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Star Citizen v EVE

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Freakdevil
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#221 - 2013-07-17 01:55:06 UTC
Two completely different games that could co-exist nicely. I really can't see the comparison.

EVE Devs need to stay mum on this topic. That is my best suggestion.


Craig Bennett2th
Bennett Corp
#222 - 2013-07-17 02:14:45 UTC
Medarr wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

Eve has one thing that no other game has: the players have the power to make the game change course, to shape and mold it, to become legendary or be a part of both legendary player-driven events and also storyline live events that make it into the novels and lore.


This post is BS there hasnt been a single event in EvE that wasnt scripted. Sansha incursions were scripted, arek jalaan was scripted. You dont control **** your a puppet buying into the illusion.


Great examples to what I said.






Craig Bennett2th wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

Eve has one thing that no other game has: the players have the power to make the game change course, to shape and mold it, to become legendary or be a part of both legendary player-driven events and also storyline live events that make it into the novels and lore.


That's not really true depending on what exactly you are talking about. If you are talking about taking over systems, starting a corp that takes over all the null sec, and pvp. Then yes. AT THIS TIME EVE is the only game that has that (that I know of).

However, if you are talking about changing the laws, storyline (a race gets wipe out or make pace between them), finding that one thing that no one else has found (like a relic from the past), fixing the EVE gate, take out the cops for good, etc. You can't do that. At least from what I know of.
In fact, when I heard EVE was a true sandbox. I was thinking my missions could change the game. Win or lose, I won't repeat the same mission over and over. And if someone else messes up, it could mess with me.

I quickly found the true sandbox was a lie, and obviously "EVE is real" moto is a lie. (Come on. There is no physics in the game. Well besides the gravity that holds you down in WIS)


I believe we are all here because we are trying to find something to fill something in us. Something to keep us from being bored. Something that makes us feel like we did something. Something that makes us feel like we are apart of a working team. Or whatever. Only you can say what is missing.

Now, Obviously there is no way any company can fill your whatever. But, I can tell you EVE Online is nowhere near what I am missing. Sadly, EVE Online is the closest thing I can come to at this time to filling what I am missing.
While I doubt I will completely leave EVE. If SC fills my needs, then I will most likely spend whatever time/money with them that I could've been with EVE.

I am sure others feel the same, but I hope CCP is able to give us what we need in time. Because if it's not SC. There is a high chance that another game in the future will give us what we need (or come a hell lot closer).


BTW, the reason why i doubt I will ever get rid of my EVE account is because like any human. My needs change over time. Also, the person with the best skills/isk wins.

Hell is around every turn. It's your choice to go in it or not. Please check out the Rookies in EVE video playlist. https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLioOFeHwQV5yNk2vpz8wX9hihLVQEIKLt

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#223 - 2013-07-17 02:18:38 UTC
Medarr wrote:
This post is BS there hasnt been a single event in EvE that wasnt scripted. Sansha incursions were scripted, arek jalaan was scripted. You dont control **** your a puppet buying into the illusion.
So what you're saying is that you are unfamiliar with the word “or”?
Eriel Sharon
KiDoN Corporation
#224 - 2013-07-17 04:00:36 UTC
I keep hearing that is why I "invested" in this game.

Let me tell you something, you are not investing, you are pre-ordering a product that doesn't even exist yet. Unless you get a share of the profits you are a customer and that is it. So stop deluding yourself like you are part of something big, what you are doing is closer to charity than "investing". So please stop using that word.
Kalanaja
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#225 - 2013-07-17 05:12:05 UTC
I like the concept of SC. I pre-ordered and all that good stuff. It is not however going to be anywhere near as complex or even as massive as EvE. And here are the reasons why:

1. Servers will be sharded with probably some official servers and lots of player run ones
2. Limited space for battles. Twitch games that involve spacecraft have never been able to get more then 30 people or so into one area. It's not doable because the amount of processing power needed would be immense and while it does technically exist. It is far beyond the reach of any game company unless Elon Musk or Richard Branson were to actually get involved. Basically you'd need a super computer the equivalent or more (probably way, way, way more) faster than the Chinese 30+ petaflop monster they slapped together in order to get several thousand people shooting each other on grid, using twitch style simulation to fly. It would also run into connectivity issues. You'd need some real fast internet servicing to manage that. Something the equivalent or more of the 100gb/s google fiber optic system. Also a major upgrade of the world's network would be needed on top of it.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#226 - 2013-07-17 06:49:10 UTC
Kalanaja wrote:
I like the concept of SC. I pre-ordered and all that good stuff. It is not however going to be anywhere near as complex or even as massive as EvE. And here are the reasons why:

1. Servers will be sharded with probably some official servers and lots of player run ones
2. Limited space for battles. Twitch games that involve spacecraft have never been able to get more then 30 people or so into one area. It's not doable because the amount of processing power needed would be immense and while it does technically exist. It is far beyond the reach of any game company unless Elon Musk or Richard Branson were to actually get involved. Basically you'd need a super computer the equivalent or more (probably way, way, way more) faster than the Chinese 30+ petaflop monster they slapped together in order to get several thousand people shooting each other on grid, using twitch style simulation to fly. It would also run into connectivity issues. You'd need some real fast internet servicing to manage that. Something the equivalent or more of the 100gb/s google fiber optic system. Also a major upgrade of the world's network would be needed on top of it.


