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Team Avatar and the future of our prototype

First post First post First post
Author
Cade Windstalker
#1741 - 2013-09-18 17:22:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Cade Windstalker
oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:

Sometimes one must just not think of what one shall not think.

FAI, CCP took a 20 million USD loan to launch DUST 514. I just autosuggest myself:

*ommmm*

And it becomes: CCP took a 20 million DUST514orites loan to launch DUST 514.

And, do you see? My heartbeat is steady as a rock.

*ommmm*



CCP Had to loan 20 million?For Dust? oh my.........

Well ,they could ask Chris Roberts and .........


ITT we learn that game development is expensive Roll

Flamespar wrote:
At the moment I have a 12 month subscription that I won't be renewing unless CCP announces something for WiS that isn't clothing related. I'm talking actual gameplay folks.

It's not a rage quit thing, it's more of a "well EVE isn't fulfilling it's promises, so I'll go play something else".

Meanwhile Star Citizen keeps looking better and better. Salvaging derelicts? Shame CCP can't follow through on it's awesome ideas.


I'd give it another 12 months past that if you're leaving for Star Citizen. Their current release schedule has a full release sometime in 2015 or so for the persistent world. That's about 2 years out and some of their other release dates look pretty ambitious which likely means things will slip in the long-term.

---

So, yeah, overall game development is really expensive and time consuming, which means if you want really good content you have to wait for it. If you try and push too much out the door all at once then you end up with crap (which is why Star Citizen's release schedule has me worried).

Fundamental rule of game development:

Quote:
Any decision or change that you make will anger some part of your player-base, including the decision to change nothing.
Lol
Soulpirate
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#1742 - 2013-09-18 17:51:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Soulpirate
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
In terms of unsubs, the real deal is what will CCP do to retain everyone who would rather play SC in the event that SC actually delivers. And certainly the derelict exploration looks like it's stepping on CCP's toes...


I dont see how it can be considered stepping on CCP's toes when CCP hasn't actually done it yet. Would be a bit
childish of them to say "But..but.. we thought of it first :("

SC has announced support for the Oculus Rift. Is that also stepping on CCP's toes?

I mean cmon people, in SC you have a game that will have all the playstyles CCP has split into
three different games all wrapped up in one nice little package.

EVE has been in 'maintain' mode for a while now, SC has peoples attention, and some of my money, money that was
being spent on alts, but was removed when they made it very clear they were'nt actually expanding EVE anymore.

CCP has had plenty of opportunity to spend my money, but now I think it's time for me to give it to someone else
and see if they will deliver on their promises.
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#1743 - 2013-09-18 17:54:08 UTC
There also is this game... say whatever you will, but EVE's "niche" will get a whole lot tighter in the next couple of years.

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)

handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1744 - 2013-09-18 18:02:35 UTC
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy

Arduemont
Rotten Legion
#1745 - 2013-09-18 18:11:36 UTC
handbanana wrote:
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.


I don't think SC will make Eve players drop subs. I think CCP are more than capable enough of making people want to quit without outside influence.

"In the age of information, ignorance is a choice." www.stateofwar.co.nf

raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#1746 - 2013-09-18 18:12:22 UTC
I can see the appeal of writing walls of text talking down on better competition, in lack of real arguments of course.
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1747 - 2013-09-18 18:28:36 UTC
Arduemont wrote:
handbanana wrote:
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.


I don't think SC will make Eve players drop subs. I think CCP are more than capable enough of making people want to quit without outside influence.


No argument here. CCP is CCP's worst enemy.

I find it amusing however that in a thread intended to promote "WIS" the same people supposedly promoting it and wanting CCP's serious attention are also shatting it up by promoting an unreleased game and espousing it will cause CCP's demise.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy

raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#1748 - 2013-09-18 18:34:18 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
No matter how harsh reality can be sometimes, one is better off accepting and dealing with it instead of entering a denial spiral while sticking the head on the ground like an ostrich. You will find that such behaviour often leads to psychosis, depression and/or loss of self-esteem, among other painful mindsets.
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1749 - 2013-09-18 18:50:18 UTC
In before lock for promoting other games. P
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#1750 - 2013-09-18 18:53:19 UTC
Lol inb4 lock for rumor mongering/futorology/psychiatric evaluations
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1751 - 2013-09-18 19:01:29 UTC
handbanana wrote:
Arduemont wrote:
handbanana wrote:
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.


I don't think SC will make Eve players drop subs. I think CCP are more than capable enough of making people want to quit without outside influence.


No argument here. CCP is CCP's worst enemy.

I find it amusing however that in a thread intended to promote "WIS" the same people supposedly promoting it and wanting CCP's serious attention are also shatting it up by promoting an unreleased game and espousing it will cause CCP's demise.




Who knows how SC turns out ,but they deliver something CCP promised to this game.
And after that ,promised to work on a prototype,but supposedly not allowed to show that to the community.

And besides if Chris Roberts deliver half the stuff he promised ,that game will rock
And if not ,we wait a bit more for the real honest game developer

R.S.I2014

oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1752 - 2013-09-18 19:08:34 UTC
handbanana wrote:
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.



Well we learned rumor mongering from all the promises CCP made the last few years .
So if CCP can ,why not us?

