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[Rubicon 1.1] Capital Turret Tracking Changes in Conjunction with Heat Iteration

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Andrea Keuvo
Rusty Pricks
#341 - 2014-01-22 15:11:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Andrea Keuvo
CCP Fozzie/CCP Rise/CCP SonicLover - ruining Eve one pointless nerf at a time. All while the game at its very core is broken of course.

Quit tweaking modules and fix the big things that are broken.
Pytria Le'Danness
Placid Reborn
#342 - 2014-01-23 15:41:29 UTC
Should've known better than to train for the T2 Siege Module.
S0mveraa
If You're Reading This You Suck
#343 - 2014-01-24 05:51:26 UTC  |  Edited by: S0mveraa
Maybe I'm just a paranoid WH dweller....you know how crazy we get spending years in these holes of ours .....BUT, this just kinda looks like a nerf to cap escalations in WH's. I might be wrong, prolly am. Atleast thats what my ex-wife used to tell me....she was always right.


Anyways, why in the world, would you further nerf something that's already been beat to hell? Overheating TC's?Cool, so I can get a burst of extra goodness for the cost of some nanite paste and the risk of burning my mods out. So, you're telling me, to get the same effect as I currently get, I HAVE to overheat.


That just seems wrong to me. I hope you really do listen to the community, I didn't read all these posts, but the ones I did were all negtive.



So, -1. NO NO NO....NO....NO.....did I mention NO. Make more stupid deployables.
Skuyou
Death and Taxes Incorporated.
Two Vargurs one Hole
#344 - 2014-01-24 06:37:12 UTC
If your going to give TC's a boost great but the penalty is only effecting dreads which are almost useless as it is. This wont be a fleet ship any longer this will be used for grinding poses and stations with no other options. as a added bonus with the introduction of tidi all you will do is cause dreads to be completely useless. I would rather you not introduce overheatable TC's rather then nurfing the dreads.

Either ditch the capacity to overheat TC's or ditch the nurf so it actually works for us.
Sonho
Doomheim
#345 - 2014-01-24 09:25:38 UTC
What a nerf to dreads you say? Well i never saw that one coming.....For real is this even necessary ?If anything dreads need a boost.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#346 - 2014-01-24 09:35:47 UTC
For god sake peopel. THe ffect is MINIMAL!! And you make a huge storm about it.. no wonder they ignore the community. If the reaction was proportionate then they might pay attention.

Anyone that said that this ruins dreads and titans basically got his name on an ignore list by Fozzie and Rise... because know they know they cannot pay attention to those people.

Yes it a nerf. but it is the less crippling nerf I ever saw on the last 10 years of eve.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#347 - 2014-01-24 09:36:51 UTC
Angrod Losshelin wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Black Garius wrote:
Fozzie you are a NOOB, go and play Lego instead.

In the other hand I like to congratulate to you for successfully NERFING the subscriber numbers AGAIN.



Anyone that really LEAVES because of these TINY changes is really a coward or a baby.


Na, most peeps will not leave over this change. However, alot of small issues like this take the fun out of flying ships that we work months and months to train. They are nerfing the reasons to get into capital ships, over and over.



That is a MUCH more sensible statement, and much more likely to be heard than"buahhh buahh I am gonna leave because you made dreads useless!!!"

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#348 - 2014-01-24 09:38:43 UTC
Meyr wrote:
sabastyian wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ok I'm done my meetings for the day, time for a longer reply post.
This proposal is for a 5% reduction in capital gun tracking.


Ok, so you think that just because we can overheat module means we want to overheat it and carry spares around just to get our pre-patch tracking? The Revelation and some moros fits wont have that option, the only dread that will really feel a boost is an armor nag with 2 sebo 2 tc 2 heavy cap booster. A rev has 1 tc, so it's tracking is still going to drop despite your plan to "make them better" In some hot drops or even capital fights, you aren't in range of a carrier and are to close to drop a mobile depot to refit, so overheating your modules for XXXXXX isnt an option. As a Titan pilot you may not want to carry 2-3 sets of faction tracking computers just so you can burn set after set to get your pre-patch tracking. Maybe reconsider your general overheating ideas to certain modules that the players never even wanted to get the overheat bonus. Sensor boosters, tracking computers and cap boosters, as a dread you now to overheat 2/3 of these just to continue shooting and to get your pre-patch tracking back, the amount of heat damage will go up and the time a pilot can overheat to get his pre-patch stats will decrease. As a dreadnought pilot, I really dont want to have to carry 2-3 sets of Cap booster, tracking computers and sensor boosters just incase we have a fight that lasts longer then 5-10 minutes.