Methink i am losing something. You mean that there is no technology able to run 3D battles involving, say, 64 craft in a single instance? With real time collision detection, real time ballistic calculation and real time damage modeling? Hosted on a PC?

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you

Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#227 - 2013-07-17 07:49:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Talon SilverHawk
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone can make a lot of promises. Delivering on them is harder.


Not a reason to ignore possible competition as far as I am aware... Your quote is also applicable to CCP : P

Tal
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#228 - 2013-07-17 07:59:44 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone can make a lot of promises. Delivering on them is harder.


A fact that CCP proves with every new expansion. Roll

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0

Khira Kitamatsu
#229 - 2013-07-17 08:05:08 UTC
One other great feature that SC will have is it is being designed in conjunction with the Oculus Rift. That is going to be awesome! Cool

Ponies!  We need more ponies!

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#230 - 2013-07-17 08:09:55 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone can make a lot of promises. Delivering on them is harder.


Not a reason to ignore possible competition as far as I am aware... Your quote is also applicable to CCP : P

Tal


CCP have been delivering quite a lot this last couple of years.

It's interesting to look at the list of requests the first 4-5 CSMs presented and see how many of them have actually been implemented, for instance.

I'd be the last to deny that CCP haven't always made the most efficient use of their development resources over the years - there has been a shocking amount of wasted effort, especially in the 2009-2011 era. But I can tell you that right now, unless every single ex-CSM I speak to is involved in a conspiracy to fool me, the CCP we have now has changed significantly from the CCP we had in, say, 2008. For the better.

By the time games that want to compete with EVE come out, they'll have a 12-13 year development deficit to catch up with. That's the equivalent of several hundred million dollars worth of dev time. And there's no gaurantee that Mr Roberts will be as good at managing a company as he undoubtedly is at creating a great game.

Personally I hope SC is a great game. Some direct competition would be good for EVE, and it's always helpful to have a new source to steal ideas from. And then there's the "halo effect"; if SC is a World Of Tanks style smash hit, then that will popularise the 'spaceships' genre, and EVE would benefit from that.

It's just that I've seen the hype -> reality -> bitterness cycle amongst these "EVE killer" games turn so many times before.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#231 - 2013-07-17 08:20:04 UTC
Medarr wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:

Eve has one thing that no other game has: the players have the power to make the game change course, to shape and mold it, to become legendary or be a part of both legendary player-driven events and also storyline live events that make it into the novels and lore.


This post is BS there hasnt been a single event in EvE that wasnt scripted. Sansha incursions were scripted, arek jalaan was scripted. You dont control **** your a puppet buying into the illusion.




You seem a little angry. Did one of the novels not end the way you wanted?

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#232 - 2013-07-17 08:24:26 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone can make a lot of promises. Delivering on them is harder.


Not a reason to ignore possible competition as far as I am aware... Your quote is also applicable to CCP : P

Tal


CCP have been delivering quite a lot this last couple of years.

It's interesting to look at the list of requests the first 4-5 CSMs presented and see how many of them have actually been implemented, for instance.

I'd be the last to deny that CCP haven't always made the most efficient use of their development resources over the years - there has been a shocking amount of wasted effort, especially in the 2009-2011 era. But I can tell you that right now, unless every single ex-CSM I speak to is involved in a conspiracy to fool me, the CCP we have now has changed significantly from the CCP we had in, say, 2008. For the better.

By the time games that want to compete with EVE come out, they'll have a 12-13 year development deficit to catch up with. That's the equivalent of several hundred million dollars worth of dev time. And there's no gaurantee that Mr Roberts will be as good at managing a company as he undoubtedly is at creating a great game.

Personally I hope SC is a great game. Some direct competition would be good for EVE, and it's always helpful to have a new source to steal ideas from. And then there's the "halo effect"; if SC is a World Of Tanks style smash hit, then that will popularise the 'spaceships' genre, and EVE would benefit from that.

It's just that I've seen the hype -> reality -> bitterness cycle amongst these "EVE killer" games turn so many times before.



Fair points ..

Tal

Destination SkillQueue
Doomheim
#233 - 2013-07-17 08:42:05 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone can make a lot of promises. Delivering on them is harder.


Not a reason to ignore possible competition as far as I am aware...

Tal



It's a reason to take what people promise with a healthy dose of scepticism though, since everyone has fallen short on their promises and the purpose of that marketing is specifically to sell their product to as many people as possible. It isn't there to provide you with a fair and realistic view of things. People's inflated expectations also without fail raise unreleased games to a status no actual game will fulfill and they lack knowledge how the market actually works, so their predictions about what will happen is very often far off the mark. All that doesn't mean ignoring what other actors do, but it means you can keep doing your own thing and even benefit from the competition. There is also great risks in moving game in a new direction in an effort to try to react to what others do as star wars galaxies showed us.

