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New Dev Blog: Alliance Panel at Fanfest 2012: The Conclusion

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Della Monk
Monastery of Drakes
#681 - 2012-03-29 01:44:47 UTC
Yeep wrote:
Lt Pizi wrote:
Andski wrote:

So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.


no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on
bussiness as usual

there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA?


No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.


Hell, even acknowledging that "The CSM was consulted, but we felt that their response did not go far enough" would be a bit nicer
Lt Pizi
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#682 - 2012-03-29 01:47:17 UTC
Yeep wrote:
Lt Pizi wrote:
Andski wrote:

So CCP is reverting the CSM back to a useless PR/marketing tool rather than a player advocacy group. Cool beans.


no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on
bussiness as usual

there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA?


No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.


it was always clear to someone with half a brain that no CEO in the whole world wil let his desicions be overuled by a bunch of internet spaceship nerds

internet spaceship may be serious business but RL business is more serious

Goon Tears are best tears, because they're 25% alcohol by volume!
Veilo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#683 - 2012-03-29 01:48:56 UTC
Dear CCP

I respect your decision to interpret the EULA/TOS as applicable to out of game events.

However if you stand by this decision then I would like to have my vote back thanks.



I am so mad right now, my brother died as a child soldier in africa so the issue of democracy and justice is very close to my heart, if you don't respect this then I will not-figuratively kill myself.
Vladimir Pulin
Remanaquie Federation
#684 - 2012-03-29 01:49:20 UTC
Two step wrote:
I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.

More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page


If I were you I'd resign in protest.



Getting a bit annoying to see the people bringing up the 10k votes all the time. Yes he got them but if you'd repeat the vote after this I'd love to know how many he'd keep.

However, kudos to Gianturco for maning up and making it clear his drunkenness wasn't a valid excuse, I actually liked that. And on that note the Goonie tears will make an awesome presentation for next year's FF. Keep'em cumin you drunken bees.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#685 - 2012-03-29 01:50:40 UTC
Doc Severide wrote:
Kalunmaar wrote:
If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place?

Exactly !!!
With 10,000 votes out of how many account holders? It seems that most subscribers care absolutely nothing at all about the CSM. Just get rid of it already...


Don't be a moron...

The CSM has been enormously beneficial to the player base as a whole. It has also been a tremendous PR boost for CCP.

There were 60k votes cast in this election, which represents more accounts than have EVER been online simultaneously. While this is less than 20% of the total accounts, its hardly an inconsequential number. The CSM is here to stay, and if they remove it, they will see a **** storm the likes of which will bury CCP...

Finally... Reinstate Mittani to CSM7.... his removal is out of line!!!!
Ustrello
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#686 - 2012-03-29 01:51:16 UTC
Navigator you know what you should do...? go to a bridge with a very long drop this is important ok? Then I want you to go skill yourself up and get a t2 thrasher
Kitty Vintner
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#687 - 2012-03-29 01:53:50 UTC
Vladimir Vladimirovitch Putain wrote:

Getting a bit annoying to see the people bringing up the 10k votes all the time. Yes he got them but if you'd repeat the vote after this I'd love to know how many he'd keep.

About 10,000.
REDBIERD
Space Gear Productions
#688 - 2012-03-29 01:54:46 UTC
Quote:
no they just axed the one guy who broke the rule (by his own words ) and go on
bussiness as usual

there was no outcry when they axed the dutch girl for ?NDA?


No, they let the CSM come to consensus on the issue then overruled them when they made the "wrong" decision. For the CSM to have any legitimacy other than a PR tool CCP need to either respect their decisions or make it adequately clear a decision is not theirs to make. Not this worst of both worlds crap.


Hell, even acknowledging that "The CSM was consulted, but we felt that their response did not go far enough" would be a bit nicer



~ Yeah but its CCP's job to decide when a player commits a breach of TOS; it isn't left up to the CSM to decide who stays or who goes. How can he be an effective Chairman or CSM member if he's out of the game for the first 30-days of term ?
Flette
Rosen Association
#689 - 2012-03-29 01:54:50 UTC
Veilo wrote:
Dear CCP

I respect your decision to interpret the EULA/TOS as applicable to out of game events.

However if you stand by this decision then I would like to have my vote back thanks.



I am so mad right now, my brother died as a child soldier in africa so the issue of democracy and justice is very close to my heart, if you don't respect this then I will not-figuratively kill myself.




Your vote counted. You voted in someone who resigned. Take it up with the representative.

This happens all the time IRL, and they don't do the election over.
Bibosikus
Air
#690 - 2012-03-29 01:55:10 UTC
So CCP step up, in a timely fashion, and deliver a sharp shock. They've taken definitive action, performed damage limitation, assuaged the indignant, and outraged the bees (meh).

Mittens will be back in 30 days, and next year running for CSM8 no doubt.

Jita will burn, and frankly I'll come watch.

All in all, a very very good day.

Well done, CCP.

Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines.
Swearte Widfarend
Ever Vigilant Fountain Defenders
#691 - 2012-03-29 01:55:38 UTC
Raiykjab wrote:
Two step wrote:
I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.

More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page


This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts.

Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy.

Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count.

Honestly yours

Raiykjab


You can't add, can you?

Even if ever single character in Goonswarm were an individual account, that is barely 7,000. And if you think every character in Goonswarm is an individual account, I've got a great bridge to sell you in Tuscon, Arizona, with a nice ocean view.

Democracy is only as good as the despot managing the voting booth.
Damion Rayne
Panoptic
#692 - 2012-03-29 01:56:04 UTC
Gotta love the goons, you people are so full of immaturity. cheating, lying, and down right hatred..and not in game mind you, that not a single one of you deserve to sit there and ***** and moan about CCP's decision.