This rather neatly sums up much of what is wrong with this proposal, specifically, and much of the proposals in this patch, in general.

It also indirectly points out that, hey, isn't CFC's Naglfar fit exactly like he describes? A quick check of the killboards for a Goonswarm Naglfar lossmail confirms that, why, yes, indeed, that IS precisely the fit of a CFC Naglfar.

Kinda makes one just a bit curious, does it not?



nope.. just means that he knows what people fit on their dreads!!! Now anyoen that knoes how to fit a ship is part of a conspiracy?

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Mag's
Azn Empire
#349 - 2014-01-24 16:22:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Mag's
Kagura Nikon wrote:
For god sake peopel. THe ffect is MINIMAL!! And you make a huge storm about it.. no wonder they ignore the community. If the reaction was proportionate then they might pay attention.

Anyone that said that this ruins dreads and titans basically got his name on an ignore list by Fozzie and Rise... because know they know they cannot pay attention to those people.

Yes it a nerf. but it is the less crippling nerf I ever saw on the last 10 years of eve.
It's not the nerf per se, it's the reason for it that gets peoples goat.
It's the logic that tells them to nerf the tracking, because of a few WH systems and the chance that dreads get used there and the chance again, that they over heat and gain more than before.......

But isn't the point of over heating to gain more for a short period and the chance of burn out? If the gain in those systems is so over the top, then reduce the gain had from over heat instead. Or, shock horror, reduce the bonus to those systems. I and others, simply have issues with the logic shown here.

I understand the need for balance, but expected better.

What with this and the whole ESS debacle, we seem to have the old CCP attitude returning. It's that, that will drive people away.

Destination SkillQueue:- It's like assuming the Lions will ignore you in the Savannah, if you're small, fat and look helpless.
Vincintius Agrippa
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#350 - 2014-01-24 17:13:37 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Hello again! This thread will cover the changes to the base tracking stats of all capital turrets alongside the expansion of heat to Tracking Computer modules.

I advise reading the Heat Iterations post before this one.

When expanding the ability to overheat to Tracking Computers, we investigated the effects that the change would have on different levels of turrets and the doctrines that use them. With the help of the CSM we have identified that the effects on Capital Turret tracking would be (slightly) negative so we're making a small tweak to them at the same time as the heat expansion.

In Rubicon 1.1 the tracking speed of all Capital Turrets will decrease by 5%.

This means tracking will be 5% down vs current TQ values when not overheating any TCs, about 2% down when overheating one T2 TC, and about 1.5% up when overheating two T2 TCs. Using higher meta TCs makes the crossover faster.

These changes will be on SISI very soon for you to try out for yourself, and as always we look forward to hearing your feedback.

Thanks!




This is a great idea, all i have to do is get someone to remote sebo and te me. thus the point of of your new changes is undone! btw, its not like cap turrets can actually hit anything other than caps or pos's. Another waste of ccp dev time.
Only YOU can prevent internet bullying!
Kassasis Dakkstromri
State War Academy
Caldari State
#351 - 2014-01-24 18:20:57 UTC
This is what they call "Robbing Peter to pay Paul"!


Wow - definitely NOT supported! X

CCP you are bad at EVE... Stop potential silliness ~ Solo Wulf
Vincintius Agrippa
Crimson Serpent Syndicate
#352 - 2014-01-24 18:47:49 UTC
sabastyian wrote:
Worth mentioning, all guns should be nerf'd 5% tracking speed to compensate for the "tracking computer buff" as most gun types use a tracking computer in one way or another in a fit to work at long range and as all ships can now become over powered. Large pulse need to be nerf'd espically as the apoc, apoc navy and abaddon use tracking computers alot in null-sec. They can now become completely overpowered.


