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Team Avatar and the future of our prototype

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Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1881 - 2013-09-21 01:48:17 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Johan Civire wrote:
Also not true because thats a different team and not part of the regular eve crew. So the hired to do WiS without losing any real ccp member. So the have 5/4 crew. So there is no worry`s about losing resource. The gain resource. And the best part is its not the team on Iceland but in japan a other ccp partner Lol


So who is paying this "different team" that's going to do WiS?


Also not how development works. If they feel that WiS will make the game more successful then they can afford to budget in an entirely new team for that since it will bring in more subs. Throwing more teams at a narrow feature set has diminishing returns since you can only have so many people working on a specific feature before they start stepping on each-other's toes.


What evidence do you have that more WiS content will make the game more successful? The last time they tried it the game's subscribers nosedived.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Cpt Tirel
Institute For Continuous Glory
#1882 - 2013-09-21 01:48:41 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Yes, there were some long-standing issues with in-space features but those are being addressed.


Exactly my point. They are being fixed because CCP stopped with the WiS nonsense and promised to focus on spaceships.


no
Cade Windstalker
#1883 - 2013-09-21 01:50:30 UTC
Rhes wrote:
I've made the argument several times. Just look at the state of CCP's two avatar based games: DUST is a failure and WoD is vaporware.

The problem is that despite that evidence there is a small group of Eve players who insist that CCP ignore history and ignore their track record and waste more time and money on game mechanics that aren't going to improve Eve's core gameplay. Gameplay that has continued to bring new subscribers to the game steadily since they promised to refocus their efforts to improve it.


WoD is in what is basically pre-production from what we know, that's not Vaporware.

Dust 514 isn't a failure until it shuts down, which doesn't seem to be happening. CCP have been talking with the CPM and have committed to improving the game and fixing the issues that it has. The people I've talked to who actually play Dust seem pretty optimistic that it'll be in a good state a year from now.
Tanthalassa
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1884 - 2013-09-21 01:51:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanthalassa
Rhes wrote:
The problem with space Barbie enthusiasts is they can't see any other way for Eve to expand other than WiS and that's just narrowminded.
Sorry, buddy, but that's you who's narrowminded here.

All you do in every your post is spam the same thing: "WiS caused fallout in eve," "space barbies"(going as low as calling people "furries", while saying p2p(or switch to p2p with microtransactions due to WiS implementation) would kill eve.

1). WiS wasn't released. The demo version of it was neither WiS, nor Incarna. The preview of WiS - sure. Preview of poor release and poor addition of microtransactions - sure.
You keep ignoring these comments, and you were told this multiple times.

2). Barbies and furries stay in 2nd Life. You clearly overplayed that game, since these silly insults just cannot disappear from this thread for some reason.

Eve doesn't need to reinvent the wheel - whomever needs dance parties can go to 2nd life - what eve needs is good model that would facilitate interaction between players. Just in case you forgot - that doesn't mean we need to have dance parties.

All we need is a nice mechanic. For instance: I would love to be able to go to my locator agent office, track your stubborn Rhes ass, so I could sneak up on you in dark alley (some rusty station environment) and beat the pulp out of your character with my knee high boots(purchased from Nex store coincidentally). Then I could open a nearby waste disposal hatch to trash your useless Biomass.

Now.. The stuff from Nex store shouldn't provide any advantage other than make my avatar look classy.
It would be just an additional revenue for CCP. Some people are quite willing to spend cash. SC is one of many many examples. CCP deserves a good piece of that pie imo.

But - the game stays sub-based, while micro-transactions provide additional ISK sink.
People who are willing to spend on eyecandy - it can be a fancy suit , shoes, whatever piece of gear that provides a character distinctive memorable look - will buy more Plex. More bought Plex - more cash for CCP, more money for development.
Cade Windstalker
#1885 - 2013-09-21 01:54:58 UTC
Rhes wrote:
What evidence do you have that more WiS content will make the game more successful? The last time they tried it the game's subscribers nosedived.


Dipped, not nose-dived. And I've heard, repeatedly, from lots of people who stuck with Eve and who didn't that the character creator is extremely cool and that they wish they could do more with those avatars than walk around a little room.

Avatars help players become more invested in their characters and the continuous demand for more clothing even without an environment to show it off in shows that there is demand for these features even from the current player-base.

