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[Odyssey] Navy Battleships

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TehCloud
Guardians of the Dodixie
#1421 - 2013-06-05 20:21:49 UTC
Guyshen Takeru wrote:
Look I don't understand why CCP thinks they're doing the eve online community any favors by nerfing the F**k Out of our Navy Issue Battleships, Honestly If You Guys keep screwing up Eve For the rest of us I may as well quit.


You obviously have no idea what you're talking about.

The only ships that didn't get totally amazing are the NApoc, the NMega and the TFI.
THe others are friggin awesome now.

My Condor costs less than that module!
TheFace Asano
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1422 - 2013-06-05 20:47:20 UTC
Samas Sarum wrote:
Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


Used the CNR with the new cruise at a Sansha Forsaken Hub last night. First off there are now elite frigs that can spawn with them unlike before the patch.

Setup includes 1x rigor rig, 1x TP, 4x BCU and Tech 2 CML, used Fury or Precision ammo as no faction was available close to me. Not only did it kill really fast, it moved fast as well. I threw on a nanofiber just for the fun of it, the CNR moves at 160 with my skills with a nanofiber 2. Pretty good for a BS and you can close in on Targets or kite them. I stayed at around 80km and took only slight damage.

Battleships: These take usually 4 hits to kill with Fury. Without the TP 5 hits. Massive alpha makes these great now. 1 hit to get through the shield, 2 to break the armor tank and the last one to finish them off in deep hull.
Cruisers: One shots non-elite cruisers with precision ammo. 3-4 hits with Fury or precision on elite cruisers.
Frigs: most of the time one shot with precision. Even the elite frigs seemed to all get one shot.

All in all it works on all target levels really well, and feels brutally effective with tech 2 ammo.
Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#1423 - 2013-06-06 06:31:33 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
BTW the new CNR is MUCH better for pvE han it used to be. I mean a lot.


Mal, you forgot the obligatory "we told you so" Big smile
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#1424 - 2013-06-06 07:49:22 UTC
Caitlyn Tufy wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
BTW the new CNR is MUCH better for pvE han it used to be. I mean a lot.


Mal, you forgot the obligatory "we told you so" Big smile


I was tired and I forgot :(

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
BiggestT
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1425 - 2013-06-06 11:11:04 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Samas Sarum wrote:


Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


It kills rats faster and tanks better, I mean I don't know what you look for in a PvE ship?


Quoting for truth.

Tried it today and it murders everything, you don't even need to slap drones on the frigs, the cruise do it just fine.

4-5 volleys for an npc BS using standard t1 ammo is just cruel.
TehCloud
Guardians of the Dodixie
#1426 - 2013-06-06 12:13:52 UTC
BiggestT wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Samas Sarum wrote:


Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


It kills rats faster and tanks better, I mean I don't know what you look for in a PvE ship?


Quoting for truth.

Tried it today and it murders everything, you don't even need to slap drones on the frigs, the cruise do it just fine.

4-5 volleys for an npc BS using standard t1 ammo is just cruel.


I love how several people were always foretelling that exactly this would be what happens and yet the whining didn't stop and people claimed the CNR was broken and useless :D

Now that Odyssey is live not a single post on how the CNR is bad.

I feel like a black woman in hindsight

My Condor costs less than that module!
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1427 - 2013-06-06 15:18:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
TehCloud wrote:
BiggestT wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Samas Sarum wrote:


Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


It kills rats faster and tanks better, I mean I don't know what you look for in a PvE ship?


Quoting for truth.

Tried it today and it murders everything, you don't even need to slap drones on the frigs, the cruise do it just fine.

4-5 volleys for an npc BS using standard t1 ammo is just cruel.


I love how several people were always foretelling that exactly this would be what happens and yet the whining didn't stop and people claimed the CNR was broken and useless :D

Now that Odyssey is live not a single post on how the CNR is bad.

I feel like a black woman in hindsight


LOL +1

I haven't met anyone in game who doesn't like the new CNR, and like TheFace Asano said, it's murder in null sec anoms, pure murder.

The problems in discussions like what we had about the CNR vs Golem and Floon etc (if you could call it that lol) is that how thing look on paper and how they perform in game are often wildly different things.

Raw stats don't take into account the fact that (for example) the supposed supperioirty of the Floon and Golem comes at the cost of much more intensive, long and diverse skill training. Raw stats don't take into account all the damage application mitigating factors (like range, tracking, non-sentry drone travel time, defender missiles, target painter cycle times and juggling) etc etc) or so many other variables. So you end up with some things looking great on paper but in game it's different.