All aboard the nerf train
Only YOU can prevent internet bullying!
Ong
Lumberjack Commandos
#353 - 2014-01-25 16:07:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Ong
They should really rename this part of the forum to "Fozzy tells you what's going to happen" there is no discussion here unless its a Rise post.

If it aint broke don't fix it seems to apply imo.
Meyr
Di-Tron Heavy Industries
OnlyFleets.
#354 - 2014-01-25 16:59:36 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Meyr wrote:
sabastyian wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ok I'm done my meetings for the day, time for a longer reply post.
This proposal is for a 5% reduction in capital gun tracking.


Ok, so you think that just because we can overheat module means we want to overheat it and carry spares around just to get our pre-patch tracking? The Revelation and some moros fits wont have that option, the only dread that will really feel a boost is an armor nag with 2 sebo 2 tc 2 heavy cap booster. A rev has 1 tc, so it's tracking is still going to drop despite your plan to "make them better" In some hot drops or even capital fights, you aren't in range of a carrier and are to close to drop a mobile depot to refit, so overheating your modules for XXXXXX isnt an option. As a Titan pilot you may not want to carry 2-3 sets of faction tracking computers just so you can burn set after set to get your pre-patch tracking. Maybe reconsider your general overheating ideas to certain modules that the players never even wanted to get the overheat bonus. Sensor boosters, tracking computers and cap boosters, as a dread you now to overheat 2/3 of these just to continue shooting and to get your pre-patch tracking back, the amount of heat damage will go up and the time a pilot can overheat to get his pre-patch stats will decrease. As a dreadnought pilot, I really dont want to have to carry 2-3 sets of Cap booster, tracking computers and sensor boosters just incase we have a fight that lasts longer then 5-10 minutes.


This rather neatly sums up much of what is wrong with this proposal, specifically, and much of the proposals in this patch, in general.

It also indirectly points out that, hey, isn't CFC's Naglfar fit exactly like he describes? A quick check of the killboards for a Goonswarm Naglfar lossmail confirms that, why, yes, indeed, that IS precisely the fit of a CFC Naglfar.

Kinda makes one just a bit curious, does it not?



nope.. just means that he knows what people fit on their dreads!!! Now anyoen that knoes how to fit a ship is part of a conspiracy?


Someone alert OED that the definition of the word 'people' has been changed to mean "anyone who flies a Naglfar in Eve Online"

These proposed changes amount to a 'buff' only for a Naglfar specifically fit this way. The Rev is absolutely penalized, and many Moros fits will need to be reworked, but one aspect or another gets penalized.
Bosquit
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#355 - 2014-01-25 20:09:16 UTC
Ong wrote:
They should really rename this part of the forum to "Fozzy tells you what's going to happen" there is no discussion here unless its a Rise post.

If it aint broke don't fix it seems to apply imo.



Yup, no discussion, nothing. Pretty pathetic really.

"Insert Philosophical Statement Here"
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#356 - 2014-01-25 23:10:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Sgt Ocker
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Meyr wrote:
sabastyian wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ok I'm done my meetings for the day, time for a longer reply post.
This proposal is for a 5% reduction in capital gun tracking.


Ok, so you think that just because we can overheat module means we want to overheat it and carry spares around just to get our pre-patch tracking? The Revelation and some moros fits wont have that option, the only dread that will really feel a boost is an armor nag with 2 sebo 2 tc 2 heavy cap booster. A rev has 1 tc, so it's tracking is still going to drop despite your plan to "make them better" In some hot drops or even capital fights, you aren't in range of a carrier and are to close to drop a mobile depot to refit, so overheating your modules for XXXXXX isnt an option. As a Titan pilot you may not want to carry 2-3 sets of faction tracking computers just so you can burn set after set to get your pre-patch tracking. Maybe reconsider your general overheating ideas to certain modules that the players never even wanted to get the overheat bonus. Sensor boosters, tracking computers and cap boosters, as a dread you now to overheat 2/3 of these just to continue shooting and to get your pre-patch tracking back, the amount of heat damage will go up and the time a pilot can overheat to get his pre-patch stats will decrease. As a dreadnought pilot, I really dont want to have to carry 2-3 sets of Cap booster, tracking computers and sensor boosters just incase we have a fight that lasts longer then 5-10 minutes.


