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So this is it for eve, is this the future, is it?

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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#321 - 2013-08-29 22:45:31 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
10 ships = 15 minutes + 24 hours to destroy a POCO.

I think it highly amusing you don't get what I'm saying. I think you actually do but you're trying to justify wanting CCP to protect your assets rather than you doing it.

The most ironic thing about this whole thread, is you and a bunch of Goons trying to justify why their 100m isk POCO shouldn't be allowed to be ganked by a small to medium gang when the Goons, and most of EvE are totally cool with gankiing billion isk freighters in highsec.

So I'll borrow a little off them and suggest that if you can't afford to lose it, don't anchor it. Don't expect CCP to hand hold you. Null sec is not supposed to be safe, for you or your POCO.

You said quite clearly:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The requirement to bring 10 ships and spend 3 hours to put a 100m isk module into reinforced mode so someone can not do PI for a day? That's ludicrous imbalanced.

Yet now you add reinforced mode. You as a small group can disrupt a POCO for 24 hours with very little time investment. No structure should be able to be completely destroyed in a single session as that would just mean everyone runs around when their enemy is offline destroying everything. That wouldn't be fun for anyone.

The short of it is, you want to kill our stuff, but you don;t want to put the effort in. At the same time, you think we should have to put whole groups of pilots on 24 hour standby to guard every POCO. It's stupid and you bloody well know it is.

You've been playing the game long enough to not be this stupid, so stop sitting around crying and play the fuckin game.

Hah. Boat's final victory over POCOs approaches.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
JinSanJong
Doomheim
#322 - 2013-08-29 23:02:48 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
10 ships = 15 minutes + 24 hours to destroy a POCO.

I think it highly amusing you don't get what I'm saying. I think you actually do but you're trying to justify wanting CCP to protect your assets rather than you doing it.

The most ironic thing about this whole thread, is you and a bunch of Goons trying to justify why their 100m isk POCO shouldn't be allowed to be ganked by a small to medium gang when the Goons, and most of EvE are totally cool with gankiing billion isk freighters in highsec.

So I'll borrow a little off them and suggest that if you can't afford to lose it, don't anchor it. Don't expect CCP to hand hold you. Null sec is not supposed to be safe, for you or your POCO.

You said quite clearly:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
The requirement to bring 10 ships and spend 3 hours to put a 100m isk module into reinforced mode so someone can not do PI for a day? That's ludicrous imbalanced.

Yet now you add reinforced mode. You as a small group can disrupt a POCO for 24 hours with very little time investment. No structure should be able to be completely destroyed in a single session as that would just mean everyone runs around when their enemy is offline destroying everything. That wouldn't be fun for anyone.

The short of it is, you want to kill our stuff, but you don;t want to put the effort in. At the same time, you think we should have to put whole groups of pilots on 24 hour standby to guard every POCO. It's stupid and you bloody well know it is.

You've been playing the game long enough to not be this stupid, so stop sitting around crying and play the fuckin game.


Why is it stupid? Isnt the whole point that you ARE supposed to defend those assets? Are you not supposed to really have around the clock guards? I mean everyone or thing important as 24/7 arm guards don't they on earth?
Mayhaw Morgan
State War Academy
Caldari State
#323 - 2013-08-29 23:04:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Mayhaw Morgan
Lucas Kell wrote:
Yet now you add reinforced mode. You as a small group can disrupt a POCO for 24 hours with very little time investment. No structure should be able to be completely destroyed in a single session as that would just mean everyone runs around when their enemy is offline destroying everything. That wouldn't be fun for anyone.


How is you blowing up a Mackinaw in high sec in 15 seconds any different? I'll tell you how: A Mackinaw is worth twice as much as a POCO and the person flying it doesn't get extra warning or extra chances to save it. It's a double standard. Newbs play EVE Online. Null sec veterans play Farmville. We all know your argument is bullshit and that you really just like the system as it currently is because it gives you an unfair advantage. That's fine. But if you continue to shovel logical fallacies and bogus, self-motivated "justifications" for the system, we're probably going to shoot them down. Sorry. Your dogs don't hunt.

Lucas Kell wrote:
The short of it is, you want to kill our stuff, but you don;t want to put the effort in. At the same time, you think we should have to put whole groups of pilots on 24 hour standby to guard every POCO. It's stupid and you bloody well know it is.