Your evidence consists of a single data-point where WiS wasn't even the primary issue, the cost of the Microtransactions, concerns over "golden ammo", and misinterpretation of things like the "18 months" controversy are what actually drove the dip in subscriptions. WiS was unpopular not because it was WiS but because it was unfinished and people felt that CCP wasn't addressing concerns with core features. None of this means people don't like WiS, it means they don't like half-finished features...
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1886 - 2013-09-21 01:58:34 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Dipped, not nose-dived.


CCP paid for the entire CSM to fly to Iceland for an (unplanned) emergency summit during the summer of rage. They were very scared about the state of the game.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Cade Windstalker
#1887 - 2013-09-21 02:00:04 UTC
Rhes wrote:
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Dipped, not nose-dived.


CCP paid for the entire CSM to fly to Iceland for an (unplanned) emergency summit during the summer of rage. They were very scared about the state of the game.


Can you stop addressing tiny little pieces of my post and actually address the main argument that refutes your points? Thanks.

Yes, they were concerned, there was a lot of anger in the community and they needed to address that. Again though, WiS as an idea was not the main issue.
Job Valador
Professional Amateurs
#1888 - 2013-09-21 03:05:15 UTC
Rhes is having furrie flashbacks again Roll

At least its obvious you care about the game so you get respect from me in that aspect but it still saddens me that you lop all role-players in the furrie category. Not nice and not true, but anyway to grab folks attention eh?

/Shock value

"The stone exhibited a profound lack of movement."
Flamespar
WarRavens
#1889 - 2013-09-21 03:12:58 UTC
Rhes is trolling. And not very well at that.

CCP have committed to meaningful avatar gameplay. Rhes will have to learn to deal with that.

Babbling about furry sex parties is a great way to ensure that CCP will ignore his gibberish

Thank you for removing yourself from the discussion.
Teinyhr
Ourumur
#1890 - 2013-09-21 08:13:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Teinyhr
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Can you stop addressing tiny little pieces of my post and actually address the main argument that refutes your points? Thanks.


A helpful reminder:

"Arguing with a Goon on the topic of WiS is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon; it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory." -adapted from a well known quote by Scott D. Weitzenhoffer .
Cade Windstalker
#1891 - 2013-09-21 08:42:40 UTC
Teinyhr wrote:
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Can you stop addressing tiny little pieces of my post and actually address the main argument that refutes your points? Thanks.


A helpful reminder:

"Arguing with a Goon on the topic of WiS is rather like trying to play chess with a pigeon; it knocks the pieces over, craps on the board, and flies back to its flock to claim victory." -adapted from a well known quote by Scott D. Weitzenhoffer .


Hahahaha, oh man, I laughed so hard at this because it's so true Lol
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#1892 - 2013-09-21 09:22:48 UTC
What it doesn't makes sense is that CCP is more willing to devaluate EVE than to let players buy the vanity items they alredy have developed & QA'ed and are ready to switch from "seed_0" to "seed_1".

It's ludicrous. I've made my mind to give 50 euros to Chris Roberts if he adds "girly" avatar content to Star Citizen, but I can't even see why CCP is not willing to take my money for a bloody dress for my bloody avatar when that dress has been sitting on Singularity for no less than 29 months.

These icelanders are crazy! Ugh

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Cade Windstalker
#1893 - 2013-09-21 09:31:09 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
What it doesn't makes sense is that CCP is more willing to devaluate EVE than to let players buy the vanity items they alredy have developed & QA'ed and are ready to switch from "seed_0" to "seed_1".

It's ludicrous. I've made my mind to give 50 euros to Chris Roberts if he adds "girly" avatar content to Star Citizen, but I can't even see why CCP is not willing to take my money for a bloody dress for my bloody avatar when that dress has been sitting on Singularity for no less than 29 months.

These icelanders are crazy! Ugh


No clue, maybe it's part of the collector's edition stuff. Ugh

That said, I wouldn't expect Star Citizen avatars to be as impressive as Eve ones. the CryEngine is pretty good, but right now Carbon does better characters.
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1894 - 2013-09-21 09:56:35 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
What it doesn't makes sense is that CCP is more willing to devaluate EVE than to let players buy the vanity items they alredy have developed & QA'ed and are ready to switch from "seed_0" to "seed_1".

