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Null sec what chance does the little guy have

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Good Posting
Doomheim
#221 - 2014-02-14 10:53:47 UTC
This thread looks promising.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#222 - 2014-02-14 10:59:50 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Pinky Hops wrote:
this thread is not about missions.


They are part of the problem. New corps and alliances arn't going to try to take systems off us if they are not worth it.

Even if you thought they were the sov system isn't going to allow them to do so. Between experience, numbers, force projection, and material prep, it's just not going to happen. Also, again, the issue isn't mission, it's anoms being the worst PvE in game.


Death from a thousand pin pricks is a very real threat. Oneof our biggest defences is that most of our holdings are worthless systems so few people bother to try.


Oh come on now. As things stand there is literally nothing and noone left in any part of Eve that is a credible threat to the CFC.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Corvinus Shrike
Doomheim
#223 - 2014-02-14 11:04:31 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
I don't think things will ever completely settle down.

The game has a strong focus on pvp and if it became quiet in sov nullsec, either the players would find a way to generate conflict or CCP would.

The blue donut, if it ever exists, will only exist for short periods. It's a huge achievement, but something has to come after it. It's not the end game, just a temporary state.

As for small groups, there's always npc null or start planning for expansion into new space coming in a few expansions.


I've been out of the loop for years and only recently started a new character. So, could you please elaborate on the bolded part? Is it regarding Jove space or something entirely new?
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#224 - 2014-02-14 11:05:14 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The first Goon corp didn't have to deal with 24 hour staggered timers on 10,000,000 hp sov structures, automated emails from the server, 37000 man coalitions and the ability to drop thousands of ships including caps and supercaps on their heads. It was a very different game.

No, they had to deal with something far worse and much more painful: POS sov.

All those 15 goons???? Shocked

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Arkady Romanov
Whole Squid
#225 - 2014-02-14 11:10:30 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Pinky Hops wrote:
this thread is not about missions.


They are part of the problem. New corps and alliances arn't going to try to take systems off us if they are not worth it.

Even if you thought they were the sov system isn't going to allow them to do so. Between experience, numbers, force projection, and material prep, it's just not going to happen. Also, again, the issue isn't mission, it's anoms being the worst PvE in game.


Death from a thousand pin pricks is a very real threat. Oneof our biggest defences is that most of our holdings are worthless systems so few people bother to try.


Oh come on now. As things stand there is literally nothing and noone left in any part of Eve that is a credible threat to the CFC.



Except ourselves. The reality is if we did try to complete the blue doughnut and extend our SOV holdings from Immensea to Cobalt Edge, we wouldn't have to worry about N3, NC. or PL. We'd have to worry about our own logistics people finally going off the deep end and murdering us all.

Whole Squid: Get Inked.
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#226 - 2014-02-14 12:25:05 UTC
Corvinus Shrike wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
I don't think things will ever completely settle down.

The game has a strong focus on pvp and if it became quiet in sov nullsec, either the players would find a way to generate conflict or CCP would.

The blue donut, if it ever exists, will only exist for short periods. It's a huge achievement, but something has to come after it. It's not the end game, just a temporary state.

As for small groups, there's always npc null or start planning for expansion into new space coming in a few expansions.


I've been out of the loop for years and only recently started a new character. So, could you please elaborate on the bolded part? Is it regarding Jove space or something entirely new?


There is no Jove Space.
There are no Jovians.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
OldWolf69
EVE-RO
Goonswarm Federation
#227 - 2014-02-14 13:31:52 UTC  |  Edited by: OldWolf69
Once again, forum works like intended.Lol
knobber Jobbler
State War Academy
Caldari State
#228 - 2014-02-14 13:58:07 UTC
Sarah Nalelmir wrote:
Its sad that CFC are allowed to own so much of Null. There should be a limit on what can be cvlaimed by a particular corp/alliance.

I would prefer to see an even spread of corps/alliances rather than just one big blob of colour.


But that wouldn't be a sandbox, player controlled space would it then. CFC and N3/PL own most of nullsec because they conquered most of nullsec.

Its also worth pointing out that the CFC/N3 coalitions are not defined by an in game mechanic - there is no coalition mechanic, they're both made up of alliances with agreements between them. That isn't CCP's fault - the poor sov mechanics are.
Aivo Dresden
State War Academy
Caldari State
#229 - 2014-02-14 14:08:29 UTC
Jenn aSide is right that back in the day BoB influenced a lot more than linked on the map there. I can't find pre july 07 maps but BoB's infuence went much further than that. Not to mention that a very large group of Sov holding alliances on that 2007 map are renters. Before that, you had 4 power blocks, LV, D2, ASCN and BOB. LV and ASCN were killed, leaving D2 and BOB. North vs south if you want to put it in a really simple way. Goonswarm wasn't even in the picture yet, the Russian alliances owned a few constellations all together.

That said though, the problem in my opinion is indeed projection. At the time we made 50-60 jump round trips on pretty much a daily basis, often even several times a day. There was no such thing as titans or jump bridges. After a fight in Omist, we had to fly our ships to Pure Blind. None of that "warp to 0" stuff either. You had to go 80 jumps, through hostile space, in your battleships, warp to 15km off the gate. I don't think people really realize how easy it is to move fleets around now.

The teleportation issue, is a big concern I think. People can log in in Venal and be in Catch 5 minutes later. Armed and ready to go. If CCP wants to break up null and if they want to think of ways to avoid 2 power blocks colliding in 1 system all the time, they need to address the teleportation issue. Mutliple fronts that actually require fleets to be split up, not teleported back and forth.
Pinky Hops
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#230 - 2014-02-14 14:10:51 UTC
knobber Jobbler wrote:
That isn't CCP's fault - the poor sov mechanics are.