What effort was put in to putting the structure up? That should be a comparative effort that is used to decide how much effort is required to take it down. And you don't get to count a 4000 player battle for the system, because the effort on one side is cancelled out by the effort of the other side in that battle. What happens afterward is its own event.

If you're too unorganized or short sighted to figure out how to protect your space empire AT ALL TIMES, then you shouldn't have one. In the real world, the police, the military, the fire department, the hospital emergency room, and even the freakin' donut shop are on station ready to perform their duty 24 hours a day. Your house doesn't go into reinforced mode when it's burning down and no one is going to wait almost TWO DAYS to get their donuts and coffee after ordering them.
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#324 - 2013-08-29 23:19:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
Taking a POCO out for 24 hours or even managing to take it down because you're all down in Delve and cba to clonejump back to defend it right now doesn't really reap any benefits for the attacker unless he is sure it takes the owner so long to blob it back he gets his own POCO and PI structures investment back and that would still make it worth the attackers time.
I'd rather recommend self destructing noobships and collecting the unit of Trit each time as a more rewarding activity.

Incapacitating a POCO (atually I'm aiming at moongoo POSes) if it just vomited a certain percentage (let's say 25%) of the contents out just for reinforcing it would suffice to make nullsec a lot more interesting place.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#325 - 2013-08-30 00:00:53 UTC
That's hilarious, Keep on posting.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#326 - 2013-08-30 00:30:44 UTC
Well - of course you would reap the benefits for the most part as you have the largest numbers, tons of dread capable pilots etc..., but I don't really care, closest I have been to a SOV holding alliance was Cry Havoc and I left them over 5 years ago because they were too sov-holding for my taste.

Take all space you want, I don't want it, I just want to hit a piñata with a stick every once in a while and have some candy falling out of it.

I like candy :).
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#327 - 2013-08-30 00:34:29 UTC
Go gank some miners.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#328 - 2013-08-30 00:40:56 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Rhes wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
I want to blow your lame POCO's up without being required to wait for 24 hours and have a blob waiting because they got warned.


Just stick to ganking ratters and cyno ships. Hardly any waiting and zero effort. Have fun in nullsec!

I'll kill whatever I like - except your precious POCO... now go do some PI yeah


PI is for plebs

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#329 - 2013-08-30 00:45:14 UTC
I do occasionally, but don't bother to loot them most of the time as it's not worth my time - moonogoo POSes wouldn't be as well in most cases (assuming the 25%), but being able to hit reaction poses and have them vomit up 24% of that would probably induce an erection again. 
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#330 - 2013-08-30 00:48:25 UTC
Uh huh.

What next, if you shoot a few missiles at a station it should give you the stuff inside

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#331 - 2013-08-30 01:13:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
It would lead to a shift.

You grew up with goons, so it's perfectly understandable you assume you should have the right to have yor leaders have an announcement, have them decide over the issue and then receive a jabber ping if you should clonejump or not, board a ship that has been fitted for you with a fit you wasted no second of thought upon because it was predetermined and hit F1.

No issues with that - to each his own, but not my style.

So I guess I'll have to sit on my huge fat reposists whilst you accumulate even more and we bore us to death until Mittens asks for a change because he runs out of options to guide people throgh the sandbox as if it was a themepark.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#332 - 2013-08-30 01:40:26 UTC
My pvp characters are in their ships in the staging system. I don't buy prefitted Hounds or Archons.

I don't see what you're getting at.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#333 - 2013-08-30 01:57:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
Well, obviously, you'e playing dumb due to being too tired of the discussion and I know trolling well enough to not be trolled into writing an essay starting with the birds and bees all over again and I know you're not that dumb.

I'm not anti-goon and highly appreciate you efforts vs. highsec income, but the world is not black and white, it's only shades of pink.

Have a nice day.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Theodoric Darkwind
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#334 - 2013-08-30 02:24:08 UTC
JinSanJong wrote:
Just one giant doughnut of renter space!? Is this what eve has now become?
There's something seriously wrong here. How can an alliance hold space and yet not live there and then rent it out? Surely the game is about gaining space, and keeping hold of it? The amount of nullsec thats now become rental space is just crazy,

OK OK, some might say, well we are getting more people into nullsec, we are allowing people that couldnt get into nullsec a chance to. OK we will charge them stupidly high prices but meh we dont want that space anyway. and herein lies the problem.

