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Balancing Feedback: Hybrid Turrets

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Alara IonStorm
#901 - 2011-11-16 21:35:51 UTC
Mariner6 wrote:

1) May I ask where you get this info? Is there a general all EVE kill board?

2) If this is accurate then this is by far the best stat I've seen proving the case of not just Hybrids sucking but Gallente as a whole.

http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20
Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#902 - 2011-11-16 22:03:02 UTC
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
thoth rothschild
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#903 - 2011-11-16 22:07:47 UTC  |  Edited by: thoth rothschild
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


That would make a difference !
It makes vindicators a little scary
Sigras
Conglomo
#904 - 2011-11-16 22:13:28 UTC
Magosian wrote:
Honestly? I want hybrids to do something better than lasers and projectiles. Hybrids need appeal. THAT would be a good start. No doubt tweaking of stats would be needed after the fact. A fundamental change needs to happen first. Modifying stats on a fundamentally broken turret just means you're making the weapon further excel at being broken. I honestly don't see Crucible hybrid changes fixing anything.

It's one change, maybe two, and I doubt it would be sweeping. Something like omni-damage hybrid ammo and a slight boost to range would be a good start. CCP can keep all the Crucible stuff.

honestly, I dont think your proposed changes do anything more than CCPs changes . . . now instead of doing a ton of kinetic thermal damage pretty much never, blasters would do a ton of all types of damage pretty much never. unless by "slight boost to range" you mean > 200% medium sized blaster ships never get closer than 15 km . . .

Hungry Eyes wrote:
sure, let them do it incrementally. as long as people realize this thing will drag out for an entire year. theyre just not getting my money until balance is established, simple as that. to me, this "expansion" is really garbage, gameplay-wise, because im not getting anything that was on that original list. maybe in 6 months, there will be something to see here.

CCP:

- hybrid/Gallente balancing
- FW
- nullsec
- AF's

do it. until then, please dont call graphical updates "expansions." jesus. move along people, just another CCP moment.





and i want my 4.95 back. seriously.

wow . . . you really havent been playing this game very long have you? or really any game . . . balance is something that takes small tweaks over a long period of time. How long after the release of starcraft were they tweaking balance changes? and they only had 3 groups to deal with, in eve the possible combinations are an order of magnitude greater than starcraft at least.

Also, way to skip over the changes they did make
rail balancing (not sure how this is going to go yet)
customs offices BPCs as a buff to FW (I imagine this is going to be a large FW LP sink)
Supercap balancing (a HUGE nullsec change)
POS Fuel changes
Tier 3 battlecruisers
0.0 anomalies rebalance (another nullsec change)
etc
Magosian
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#905 - 2011-11-16 22:16:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Magosian
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


Eh.

Ok, another step in the right direction, and probably the FIRST of steps to change hybrids at a fundamental level. So far so good....

BUT

My ammo options are faction antimatter, dog poop, cat poop, horse poop, and cow poop. Which one doesn't stink?

No point in swapping ammo instantly when I only have one ammo type worth using. More cowbell, please.

EDIT: Hrm, come to think of it, I was on test about 12 hours ago. Is there a new client download then? I'm curious if the change is server-side or client-side. Either way, it was definitely a 5 second reload about 12 hours ago.
Magosian
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#906 - 2011-11-16 22:20:34 UTC
Sigras wrote:
Magosian wrote:
Honestly? I want hybrids to do something better than lasers and projectiles. Hybrids need appeal. THAT would be a good start. No doubt tweaking of stats would be needed after the fact. A fundamental change needs to happen first. Modifying stats on a fundamentally broken turret just means you're making the weapon further excel at being broken. I honestly don't see Crucible hybrid changes fixing anything.

It's one change, maybe two, and I doubt it would be sweeping. Something like omni-damage hybrid ammo and a slight boost to range would be a good start. CCP can keep all the Crucible stuff.


honestly, I dont think your proposed changes do anything more than CCPs changes . . . now instead of doing a ton of kinetic thermal damage pretty much never, blasters would do a ton of all types of damage pretty much never. unless by "slight boost to range" you mean > 200% medium sized blaster ships never get closer than 15 km . . .


START is the keyword. I think we're in full agreement that "slight" increases to blaster range isn't enough on its own.

Frankly, hybrids still need character. We can worry about range after that.
OT Smithers
A Farewell To Kings...
Dock Workers
#907 - 2011-11-16 22:46:43 UTC
Sigras wrote:
guys, seriously what do you want?

If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast
if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!

Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.

Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right?


People want this and the other issues important to them fixed. Whatever CCP might say, no matter their "promises," whatever goes live now -- no matter how poorly balanced it might be -- is what we will be looking at for the forseeable future, and likely until they pull the plug on the game.

Nor is there ANY reason to believe that CCP has any intention of following through on this new direction. Already they have failed to deliver a good number of their promised features in this winter expansion.
OT Smithers
A Farewell To Kings...
Dock Workers
#908 - 2011-11-16 22:48:21 UTC
Hungry Eyes wrote:
Sigras wrote:
guys, seriously what do you want?

If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast
if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!

Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.

Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right?



sure, let them do it incrementally. as long as people realize this thing will drag out for an entire year. theyre just not getting my money until balance is established, simple as that. to me, this "expansion" is really garbage, gameplay-wise, because im not getting anything that was on that original list. maybe in 6 months, there will be something to see here.

CCP:

- hybrid/Gallente balancing
- FW
- nullsec
- AF's

do it. until then, please dont call graphical updates "expansions." jesus. move along people, just another CCP moment.





and i want my 4.95 back. seriously.


+ >9000
Archare
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#909 - 2011-11-16 23:09:03 UTC
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


Currently on SIsi all weapons are bugged reloading instantly including missile launchers. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=372781#post372781
Nemesor
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#910 - 2011-11-16 23:09:59 UTC
Really it comes down to this: Would you stay with a Girlfriend that broke as many promises to you as CCP has in the last 4 years?
Hamox
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#911 - 2011-11-17 00:15:01 UTC
I like the idea that they are going to change things slowly to prevent the creation of the next FotM.
But the changes need to be done constantly and on a regular basis.
If we need to wait 6 month for the next little step and than again 6 month for the next step...
... well why should we wait so long and trust you to get the job done?
And what if you need 4 or 5 steps? Will we have to wait 2.5 years then?
That can't be serious! Where is the hidden camera?
Zarak1 Kenpach1
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#912 - 2011-11-17 00:20:48 UTC
Nemesor wrote:
Really it comes down to this: Would you stay with a Girlfriend that broke as many promises to you as CCP has in the last 4 years?



lol, dont let the door hit you on the way out nemmy
Aruken Marr
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#913 - 2011-11-17 00:25:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Aruken Marr
thoth rothschild wrote:
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


That would make a difference !
It makes vindicators a little scary


Its a bug. They had to change time in the code from s to ms, it just hasnt transferred over into the text. I believe its the same for missiles launchers aswell. They will update it and reload is still being changed to 5 s

edit

Archare wrote:
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


Currently on SIsi all weapons are bugged reloading instantly including missile launchers. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=372781#post372781


beat me to it. Links and all lol
Pattern Clarc
Citeregis
#914 - 2011-11-17 00:26:01 UTC
FYI, gallente speed boost is about 5-8% MWD speed increase with the greatest speed increase on the megathron...

Ex CSM member & Designer of the Tornado. Gallente - Pilot satisfaction
Grimpak
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#915 - 2011-11-17 00:40:04 UTC
Pattern Clarc wrote:
FYI, gallente speed boost is about 5-8% MWD speed increase with the greatest speed increase on the megathron...



soo... still going slow...

[img]http://eve-files.com/sig/grimpak[/img]

[quote]The more I know about humans, the more I love animals.[/quote] ain't that right
Aloe Cloveris
The Greater Goon
#916 - 2011-11-17 01:00:16 UTC
Bubanni wrote:
Dont know if you know this yet, but you guys sure have butterfingers...
Currently on sisi the reload time on hybrids os 0.005 sec... or insant basicly


Hush, you.
Mariner6
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#917 - 2011-11-17 01:54:43 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Mariner6 wrote:

1) May I ask where you get this info? Is there a general all EVE kill board?

2) If this is accurate then this is by far the best stat I've seen proving the case of not just Hybrids sucking but Gallente as a whole.

http://eve-kill.net/?a=top20


Thank you.
Sigras
Conglomo
#918 - 2011-11-17 02:09:03 UTC
OT Smithers wrote:
Sigras wrote:
guys, seriously what do you want?

If they make wide sweeping changes everyone screams that theyre changing too much too fast
if they change incrementally everyone screams that theyre doing nothing!

Personally I'd rather have this than them buffing blaster damage and range by 500% and giving gallente 90% webs back.

Ill be the first one upset if they dont continue to tweak blasters, but really, which would you rather have; a new FOTM or them slowly turn up the heat on blasters until theyre right?


People want this and the other issues important to them fixed. Whatever CCP might say, no matter their "promises," whatever goes live now -- no matter how poorly balanced it might be -- is what we will be looking at for the forseeable future, and likely until they pull the plug on the game.

Nor is there ANY reason to believe that CCP has any intention of following through on this new direction. Already they have failed to deliver a good number of their promised features in this winter expansion.

dude, if youre not willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on an MMO i dont know what to tell you . . . After seeing the complete 180 they've done in the last few weeks i think you should cut them some slack.
Alara IonStorm
#919 - 2011-11-17 03:42:48 UTC
Sigras wrote:

dude, if youre not willing to give them the benefit of the doubt on an MMO i dont know what to tell you . . . After seeing the complete 180 they've done in the last few weeks i think you should cut them some slack.

I know these Whiners just don't see the hard work CCP has done. They think it is a few token changes and back to ignoring old features for new shinnies. But they don't understand this is a new direction.

So sure Tyrannis is terrible but the upcoming Incursions expansion which is full of player requested Content, Fixes and Balance Changes is the new direction. CCP finally gets it. We never have to worry about another colossal failure like Tyrannis again.

It's Gonna be a Bright Future.
draconothese
Independant Celestial Enterprises
#920 - 2011-11-17 05:05:05 UTC
anyone have the updated hybride changes ?