....I'm going to have a troubled night I know it.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#150 - 2014-07-15 01:33:29 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Now I have the image of you in a bikini talking to a muffin....I'm going to have a troubled night I know it.


I don't talk to him... he talks to me! And its not a bikini.. its my Mithril endgame armor!

And finally, lets not be disturbed over my muffin fetish, lets be disturbed because someone over at Blizzard felt it was appropriate to violate a wild boar with rolled coin.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#151 - 2014-07-15 01:34:19 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Now I have the image of you in a bikini talking to a muffin....I'm going to have a troubled night I know it.


I don't talk to him... he talks to me! And its not a bikini.. its my Mithril endgame armor!

And finally, lets not be disturbed over my muffin fetish, lets be disturbed because someone over at Blizzard felt it was appropriate to violate a wild boar with rolled coin.


I blame you guys for this. He had been relatively sane these past few months.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#152 - 2014-07-15 01:36:17 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Now I have the image of you in a bikini talking to a muffin....I'm going to have a troubled night I know it.


I don't talk to him... he talks to me! And its not a bikini.. its my Mithril endgame armor!

And finally, lets not be disturbed over my muffin fetish, lets be disturbed because someone over at Blizzard felt it was appropriate to violate a wild boar with rolled coin.

Someone over there dose it consistently though, to enter herds(?) Of them at a timeShocked

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#153 - 2014-07-15 01:41:21 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
And finally, lets not be disturbed over my muffin fetish, lets be disturbed because someone over at Blizzard felt it was appropriate to violate a wild boar with rolled coin.

Someone over there dose it consistently though, to enter herds(?) Of them at a timeShocked


And people call Eve a game full of twisted sociopaths... at least we don't do things to herds of boars...

....wait... we got livestock and lube for Christmas.....

....my point was ruined by CCP...

Sigh.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Ocih
Space Mermaids
#154 - 2014-07-15 01:51:07 UTC
Nathaniel Raynaud wrote:
Sentamon wrote:

Forced friendships through game mechanics, and games sold on pure hype is the highest form of greifing.

to be fair, eve kind of requires you to make friends with people while starting out, and it's generally accepted as being a necessary part of actually accomplishing anything


Agreed,
API verified LFG system is still an LFG system and we all know where solo gets you in EVE.

The reputation issue with EVE isn't that there are 'bad people' in EVE. It's that being the good guy is like nailing your shoes on before going jogging.
Bloody Slave
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#155 - 2014-07-15 02:01:00 UTC
I've been playing some other MMOs out there in these 8+ years I'm playing EVE.

Sometimes, CCP do some stuff that annoys me, like Incarna, and I take a break. But I'm always back, always. Why?

English is not my native language but I keep trying to improve it, learn the best I can and the forums out there are a valuable source when working on it, with that said, I read almost every post in every MMO I was playing and I could stumble in some ex-EVE players posts here and there, they are pretty common, you know. Now, to tell the truth, 80% of that posts are positive to EVE when taking comparison with the game they are.

Of course, we don't have dragons, the music/sound can be, pretty much, muted and the graphics are not that awesome nowadays (The Division, as example, will be hitting next year and I think ex-CCP Oveur is working on it, not sure tho).

Back to the question: Why I keep coming back?

1) The community - 9/10
2) Communications between CCP and the players - 10/10
3) Complexity of the game - 8/10 (was 10/10 some years ago but tending to drop for the masses, I guess...)
4) Adrenaline hush when doing some dangerous stuff - 8/10 (was 10/10, same as above...)

That is all I can remember right now, no sarcasm on this post (I never had to warn about being sarcastic before but hey, we need to talk to the masses as well, don't we?) Blink

If your balls are hurt and bleeding don't sit in a pool full of piranhas (note to myself: don't complain in GD)
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#156 - 2014-07-15 02:02:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Gallowmere Rorschach
Chewytowel Haklar wrote:
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Okay, let's be 100% honest and straightforward for a moment. As a whole, on the gameplay level, this game is ******* terrible. It's slow, it's borderline mindnumbing, it's tedious, it's skill queue online, it's got one of the most wonky and ridiculous physics engines ever conceived (though that's been getting better), it's challenge level is borderline laughable once you get past the first couple of weeks so long as you aren't doing anything stupid like trying to do L4 missions in a Burst...I'll stop there, but you get my point.

