Warfare & Tactics

This is his main, I think. He was with Huang Yinglong- a Minmatar RP corp. He's an LOL RPer hence his desire to be fully immersed in the spaceship world. RP > RL

I've already tested this.. Yes you can still dock in any station out side of FW space. Example, while I couldn't dock in Ostingele I could dock in Pelille which is right next to Ost.

This is why I mentioned early on in this topic, that even if Caldari loses all our low sec station systems we can still fight all around the map with out much issues. On other hand if Gals lose all their station systems they will have much harder time trying to live any where near Black Rise.

Also to those that haven't noticed all the LP costs in the FW store have gone back to "normal" cost for ships. FW stores seems to no longer get the FW discount with BS's at 150k LP but now are 600K LP for a Scorp Navy Issue & Navy Ravens were 1 million LP..

Meanwhile over at the State War station, Navy Ravens were still 600k. Meaning the selling of faction BS hulls will go back into the hands of neutral running LVL 5's. Sure is great benifit to fight for your Militia when some carebear can get the same ship for 400k less LP..


edit.. also at current datacore prices you will actually lose ISK trading in your LP's for them. They cost 1k LP + 1 mil ISK for 5 Datacores. The data cores on the markets are around 100k each and there are probably crap loads of them yet to be dumpstered into the market by all the guys cashing theirs in with this change.

Who knows how long it will take to burn through all the ones out there + the ones that have already been bought up by speculators. Either way it will likely be a long time before they become profitable for the average FW guy to sell.

I vaguely recall MM. Don't let him/her/it(?) give you the wrong impression of the rest of Huang Yinglong. lolRPers they may be, but they are among some of the best Minmitar fighters out there.

Anyways... we're getting sidetracked here.


The simple fact of the matter is... these new mechanics are deeply flawed, have numerous loop holes, encourage people to use said loopholes, and take away from the "roving packs of dogs" mentality that many of us in FW cherish (and revel in).
I said it before and I'll say it again; I didn't join Faction Warfare to play "0.0 lite." I joined Faction Warfare to get kills... preferably while drunk... without having to deal with the hassle and drama of organizing people who generally don't want to work together in the first place (the term "herding cats" comes to mind).

People say FW as it is has no goal or objective... I disagree. For me, it's all about casually killing people who live right next door to you and then shouting at each other like a bunch of hairless prepubescent boys while chest beating. It's one of the last places in EVE where egos can form, grow, and clash with one another without being bogged down in politics and obligatory operations.

Well I plan to do that still to the opposing force like we do every night. Drama, dude join caldari and meet drama.

There will always be drama,

Nobody is saying that FW is vital to EVE or that it's currently a success. What we're saying is that these new changes won't help, they will quite possibly make things even worse.

CCP creates an expansion to make FW more popular -> FW becomes less popular -> expansion is a failure.

Yes, And I used to be one of the best FW fleet commanders on the servers. I quit eve over FW being abandoned. I was one of the bigest people pushing for FW before it's release.

This is my main, and while these changes might not be the magic bullet, you better believe I will get back in FW if CCP actully bring life back into it.

I just couldn't bring myself to log in anymore once no one was playing anymore. Everyone was so active and pumped for the 1st year of FW, as we waited , and waited for some changes. we all asked CCP to add some reason to take over systems, for better rewards.

At some point all that was left was to run FW missions, and hope to get some ok PvP from a passing enemy who is also doing cloaky missions.

I have over 13,000 posts on the eve forums, have helped the original CSMs, created the seemless eveonline desktop background you'll find if you ever try to find the eve video wall papers on eve files.

I helped create the awesome eve offline top down shooter back in the day with tarminic, Back when his post were forced to be pink. I fought in the alliance tournament.

I've quit huang to join eve university. And promote our rp corp through eve university to new players, teach them th ropes and send them off to our corp. Because honestly I'm a busy busy busy person in real life. I work as a 3d environment artist on major titles you've most likely at some point had your hands on. If you've ever been to or sent a kid to IDtech camp in the states, you've been effected by lesson plans created by myself as lead instructor.