R.S.I2014

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#1753 - 2013-09-18 19:46:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
handbanana wrote:
Arduemont wrote:
handbanana wrote:
When SC has failed to destroy EVE or deliver a comparable playable game 12 months from now, will the SC zealots be crying about that failure here, or on the SC forums?

I thought espousing EVE's demise using CCP's forums was considered rumor mongering.


I don't think SC will make Eve players drop subs. I think CCP are more than capable enough of making people want to quit without outside influence.


No argument here. CCP is CCP's worst enemy.

I find it amusing however that in a thread intended to promote "WIS" the same people supposedly promoting it and wanting CCP's serious attention are also shatting it up by promoting an unreleased game and espousing it will cause CCP's demise.


Have you heard about carrot and stick? Now this thread is in a stick phase, and before it was in a carrot phase, and then after the stick phase ends it will be back to carrot phase. Positive incentive and negative incentive work together.

And with all that I've comitted to this game, I surely want it to stay alive, but not to the cost of effing my dreams based on their promises. For 5 years, they worked and teased us on taking the game to its logical next level. Now they've not just failed miserably out of arrogance, but also are not even talking about trying, and meanwhile others are picking the ball they dropped.

And this time it's not some Asian P2W second rate space shooter, but a AAA game by a man who already knew his trade when CCP was in college.

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Cade Windstalker
#1754 - 2013-09-18 20:07:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Cade Windstalker
Shalua Rui wrote:
There also is this game... say whatever you will, but EVE's "niche" will get a whole lot tighter in the next couple of years.


Smaller budget, also still in development and not releasing till sometime in 2014 (at the earliest). Also unlikely to be on the same scale of universe as Eve.

Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:
And this time it's not some Asian P2W second rate space shooter, but a AAA game by a man who already knew his trade when CCP was in college.


And has also never done an MMO on the scale he's promising before. Freelancer gets filed under "close but no cigar" in the MMO department and while it was a good game the initial scope was overly ambitious and the final product was a scaled down version of his initial promises.

Soulpirate wrote:
I mean cmon people, in SC you have a game that will have all the playstyles CCP has split into
three different games all wrapped up in one nice little package.

EVE has been in 'maintain' mode for a while now, SC has peoples attention, and some of my money, money that was
being spent on alts, but was removed when they made it very clear they were'nt actually expanding EVE anymore.

CCP has had plenty of opportunity to spend my money, but now I think it's time for me to give it to someone else
and see if they will deliver on their promises.


Theoretically, eventually. Right now they're at the state of a buggy hangar viewing app for early backers and the full game won't be out till some time in 2015 which means about 4 Eve expansions before they've even released their full game, let alone having all of these various features polished...

oldbutfeelingyoung wrote:
Who knows how SC turns out ,but they deliver something CCP promised to this game.
And after that ,promised to work on a prototype,but supposedly not allowed to show that to the community.

And besides if Chris Roberts deliver half the stuff he promised ,that game will rock
And if not ,we wait a bit more for the real honest game developer


There's a difference between delivering what they promised and delivering what people expect. They say things like "epic space combat" and everyone takes that to mean something different. The number of hard facts we have on the game is actually fairly small and it's still really early in development.

If a dev is honest and says "we can't do all of those things by X date" people accuse them of being lazy or tell them to hire more people. Except that game-devs aren't lazy (in general) and can't afford to hire more people (again, in general) because making a game doesn't mean you don't still want to be paid a living wage. Most of the really talented devs, especially the technical people, are in the industry in-spite of the pay check, not because of it. Most of them could get a pretty nice pay bump moving to Microsoft or any other more mainstream tech company, because Microsoft Office sells even more copies than even the most popular video games.
Bagrat Skalski
Koinuun Kotei
#1755 - 2013-09-18 20:09:11 UTC
Quote:
Have you heard about carrot and stick? Now this thread is in a stick phase, and before it was in a carrot phase, and then after the stick phase ends it will be back to carrot phase. Positive incentive and negative incentive work together.


I have to be honest with you all, now it feels for me more like beating dead donkey with stick, ocassionally putting carrot in his mouth and shouting, "eat that!". Same effect.
Broker Agent
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1756 - 2013-09-18 20:39:50 UTC
I was going to unsub anyway, so i thought I would say it here just to be part of the cause. Plus, if CCP do finally get around to it because of the number of lost subs I can come back to Eve.
Jack Logans
Knights of Zion
#1757 - 2013-09-18 20:47:51 UTC
Hey CCP... any comment on any of this?
oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1758 - 2013-09-18 20:54:37 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:


There's a difference between delivering what they promised and delivering what people expect. They say things like "epic space combat" and everyone takes that to mean something different. The number of hard facts we have on the game is actually fairly small and it's still really early in development.



You forget in this reply the promises CCP made .


R.S.I2014

oldbutfeelingyoung
Perkone
Caldari State
#1759 - 2013-09-18 21:01:09 UTC
Jack Logans wrote:
Hey CCP... any comment on any of this?



How?
There never was and never will be any WIS in this game.

R.S.I2014

Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#1760 - 2013-09-18 21:11:58 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Smaller budget, also still in development and not releasing till sometime in 2014 (at the earliest). Also unlikely to be on the same scale of universe as Eve.

Not my point... and EVE's budget at the beginning was 2.6 mil... I mean that it's yet abother online spaceship game with a persistent universe that maybe does some things better then EVE... there haven't been all to many of those in the last couple of years. Blink

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)