The only thing that makes this game enjoyable for anyone with a fully functioning brain is the people who play it, and the **** they do and say to each other. How often do you find yourself docked up, talking to people for hours at a time, because suddenly chat was far more interesting than anything the actual game provides? If not that, how often do you find yourself borderline AFKing the most 'challenging' PvE content whilst completely immersed in a conversation in chat? Exactly.


I know actually talking to people and treating them like human beings is wonderful.

Judging from your later posts, I think you missed my point entirely.

If we were to take away the scamming, the griefing, the ganking, the blobbing, the harassment, the fleet boobies, the flying d*cks in local, all of these things that supposedly ruin Eve...we'd be left with...well...Eve...and it would be ****, and I wouldn't blame the huge numbers of players who left when they were removed.
Madam Lash
Amarr Empire
#157 - 2014-07-15 02:06:00 UTC
Most people are attracted to EVE because of its reputation at least I was initially way back when. I'd read the articles about massive titan battles, huge corporation theft and that nowhere was ever truly safe and thought to myself - I want a piece of that!

Saying EVE has a bad reputation is like saying WoW players are the paragon of what is right with gaming community, the OP has listed a few things about how we as a community are perceived by outside players but there are numerous similar instances in just about any other game you care to mention - the one that springs to mind is the infamous WoW funeral service. My point is that there is a good and bad in any game regardless of what it is - the fact that CCP doesn't go out of its way to 'police' anti-social behaviors with regard to actual gameplay is a good thing. I don't want my hand held and CCP acting like some helicopter parent every time I skin my knee or the local bully gives me a bloody nose.

I want hard, I want cut-throat and I don't want to feel safe and EVE gives me that... also I want a Hello Kitty skin for my Megathron but that's something completely different.
Lila Merle
Paper Cats
#158 - 2014-07-15 02:40:42 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
You see that as a problem OP, I see it as EVE working as intended, weeding out the weak minded "I am a hero!!!" type gamers who wouldn't like EVE anyway, even beofre they try (and fail at) the game. That's most of the gaming world, hell, it's most of humanity.


Well said.

One of my favourite things about EVE is that I'm not following a script in which I am some superhero. The theme in "game of pandas" of being the "last great hero" gets tedious.

In addition, I have to assume that when people gripe about non-consensual PvP in EVE that they are seeing it from the perspective of a game in which a lower-level player (or even a decent sized group of lower level players) doesn't stand a chance against a max level character because of the way those game mechanics work.

I think that overall, EVE's reputation is perfectly ok.


Guttripper
State War Academy
Caldari State
#159 - 2014-07-15 02:45:56 UTC
Bloody Slave wrote:
English is not my native language but I keep trying to improve it

You write better English compared to me writing in your mother tongue...Blink

One aspect I "fear" (eventually altering the game, if not outright cancelling it) would be someone already mentally unstable gravitating to play Eve and diving head first into all the "evilness" allowed by the game. Instead of them realizing it is but a game, nope, this lunatic would take it to the extremes. Perhaps attend a fan fest and "pod" people left, right, and center...

Dungeons and Dragons, heavy metal music... Eve?

Unfortunately there are people out there but fortunately they have not gone beyond the game if they do play.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#160 - 2014-07-15 02:50:08 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Eve deliberately excludes the stupid and the weak willied.
Its reputation is a reflection of that.
Your "ex" player quote is from infinity ziona...nuf said.

Grow up, eve is hard and we make it that way because we like it that way



Agreed. Be sure to find the wall switch now so you can turn off the lights on the way out.