Why arent nullsec alliances exploiting the mining riches, the anomolies etc to make there isk like everyone else has to, instead of being lazy so and so's? Really they should be having mass mining ops, or large anomaly bashing ops instead of being carebears (which ironically they moan about high sec carebears) these are 10x worse. They wont do anything, they cry about their passive moon income being nerf because they simply cannot be bothered to go an actually make isk.

Is this really where eve has gone and going?

I mean yeah live in a region and have a few renters to make that extra income like some alliance do, but look at Northern Associates for instance (N3)

http://evemaps.dotlan.net/alliance/Northern_Associates.

I mean what 10 regions or more just PURELY to rent. Surely it cant be just me that sees something wrong here.


Mining and ratting provide individual income, not alliance income. Most alliances never use all their space, so why not have some renters in there to generate alliance income from what would typically be unused or underused space.

Alliance income funds things like ship reimbursement programs and capital ship subsidies that help the alliance to defend their space better and conquer new space.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#335 - 2013-08-30 02:39:01 UTC
Be a goon renter, help perpetuate their "gameplay" all over the face of new eden

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#336 - 2013-08-30 03:19:11 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Be a goon renter, help perpetuate their "gameplay" all over the face of new eden


You never needed us before, don't start now.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#337 - 2013-08-30 04:32:33 UTC
Mayhaw Morgan wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Yet now you add reinforced mode. You as a small group can disrupt a POCO for 24 hours with very little time investment. No structure should be able to be completely destroyed in a single session as that would just mean everyone runs around when their enemy is offline destroying everything. That wouldn't be fun for anyone.


How is you blowing up a Mackinaw in high sec in 15 seconds any different? I'll tell you how: A Mackinaw is worth twice as much as a POCO and the person flying it doesn't get extra warning or extra chances to save it. It's a double standard. Newbs play EVE Online. Null sec veterans play Farmville. We all know your argument is bullshit and that you really just like the system as it currently is because it gives you an unfair advantage. That's fine. But if you continue to shovel logical fallacies and bogus, self-motivated "justifications" for the system, we're probably going to shoot them down. Sorry. Your dogs don't hunt.

Lucas Kell wrote:
The short of it is, you want to kill our stuff, but you don;t want to put the effort in. At the same time, you think we should have to put whole groups of pilots on 24 hour standby to guard every POCO. It's stupid and you bloody well know it is.


What effort was put in to putting the structure up? That should be a comparative effort that is used to decide how much effort is required to take it down. And you don't get to count a 4000 player battle for the system, because the effort on one side is cancelled out by the effort of the other side in that battle. What happens afterward is its own event.

If you're too unorganized or short sighted to figure out how to protect your space empire AT ALL TIMES, then you shouldn't have one. In the real world, the police, the military, the fire department, the hospital emergency room, and even the freakin' donut shop are on station ready to perform their duty 24 hours a day. Your house doesn't go into reinforced mode when it's burning down and no one is going to wait almost TWO DAYS to get their donuts and coffee after ordering them.

No I think they're right you know. Goonswarm needs time to defend their POCO's. First they need to send a scout to check numbers. Then they need to form up their fleets. Then they need to check again to make sure numbers haven't spiked. Then they have to send a bunch of cynos alts out. Then they have to form up more fleets. And then, only then, are they capable of taking on a small to medium gang of subcaps.

I mean, you can't expect a 12000 man alliance to have enough members on at low population hours to defend themselves. That's crazy thinking man.

Makes perfect sense for a 100m isk module to take 24 hours to kill. How foolish were we...

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#338 - 2013-08-30 04:38:35 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
Bi-Mi Lansatha wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:
...yes they have...
Cool... history.

I can think of a couple that might apply, but would you mind listing which ones you are referencing?


I think some people just like beeing deaf and blind, thats the reason why its happening
Non Sequitur response on your part. Try again.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#339 - 2013-08-30 04:56:59 UTC
It's pointless.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Rhes
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#340 - 2013-08-30 05:17:15 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Makes perfect sense for a 100m isk module to take 24 hours to kill. How foolish were we...


Considering the number of bad posts you're making about this topic I'm left wondering why you aren't willing to put the same amount of effort into actually killing some POCOs.

EVE is a game about spaceships and there's an enormous amount of work to do on the in-space gameplay before players (or developers) are ready to sacrifice it for a totally new type of gameplay - CCP Rise