The Floon and Golem are great, but the CNR gets the job done in super surprising ways while being easier to train for with incredible bonuses (people STILL underestimate the usefulness of a missile speed bonus in PVE it seems).

There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.
Cage Man
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Pandemic Horde
#1428 - 2013-06-06 19:51:31 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:


There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.


That reason is that people are stuck in the old ways\EFT warriors... get one, shield fit it and try it is all I can say..
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#1429 - 2013-06-06 20:20:07 UTC
Cage Man wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.


That reason is that people are stuck in the old ways\EFT warriors... get one, shield fit it and try it is all I can say..


Yes.

The phoon is incontrovertibly /better/ however it is also harder work.

It's a case of you get out what you put in. I use the raven when I can't be bothered.

/shrug.
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#1430 - 2013-06-06 20:41:53 UTC
When are these going be unstickied to give Page 1 back to Player Posts? Odyssey is in and the Feedback and Issues threads are active. Why not replace these with a "Link Sticky" to those two threads?

We all know how lazy we are to go clicking...wait for it...past Page 3 of this Forum section. Blink

[b]Fast Character Switching "XP Stylee" Undocking - More Routes Out of Station[/b] Here's my tear jar > |_| < Fill 'er up!
TehCloud
Guardians of the Dodixie
#1431 - 2013-06-07 01:37:28 UTC
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
When are these going be unstickied to give Page 1 back to Player Posts? Odyssey is in and the Feedback and Issues threads are active. Why not replace these with a "Link Sticky" to those two threads?

We all know how lazy we are to go clicking...wait for it...past Page 3 of this Forum section. Blink

Wow you post that crap on every sticky here but scrolling or swapping pages is too much work.

But tbh, I'd rather read all those stickies instead of the 15 NERF AFK CLOAK Threads that usually appear on Page 1

My Condor costs less than that module!
Johnson Oramara
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1432 - 2013-06-07 11:13:34 UTC
TehCloud wrote:
BiggestT wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Samas Sarum wrote:


Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


It kills rats faster and tanks better, I mean I don't know what you look for in a PvE ship?


Quoting for truth.

Tried it today and it murders everything, you don't even need to slap drones on the frigs, the cruise do it just fine.

4-5 volleys for an npc BS using standard t1 ammo is just cruel.


I love how several people were always foretelling that exactly this would be what happens and yet the whining didn't stop and people claimed the CNR was broken and useless :D

Now that Odyssey is live not a single post on how the CNR is bad.

I feel like a black woman in hindsight

Well here's your first, it's just poor now. I'm meeting people really happy about their CNR doing more damage than before until i suggest them to check out how Raven, Phoon or TFI compares and they go in denial, rage or just stay silent looking at the numbers.

Heck i did mission with one guy who had CNR and i had regular Raven and was killing stuff just as fast and tanking just as well.
Needless to say he was totally confused because he had cruise spec L5 and missile damage implant. And a cheap Raven performed just as well.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1433 - 2013-06-07 14:16:18 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:

There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.
The 'Phoon FI has always been a really cheap faction BS. The thing is that it doesn't apply DPS as easily, takes more skill to use, and is harder to fit. The CNR has tons of fitting (and the SNI even more, for that matter).

Personally, I'm going to be using both - CNR for shield fleets and raw DPS, 'Phoon FI for armour and for more utility.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1434 - 2013-06-07 14:31:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Josilin du Guesclin
Johnson Oramara wrote:

Well here's your first, it's just poor now. I'm meeting people really happy about their CNR doing more damage than before until i suggest them to check out how Raven, Phoon or TFI compares and they go in denial, rage or just stay silent looking at the numbers.

Heck i did mission with one guy who had CNR and i had regular Raven and was killing stuff just as fast and tanking just as well.
Needless to say he was totally confused because he had cruise spec L5 and missile damage implant. And a cheap Raven performed just as well.

[stupid forums ate post - let's try again]

Okay, if the regular Raven performed as well as the CNR, the mission wasn't hard enough for it to matter what you were flying.

The CNR has a considerably better tank, is faster and more agile, has better lock time, higher sustained DPS (because it needs to reload its launchers less often), and better applied DPS on anything smaller than battleships (and on BS as well if you use Fury on them). The CNR also has a bigger drone bay and more bandwidth, as an added little bonus.

TL;DR: You are wrong.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#1435 - 2013-06-07 14:41:34 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Cage Man wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.


That reason is that people are stuck in the old ways\EFT warriors... get one, shield fit it and try it is all I can say..