When people worry about competition they generally seem to forget it isn't anything new and competition isn't just a bad thing. Competition in all areas has been there from day one and it hasn't really eased at any point. It's just that new games appeal to new people and those new people for some reason think, that their reaction is a new thing, instead of being the norm and constantly felt by a limited portion of the playerbase. What actually alters is people's expectations and they follow a predictable wavy pattern with their highs and lows as expectations are met with reality. Even if the new competing game thrives it doesn't mean others have to suffer in an equal amount. Great popular games will attract more people to the market and can benefit all games sharing those themes and genre by providing visibility, increasing interest and having people try out games they previously weren't aware of or ignored. Even a close inferior copy isn't just a loser in that interaction. It can certainly lose people who won't accept anything but the "best" in the group, but social ties are often stronger then the gameplay differences and it can even draw new players from the "better" game who are looking for more of the same.

I guess the result of this can seem like ignoring the competition, because it doesn't necessitate any drastic development changes to a game, that is already being constantly developed. Maybe stealing some great ideas, that are compatible what you want to do, but certainly nothing drastic.
Matokin Lemant
#234 - 2013-07-17 10:19:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Matokin Lemant
Correct me if I am wrong on this but based on what I gathered Star Citizen is more of a space "sim" where eve is...not so much.

As such like others have said eve will be ok because it has an entearly different style/type of game play that appeals to a different type of player base...or atleast that is how I see things.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#235 - 2013-07-17 10:37:35 UTC
Matokin Lemant wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong on this but based on what I gathered Star Citizen is more of a space "sim" where eve is...not so much.
It's a Chris Roberts game — essentially multiplayer Privater: a space dogfighter with a simulated economy to create some world dynamics.

EVE does pretty much the exact opposite: simulated combat to create dynamics in a virtual economy.
WonkySplitDemon
Doomheim
#236 - 2013-07-17 10:49:12 UTC
Looks good, will probably disappoint.
Signal11th
#237 - 2013-07-17 10:51:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Signal11th
WonkySplitDemon wrote:
Looks good, will probably disappoint.



That's no way to talk about EVE. I think some of the issue is that people have been looking for a decent space MMO for so long and the best of the bunch is still EVE.

Personally like most people I have years invested in this so would hate for anything to upset the apple cart so to speak.

Now the issue is personally for me and from what I've noticed in game is that for all the rhetoric and sayings of Sandbox EVE is actually quite structured and static. I'm pretty much doing the same things I did when I started usually due to skills just at a faster pace.

There are too many defining lines whether this be CCP drawn or client drawn (human nature this, nobody at the top likes his easy life being disrupted too much) that make the game a truly diverse experience.
It's basically doing the same stuff over and over again with the added bonus of maybe doing it for someone different every couple of months/years depending on your loyalty.

Eve is great I still log in but I'm really past caring what goes on in the game as it's just the same stuff as last year or the year before with someone else doing it.

At the precise moment in time EVE is still top dog but CCP and a few posters that I've seen shouldn't stick their collective heads in the sand because it's held that title for so long or they have so much time invested in it.

Like anything that has great potential it needs to evolve to continually bring a diverse and appealing enviroment to itself and it's fans. Rehashing the same thing over and over isn't evolution. Eve is still great but it shouldn't rest on it's laurels or pretend anythign else that may or may not be coming out should be classed as vaporware or crap.

Many a company/person/country has fallen because of thinking like this.

God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!" I came fifth and won a toaster!

Space Juden
Supermassive Potato Pancake
#238 - 2013-07-17 11:35:28 UTC
Malcanis wrote:

CCP have been delivering quite a lot this last couple of years.


Comet mining
S&I interface
Corp managment
POS managment
Apparently FW still
Sov revamp
Incursions
WiS (lol)
Incarna (wat)
ect ect

If I give you a badge and a lollipop would you start shilling for me?
Jenn aSide
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#239 - 2013-07-17 11:43:51 UTC
Space Juden wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

CCP have been delivering quite a lot this last couple of years.


Comet mining
S&I interface
Corp managment
POS managment
Apparently FW still
Sov revamp
Incursions
WiS (lol)
Incarna (wat)
ect ect

If I give you a badge and a lollipop would you start shilling for me?


Maybe you should have read a few lines lower?
Malcanis wrote:
I'd be the last to deny that CCP haven't always made the most efficient use of their development resources over the years - there has been a shocking amount of wasted effort, especially in the 2009-2011 era.

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#240 - 2013-07-17 12:18:41 UTC
Space Juden wrote:
Malcanis wrote:

CCP have been delivering quite a lot this last couple of years.


Comet mining
S&I interface
Corp managment
POS managment
Apparently FW still
Sov revamp
Incursions
WiS (lol)
Incarna (wat)
ect ect

If I give you a badge and a lollipop would you start shilling for me?


It won't even cost that much. Teach me the way of dishonest selective quoting and I'll prove that you haven't evolved from an ape..

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016