Straight

What?

Considering CCP designed the sov mechanics, it's safe to say that CCP is responsible.

Also, power projection is just as much to blame as sov mechanics.
Varius Xeral
Doomheim
#231 - 2014-02-14 14:14:30 UTC
Aivo Dresden wrote:
That said though...


Yeah, I don't think many people are going to defend the current nullsec mechanics point for point, just pointing out that a small number of enormous and highly influential coalitions is par for the course in nullsec history.

Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#232 - 2014-02-14 14:14:48 UTC
Aivo Dresden wrote:
Jenn aSide is right


I tried to show this to my wife as evidence that I can be right about something, but then I had to answer a bunch of uncomfortable questions about my choice of avatar gender.
Aivo Dresden
State War Academy
Caldari State
#233 - 2014-02-14 14:18:07 UTC
Varius Xeral wrote:
Yeah, I don't think many people are going to defend the current nullsec mechanics point for point, just pointing out that a small number of enormous and highly influential coalitions is par for the course in nullsec history.

Totally agree. Powerblocs and coalitions come and go. Nothing to worry about. :P
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#234 - 2014-02-14 14:18:08 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
You can't destroy anything in Sov space so there is no "thousand pinpricks". A trillion isk worth of ships will fail to kill even a hundred million isk POCO. Sov null is more secure than a 1.0 high sec system.


I destroyed an ESS last week.

Since when are ESS sov structures?


That depends on the definition of sov and when.

No it doesn't. The ESS is not a sov structure like a POCO, TCU, POS, or Outpost. Sov Structures all have one thing in common. They send a message to the owner when they're attacked.


Its the analog of a poco except it does LP and isk instead of P1/2/3/4. Sov structures all have one thing in common. Infinity Ziona is willfully stupid about them or has contracted some horrible mental disease that prevents her from understanding the truth.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#235 - 2014-02-14 14:18:59 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Aivo Dresden wrote:
Jenn aSide is right


I tried to show this to my wife as evidence that I can be right about something, but then I had to answer a bunch of uncomfortable questions about my choice of avatar gender.


You are never right with a wife.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#236 - 2014-02-14 14:18:59 UTC
Pinky Hops wrote:
knobber Jobbler wrote:
That isn't CCP's fault - the poor sov mechanics are.


Straight

What?

Considering CCP designed the sov mechanics, it's safe to say that CCP is responsible.

Also, power projection is just as much to blame as sov mechanics.


CCP isn't responsible for basic human nature. In any situation where cooperation increases the opportunities for gain moreso than confrontation would, cooperation will happen. EVE's null sec is no exception.

That same facet of human nature is why Malcanis' Law is so true.
Mr LaboratoryRat
Confederation of DuckTape Lovers
#237 - 2014-02-14 14:23:30 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
I don't think things will ever completely settle down.

The game has a strong focus on pvp and if it became quiet in sov nullsec, either the players would find a way to generate conflict or CCP would.

The blue donut, if it ever exists, will only exist for short periods. It's a huge achievement, but something has to come after it. It's not the end game, just a temporary state.

As for small groups, there's always npc null or start planning for expansion into new space coming in a few expansions.


How short is a "short period" in eve's time?.... 1 patch time? (6months), 2 patch times? (year) or 3 patchtimes (1.5 years).

That answere is likly going to be the last.


Would you like to be playing a pvp game for 1.5yrs hoping for improvement... No wonder why so many people come and leave.
E-2C Hawkeye
HOW to PEG SAFETY
#238 - 2014-02-14 14:26:01 UTC
Emma Muutaras wrote:
with the current state of null sec http://i.imgur.com/yRX4f1D.png (based on blue standings) what chance does a small alliance/corp that wants to be independent of the big boys have in getting a foothold in null?

it looks like you have 3 choices at the moment join cfc/rus join N3 or buy a wizards hat and join provi block.

while i admit my knowledge of everything going on in null is somewhat limited every 1 seams to say the same thing N3 while still got a lot of fight in them is on the back-foot and in full retreat that blue doughnut is getting closer and closer to being complete.

small scale pvp is getting harder and harder to find always seams to be a 30 man fleet getting dropped by a 100 man fleet, and if/when the blue doughnut is complete you may as well say large scale pvp will die as well.

yes its in the nature of sandboxes for people to group together and form massive coalitions but is this really healthy for null sec?



I believe the offical phrase now is BLUESEC.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#239 - 2014-02-14 14:26:21 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Aivo Dresden wrote:
Jenn aSide is right


I tried to show this to my wife as evidence that I can be right about something, but then I had to answer a bunch of uncomfortable questions about my choice of avatar gender.


Well, it does raise a few questions, to be perfectly honest.

Although not as many as Infinity believing that POCOs are sov structures.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#240 - 2014-02-14 14:28:22 UTC  |  Edited by: La Nariz
Inxentas Ultramar wrote:

Small guys stay small guys because they don't feel like sucking up to some Alliance's middle management, they don't have the resources to compete, or perhaps they don't have the time to dedicate to Eve's rediculous Sov mechanics and bureaucratic alliance nonsense. I sure don't. Nullsec simply isn't suitable for how we want to play, and lowsec is losing it's charm rapidly. Hisec (wardecs) and wormhole space (unrestricted PVP) are simply better, more enjoyable alternatives then living in the shadow of a colossus.


Right there we have the answer folks, people that refuse to engage in diplomacy and politics can't get anywhere in a multiplayer game.

E: They literally don't feel like doing what it takes to succeed.

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133