So I'm sorry if I'm upset that after 3 years CCP might actually finally make some change to the part of the game that killed my passion to play eve. All I could think was CCP doesn't care, and they will never update FW, it's a lost cause. I'm not the only one who sorta dropped out of eve because of this.

Blocking us out of stations isn't a big deal. Stations just outside of FW space will start to form into tiny trading hubs. Think of the money you could make setting up a corp just to sell to FW members that are behind enemy lines. Besides all you need is a POS somewhere, and you can use that instead of a station.

Also as a major Fleet commander of the minmatar militia back in the day, I'm sorry but I don't seem to think I saw many of your names in FW. I would love a reason to log back into eve and play FW again. and to be honest I only ever made plex money off of Grinding firetails, so I could slowly wait for even a small update for FW. I've waited 3 years , and it's happening, in just a month FW might be wroth something again. So I'll fight to see that come to fruit!

Besides, like i said, if the changes go live and it's not fun, then we ask them to change it again. NOTHING COULD BE WORSE THAN WHAT WE HAVE NOW. And the fact that CCP released it with as much hype as they did and then abandoned it still makes me face palm. Didn't you see how epic that expansion was? There was a book, and real in game events. News reports, and even a trailer in the movies. FW has been the biggest disappointment eve has ever seen. yes even bigger than Incarna. Because FW is real in space gameplay. And ignoring a feature that was hyped and built up so effectively, for over 3 years, is disrespectful to the playerbase.

So please, I be you guys, don't fight this change, let it happen, no one is left in FW anyways. If anything this might be a good change after all, and if it's not, FW is already a broken piece of trash, they can just try again, or maybe even abandon it for another 3 years, whatever.

And for what it is worth - the main issue I see that is kind of at the root of everyone's complaints:

Whatever changes are made, the best (or even a good) counter should NOT be a meta-game solution. e.g. Neutral alts to get around the station lockout, using mostly unskilled alts to run missions and LP flood IHUBS, or using alt corps to grief the other side (especially that unlike 0.0 corps, we cant control who our "allies" are because anyone can join FacWar).

Regardless, I like the sound of most of the changes. I just hope that they are tweaked properly to avoid the issues described above.

I agree with this but its tricky just talk about changes as being a success or failure in general.

What one person sees as a success another will see as a failure. Those players who are inclined to play eve like it is a second job and don't mind long waits for large fleets to form up and want to put in lots of effort for large returns will no doubt like these changes. And indeed many null sec players have expressed their happieness with these changes.


Those of us who don't look at eve like a second job but like the casual nature and frequent small scale pvp faction war offers will likely not be happy with the no docking rule and some other "hard core" changes.


IMO these changes are a failure not because people will drop out of faction war. I don't think the numbers in fw will necessarilly decrease in the long run. I think many people who like the null sec style of play will take the places left by people who prefered the casual small scale pvp fw now offers.


I think this is a failure because Eve will no longer be catering to as many diverse play styles. After faction war becomes "null sec lite" what mechanic will cater to people who like the frequent small scale pvp that fw used to offer?

Its a shame that instead of iterating on the strengths of fw through the years, CCP left it abandoned and now just want to force null sec mechanics down our throats. Had they done the former they might now have a much larger player base of casual pvpers. Of course, its never too late to start working that angle they just need to choose to do that.

Actually, it could. There is some serious discussion among some of the more established FW corps/alliances... and there is a general feeling that it would be easier/simpler to just drop out of FW and go "full pirate"... leaving SP-less alts to do all the grunt work in plex capturing/defending.

Plus... the way the new mechanics are worded (at least, the way we are understanding them), even as "technical neutrals" we would continue to gain most of the system upgrade benefits. Hell... we could LET the "enemy" take over the system, upgrade it at their cost, and STILL kill them while reaping the benefits of THEIR efforts.

Someone explain to me how that is NOT broken?

I think this is the logical consequence based on what we know so far.

So far the only advantage to keep a pvp character in the militia would be you will also get lp for you pvp kills. However unless they make that easy to exploit I doubt it can be very much lp.