Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Yes, its not like the largest coalition in the game was recently told to train everyone for naglafar.

I have it on good authority Mittens did so because of their stellar tracking.

As much as I dont really LIKE this change, it does actually allow for more tracking than before, IF you overheat... and you can do that as long as you want IF you accept the burden associated with that (lots of paste/spare modules)

So i mean, if we really want the extra tracking then ya, I guess we need to overheat

This expands on this idea of dynamic fitting mid-fight i guess

I guess thats good, it creates more degrees of separation between ok pilots and great pilots

but like... most pilots are not legendary pilots so it would probably be better if the change was made in a way that wasnt presented as a slap in the face to most people who dont see the change the way it was envisioned.

People are emotional and emotional people do silly things, like play other games..

So my constructive criticism would be...

Yes the people only think they know what they want, so you should give them what they need and not what they want.... BUT in doing so, please put some extra thought into how that can be achieved without alienating us? We love you, you should love us... dont slap us in the face and tell us its cake. or just ignore us... something is wrong if its come to that!

I believe that if a change towards a desired ideal cannot be made in a way that is widely accepted by the community as a positive change, then the end result certainly was not achieved with an appropriate means. (Whether the change improves game is a separate issue)

This means you need to go back to the drawing board, please. Give us a new module or new mechanic that still produces the desired result instead...

Give us something that we can be excited about that also moves the game in the direction you want it to go.

I can't wait till they actually get to the cap/ supercap rebalance. This rage **** is hilarious.

It'll be hilarious when the optimal and falloff of capital blasters is halved.

Well guys, it's a 5% decrease, not 10% or more...

If you want to hit a subcap with that, you're probably already webbing and target painting it, which means you wouldn't notice much of a difference, unless you're moving or exchanging shots with another cap, and one of you or both are moving. It's not like they just got tracking-disrupted.

I think capital escalations wil still be very viable. Just remember to web and paint, as you should be doing already.

Yeah it's not a very welcome change, and is indeed a nerf, but I don't think it's the end of the world.

EDIT: after reading the other new topics about overheating... Well. With TP's not achieving their current levels without being overheated, Capital Turrets' ability to blap subcaps will indeed be reduced (don't know exactly how much) unless overheating something, which is indeed a nerf. On the other hand, overheating both things will give a buff, since overheated TP's will be above their current levels.
Not sure how much these changes will be liked. I personally would like a skill/module/rig that reduces heat damage (although T3's already have that).
I wonder what would happen if Capital Turrets didn't get their tracking bonus when overheated... Would that end the need for this nerf?

Ok I'm done my meetings for the day, time for a longer reply post.

Firstly, thanks to everyone who has posted constructive feedback in this thread so far.

I also want to quickly clear up a few misunderstandings that I have been seeing in this thread, as well as on twitter and in evemails from some of you.

This proposal is for a 5% reduction in capital gun tracking. This is not reducing the tracking to 5% of their current value, which would be a 95% reduction and would indeed be a terrible idea. To make sure we're on the same page, here's the numbers (formatting isn't great, but I expect you can see the point):
typeName OldTrackingSpeed NewTrackingSpeed
Dual Modal Giga Pulse Laser I 0.0040512 0.00384864
Dual Giga Modal Laser I 0.002296875 0.002182031
Dual Giga Pulse Laser I 0.0040512 0.00384864
Dual Giga Beam Laser I 0.002296875 0.002182031
Limited Mega Ion Siege Blaster I 0.0046 0.00437
Dual 1000mm 'Scout' Accelerator Cannon 0.001925 0.00182875
Dual 1000mm Railgun I 0.001925 0.00182875
Ion Siege Blaster Cannon I 0.0046 0.00437
Quad 3500mm Gallium Cannon 0.0018 0.00171
6x2500mm Heavy Gallium Repeating Cannon 0.00437 0.0041515
6x2500mm Repeating Cannon I 0.00437 0.0041515
Quad 3500mm Siege Artillery I 0.0018 0.00171

Secondly, we have never suggested nerfing Tracking Computers along with this change. Tracking Computers are receiving the ability to overheat and are not losing any of their base strength, which is a straight buff. I think some people have been confused by the similarity in names between Tracking Disruptors (which are receiving a decrease to base strength in this proposal) and Tracking Computers, which will always be as good or better than before.

Thirdly, for anyone who hasn't noticed the update to the EW thread; we are not going forward with the originally proposed reduction in the base strength of Target Painters. They will keep the same base values and get the ability to overheat after Rubicon 1.1.


Now, let's talk about this change in particular.
I can understand why some people feel this change is coming out of left field, especially if their particular playstyle happens to be in areas where dreadnaughts are not seen as often.
The initial trigger for thinking about making this change came from concerns raised about how the Tracking Computer buff would affect the area of the game where tracking fit Dreadnaughts are at their strongest, in wormhole PVP. This caused us to do some thinking about the specific interactions at play, and we determined that although the effect of the overheating change would be fairly minor, we could play it safe and make a fairly minor maintenance change to capital turrets at the same time.

That's exactly what this change is, a minor maintenance tweak. Making small, contained changes more rapidly is a very good method of balancing as you can fine tune attributes into the best possible state and watch the results without as many secondary effects. This change (as well as several of the other balance changes I announced yesterday) fall into that small contained iteration category.

It appears there are many people who seem to believe that this 5% will somehow crush Dreadnaughts or significantly decrease their use. I disagree, but I also welcome everyone to test these changes for themselves when SISI is next updated. As proven many times before, we are always open to adjusting or canceling proposed changes based on good solid feedback.

I think after people try out these changes they'll find that their old uses for Dreadnaughts all continue to apply. There is no magical threshold that 5% tracking can cross to make Dreads useless. There's no hidden trap within the tracking formula that makes the turrets in the game act differently than an informed player should expect. This will simply be a small (generally less than 5%) reduction in average applied damage when not using heated TCs, and a small increase in average applied damage for the players who push the limits with their tactics and fittings.

If you could blap webbed players with your Moros before, you'll still be able to do it.
If you could farm sleeper escalations using supported dreads before, you'll still be able to do it.
If you could burn down a bounced supercarrier with your dread hotdrop before you'll still be able to do it.
If you could alpha an orbiting Archon with your Omegafleet Nags before you'll still be able to do it.
If you could hit those Omegafleet Nags with your titan guns before you'll still be able to do it.
If you could mine veldspar with your Revelation before you'll still be able to do it.

I think you will all find that this change results in pretty much the same gameplay as before, and only serves as a very slight reduction in total effectiveness compared to the status quo. If you discover differently on SISI or potentially later on TQ, let us know in a calm and reasoned manner and we'll always be very open to reevaluating these kinds of attributes.

I love how people still arent getting the point that you can keep a stack of tracking computers in your dread, constantly overheat them, and then swap them out when they burn. Repair cost isn't much compared to guzzling strong drop/frentix all day, and what you end up is a net boost to tracking dreads.

Titans wont notice the change since everything that their guns actually damage is either a capital or a structure; the state of titans is an easy place to build your complaint around but the turth is that titan guns have the same level of uselessness as before.

(Sorry wormholers, the 5% nerf to tracking is far less important than the 5% nerf to null bounties, so you get screwed even less than the rest of us.)

Yeah sadly :D

Also I can understand why they didn't change Dread blapping yet... See how much reaction a -5% reduction AND the possibility to buff if to +2% for a limited time have made players react.

If they happened to nerf dread blapping... Oh my god, people would KILLTHEMSELVES !
Yet it wouldn't be worse than a Phoenix

"If you could mine veldspar with your Revelation before you'll still be able to do it."

Excellent