This rather neatly sums up much of what is wrong with this proposal, specifically, and much of the proposals in this patch, in general.

It also indirectly points out that, hey, isn't CFC's Naglfar fit exactly like he describes? A quick check of the killboards for a Goonswarm Naglfar lossmail confirms that, why, yes, indeed, that IS precisely the fit of a CFC Naglfar.

Kinda makes one just a bit curious, does it not?



nope.. just means that he knows what people fit on their dreads!!! Now anyoen that knoes how to fit a ship is part of a conspiracy?

Yeah; In the original thread Omega fleet doctrine was specifically mentioned..
No conspiracy, just an edited thread, possibly to make it look less like a conspiracy.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#357 - 2014-01-26 12:36:53 UTC
Meyr wrote:
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Meyr wrote:
sabastyian wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Ok I'm done my meetings for the day, time for a longer reply post.
This proposal is for a 5% reduction in capital gun tracking.


Ok, so you think that just because we can overheat module means we want to overheat it and carry spares around just to get our pre-patch tracking? The Revelation and some moros fits wont have that option, the only dread that will really feel a boost is an armor nag with 2 sebo 2 tc 2 heavy cap booster. A rev has 1 tc, so it's tracking is still going to drop despite your plan to "make them better" In some hot drops or even capital fights, you aren't in range of a carrier and are to close to drop a mobile depot to refit, so overheating your modules for XXXXXX isnt an option. As a Titan pilot you may not want to carry 2-3 sets of faction tracking computers just so you can burn set after set to get your pre-patch tracking. Maybe reconsider your general overheating ideas to certain modules that the players never even wanted to get the overheat bonus. Sensor boosters, tracking computers and cap boosters, as a dread you now to overheat 2/3 of these just to continue shooting and to get your pre-patch tracking back, the amount of heat damage will go up and the time a pilot can overheat to get his pre-patch stats will decrease. As a dreadnought pilot, I really dont want to have to carry 2-3 sets of Cap booster, tracking computers and sensor boosters just incase we have a fight that lasts longer then 5-10 minutes.


This rather neatly sums up much of what is wrong with this proposal, specifically, and much of the proposals in this patch, in general.

It also indirectly points out that, hey, isn't CFC's Naglfar fit exactly like he describes? A quick check of the killboards for a Goonswarm Naglfar lossmail confirms that, why, yes, indeed, that IS precisely the fit of a CFC Naglfar.

Kinda makes one just a bit curious, does it not?



nope.. just means that he knows what people fit on their dreads!!! Now anyoen that knoes how to fit a ship is part of a conspiracy?


Someone alert OED that the definition of the word 'people' has been changed to mean "anyone who flies a Naglfar in Eve Online"

These proposed changes amount to a 'buff' only for a Naglfar specifically fit this way. The Rev is absolutely penalized, and many Moros fits will need to be reworked, but one aspect or another gets penalized.



You do know that naglfar is for a reasonable time already in the rise to be new flavor of dread. Eve is like that. Or you get the flavor or you wait for your turn.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Mournful Conciousness
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#358 - 2014-01-26 12:40:07 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:


You do know that naglfar is for a reasonable time already in the rise to be new flavor of dread. Eve is like that. Or you get the flavor or you wait for your turn.


Confirming that I will be training Naglfar for C6 sleeper OPs immediately. The Moros died in my heart the day it lost its awesome drone bay Sad

Embers Children is recruiting carefully selected pilots who like wormholes, green killboards and the sweet taste of tears. You can convo me in game or join the chat "TOHA Lounge".
Wulfy Johnson
NorCorp Security
#359 - 2014-01-26 18:22:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Wulfy Johnson
I want to live in a phoenix.. But thats not gonna happen.. Fix the darn thing and give dreads bays too.. That said, i would have thought going the route off implementing overheat and stated that dreads might get adjusted, would have been the right way to do this..
Willaev
The Fork
Clever Use of Neutral Toons
#360 - 2014-01-27 05:31:54 UTC
These changes are bad, and you should feel bad.