It's ludicrous. I've made my mind to give 50 euros to Chris Roberts if he adds "girly" avatar content to Star Citizen, but I can't even see why CCP is not willing to take my money for a bloody dress for my bloody avatar when that dress has been sitting on Singularity for no less than 29 months.

These icelanders are crazy! Ugh


No clue, maybe it's part of the collector's edition stuff. Ugh

That said, I wouldn't expect Star Citizen avatars to be as impressive as Eve ones. the CryEngine is pretty good, but right now Carbon does better characters.


i don,t mind avatars with less detail

R.S.I2014
Cade Windstalker
#1895 - 2013-09-21 10:01:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Cade Windstalker
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
i don,t mind avatars with less detail


I just meant that one of the reasons the Eve Avatars have been popular and interesting is how detailed they are. Other games tend to give you a very basic selection of faces, bodies, and maybe a few sliders or a color palette to customize things with. We get a lot more than that, to the point where seeing someone with the same portrait these days is a very disconcerting experience.

At the time they released they beat out the latest Bioware game of the time for Avatar customization and that's no small feat.
Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1896 - 2013-09-21 10:02:28 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
What it doesn't makes sense is that CCP is more willing to devaluate EVE than to let players buy the vanity items they alredy have developed & QA'ed and are ready to switch from "seed_0" to "seed_1".

It's ludicrous. I've made my mind to give 50 euros to Chris Roberts if he adds "girly" avatar content to Star Citizen, but I can't even see why CCP is not willing to take my money for a bloody dress for my bloody avatar when that dress has been sitting on Singularity for no less than 29 months.

These icelanders are crazy! Ugh


Collectors edition or some part of promotion. You need to ask them why?
Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#1897 - 2013-09-21 10:35:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Arduemont
The sheer volume of drivel that comes out of Rhes is frankly amazing.

All of your arguments have been covered time and time again throughout this thread. I remember now why I stopped posting before, because I got tired of repeating myself to people who will just throw the same discredited arguments up over and over again.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1898 - 2013-09-21 10:43:10 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
i don,t mind avatars with less detail


I just meant that one of the reasons the Eve Avatars have been popular and interesting is how detailed they are. Other games tend to give you a very basic selection of faces, bodies, and maybe a few sliders or a color palette to customize things with. We get a lot more than that, to the point where seeing someone with the same portrait these days is a very disconcerting experience.

At the time they released they beat out the latest Bioware game of the time for Avatar customization and that's no small feat.


I know what you mean ,but tell that to a great part of the community ,that use a system that can,t even handle the char creator ,let alone let it walk around that one room.
Until now i was able to keep my gear up to speed ,by buying every 2,3 or 4 years a new pc and when needed replace components like the video card ,but not everybody does that.
Maybe the problem of some of the Goons is not dolls in space ,but they play this game on a overrated calculator and instead just confessing that ,they bring on the old space barbie stuff

R.S.I2014
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1899 - 2013-09-21 10:45:53 UTC
Arduemont wrote:
The sheer volume of drivel that comes out of Rhes is frankly amazing.

All of your arguments have been covered time and time again throughout this thread. I remember now why I stopped posting before, because I got tired of repeating myself to people who will just throw the same discredited arguments up over and over again.

I am still wondering why people reply on him.
the bad thing is ,when people do, i still see his repetitive futile attempts.

R.S.I2014
Cade Windstalker
#1900 - 2013-09-21 10:49:53 UTC
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
I know what you mean ,but tell that to a great part of the community ,that use a system that can,t even handle the char creator ,let alone let it walk around that one room.
Until now i was able to keep my gear up to speed ,by buying every 2,3 or 4 years a new pc and when needed replace components like the video card ,but not everybody does that.
Maybe the problem of some of the Goons is not dolls in space ,but they play this game on a overrated calculator and instead just confessing that ,they bring on the old space barbie stuff


Maybe, but those people should be even less concerned about Star Citizen because if the system requirements for the hangar are any indication the overall game is going to be worse on your hardware than the Eve Captain's Quarters is now, and it has plenty of room to be optimized and will probably always be optional to some degree.

Also I prefer to classify all horribly old PCs as toasters since you can find some rather powerful calculators these days Lol