Yes.

The phoon is incontrovertibly /better/ however it is also harder work.

It's a case of you get out what you put in. I use the raven when I can't be bothered.

/shrug.


Which is exactly what I said about 30 pages back and then got jumped on by the rabble rabble rabble

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#1436 - 2013-06-07 14:43:41 UTC
Johnson Oramara wrote:
TehCloud wrote:
BiggestT wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Samas Sarum wrote:


Also, can you elaborate on why you think the new CNR is a lot better in PvE?


It kills rats faster and tanks better, I mean I don't know what you look for in a PvE ship?


Quoting for truth.

Tried it today and it murders everything, you don't even need to slap drones on the frigs, the cruise do it just fine.

4-5 volleys for an npc BS using standard t1 ammo is just cruel.


I love how several people were always foretelling that exactly this would be what happens and yet the whining didn't stop and people claimed the CNR was broken and useless :D

Now that Odyssey is live not a single post on how the CNR is bad.

I feel like a black woman in hindsight

Well here's your first, it's just poor now. I'm meeting people really happy about their CNR doing more damage than before until i suggest them to check out how Raven, Phoon or TFI compares and they go in denial, rage or just stay silent looking at the numbers.

Heck i did mission with one guy who had CNR and i had regular Raven and was killing stuff just as fast and tanking just as well.
Needless to say he was totally confused because he had cruise spec L5 and missile damage implant. And a cheap Raven performed just as well.


Yeah no you weren't. I mean unless you were doing a L3 or something.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1437 - 2013-06-07 15:06:47 UTC
Cage Man wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:


There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.


That reason is that people are stuck in the old ways\EFT warriors... get one, shield fit it and try it is all I can say..

Try the ships i've been flying for weeks because I go to SiSi and actually try stuff?

The CNR is supurb. Easier to fit the way i like than the Floon, not needing to juggle painters as with the Golem, not losing so much dps to defenders like the Golem etc.

I don't like the CNR because I have to, I like it because it rocks , even compared to the Floon and Golem.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#1438 - 2013-06-07 15:14:58 UTC
Josilin du Guesclin wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:

There are reasons the Typhoon Fleet Issue is still 300 mil in Jita and the Navy Raven costs twice as much.
The 'Phoon FI has always been a really cheap faction BS. The thing is that it doesn't apply DPS as easily, takes more skill to use, and is harder to fit. The CNR has tons of fitting (and the SNI even more, for that matter).

Personally, I'm going to be using both - CNR for shield fleets and raw DPS, 'Phoon FI for armour and for more utility.



Don't get me wrong, nothing wrong with the Floon i've been dual boxing lvl 4 missions with a Floon and CNR (taking a small break from null sec this week just for a change up) and it's an awesome combination. Beyond Awesome.

I'm just saying it funny seeing how well received the CNR is when certain people in this thread predicted rage and declared the CNR "useless". As I said then, a ship is more than it's stats, EVE is a complex environment and I don't even know if its possible to take all the variables into consideration.

The CNR has performed so well I took my high sec mission running Machariel and re-riged it for incursions (allowing me to sell my vindi and buy a carrier I've been needing on an alt). Again, it's jsut fun to watch all the poo-pooing of the CNR get trashed.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1439 - 2013-06-08 11:46:03 UTC
Having just got to try out the CNR and 'Phoon FI today (WH geometry and RL having prevented us getting new ships in until yesterday), I have to say that the CNR is awesome. My main doesn't have perfect skills yet, including not having Minnie BS V, and the Phoon really needs BS V to compete with the CNR because it relies on the hull bonus for DPS while the CNR just has a ton of launchers. However, the Phoon can mount a serious (buffer - we run small fleets for WH ops, with logi) armour tank, so it has a place as an armour tanked missile ship, and I'm looking forward to it getting stronger and stronger in that role as my pilot's skills improve.

The CNR is tons of fun - I haven't enjoyed throwing missiles as much since I first got a Drake, back before all the Drake and HML nerfs.
Klingon Admiral
Carcinisation
#1440 - 2013-06-08 13:46:37 UTC
Sadly, the NApoc can no longer be considered a serious missionboat ... running out of capcharges in the middle of a Vengeance (which really is far from being a "hard" lvl4) with maxed Legion-armorlinks is kind of emberassing.

In fact, the cap situation on a pulse-NApoc is now WORSE than the cap-situation on my Tachyon-NApoc which I flew months ago. Should have gotten a second Paladin ... these babies don't have cap issues at all.