Grow the hell up you children. Mittens deserves this, you don't like it? Leave Eve.

ROA
Raiykjab
Federal Navy Academy
#693 - 2012-03-29 01:56:44 UTC
Andski wrote:
1) 5 accounts are 5 accounts - they are paid for.


You make a point

... oh wait

Andski wrote:
2) Bill Clinton served two full terms, he did not resign.


Ok lucky me I mentionned the DSK case, not the first nor the last.

Andski wrote:
3) CSM members object to their opinions being discarded and CCP throwing their chairman under the bus.


You forgot to add "Some" before CSM, would have really sucked if they all objected CCP's decision Blink

Eve has miners?!
Diamonica Norya
Pro Synergy
#694 - 2012-03-29 01:58:05 UTC
seriously you guys who keep separating in-game and out-of-game and try to defend for unacceptable behaviour just need to stop.

Yes it's a game, but doesn't mean cyber-bullying + real life references and impacts are allowed.

CCP said themselves "The line is crossed"

In a decently minded mature adult's view "The line is crossed"

stop separating one issue into multiple, you all know why there are more people diagnoized with dual / multiple personality nowadays? I bet most of you don't if you have to find courage and confidence in a video game where it is lacking in RL.
Doc Severide
Doomheim
#695 - 2012-03-29 01:58:40 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Doc Severide wrote:
Kalunmaar wrote:
If our votes are going to count for nothing, why hold an election in the first place?

Exactly !!!
With 10,000 votes out of how many account holders? It seems that most subscribers care absolutely nothing at all about the CSM. Just get rid of it already...


Don't be a moron...

The CSM has been enormously beneficial to the player base as a whole. It has also been a tremendous PR boost for CCP.

There were 60k votes cast in this election, which represents more accounts than have EVER been online simultaneously. While this is less than 20% of the total accounts, its hardly an inconsequential number. The CSM is here to stay, and if they remove it, they will see a **** storm the likes of which will bury CCP...

Like more fools out shooting the Jita monument? I don't believe for a minute that the CSM is beneficial to anything except getting a free trip to Iceland to get drunk once a year...

And as a paying subscriber I am perfectly in my right to have my opinions regardless of the disagreeing mobs who cannot respond without name calling and idiotic threats of "Destroying EVE".

Bunch of children....
IsTheOpOver
#696 - 2012-03-29 01:59:11 UTC
Andski wrote:
Angelus X wrote:
lmao 10,000 accounts about to be unsubbed eh, CCP must be scareeeeee Lol


$150,000+ in monthly subscriptions alone is certainly no big deal


A world without goons?

Good job CCP.. although it was the only decision you could make. Well I guess you could have given him a perma-ban.

Andski how does it feel to not be able to unsub quicker than that?
Lt Pizi
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#697 - 2012-03-29 01:59:27 UTC
Swearte Widfarend wrote:
Raiykjab wrote:
Two step wrote:
I disagree with this decision, and am working hard with CCP to make sure the 10,058 voters that voted for Alex have their voice heard.

More to come, just wanted to make sure I had a spot on the first page


This just show the integrity of the ppl representing us at CSM, 10058 yeah sure, we all know those guys probably voted with their 5 accounts.

Bill Clinton was also elected by a majority, but kinda resigned after the sex scandal, same for DSK the boss of the FMI, this dude was favorite for the next French presidentials and now is a nobody. If you represent something and are given powers you gotta show the exemple, or you are out, that's how it works in a democracy.

Seeing so many CSM members objecting about the decision is quiet disturbing, and just prove that I should get myself more accounts the next time I go vote to make it count.

Honestly yours

Raiykjab


You can't add, can you?

Even if ever single character in Goonswarm were an individual account, that is barely 7,000. And if you think every character in Goonswarm is an individual account, I've got a great bridge to sell you in Tuscon, Arizona, with a nice ocean view.


than again how many goons have multiple accounts and test and whoever kisses up to you these days

Goon Tears are best tears, because they're 25% alcohol by volume!
Wacktopia
Fleet-Up.com
Keep It Simple Software Group
#698 - 2012-03-29 02:00:40 UTC
The Mittani was good for EVE. He knew what the game was and how it was different and what made it so good.I hope, after his 30 days are up, that he can reconcile with CCP and get back into that chair.

The real shame of all this is that the back lash is i na form of players crying for less war and greif. It could not have come at a worse time with Inferno around the corner. Last thing we want now is some kind of knee-jerk decision that puts the fire out before it even gets going, so to speak.

War is upon the citizens of New Eden, whether they like it or not. This is the way of EVE.

Kitchen sink? Seriousy, get your ship together -  Fleet-Up.com
paradigmblue
Perkone
Caldari State
#699 - 2012-03-29 02:05:45 UTC
Alex's words at the alliance panel were regrettable, and it is understandable for CCP to be especially sensitive to possible PR problems with Dust 514 close to release. I, like many others, was troubled by his comments. This firestorm needed to be dealt with, in one way or another.

To his credit, Alex, on his own volition, made a sincere public and private apology, both to EVE players as a whole and to the victim. Additionally, he made restitution to the victim and stepped down from the Chairman position, forfeiting his coveted position as the face of the CSM. Having met Alex several times out of the game, these apologies rang true to me, and his sincerity and candor are admirable.

With these actions, the firestorm was abated, and with a little time, the controversy would have died out, as it should have. We all have made mistakes before, but most realize that it is how we handle those mistakes that is important, and Alex owned up completely to his lapse in judgement. You'll notice that he made no excuses for his inebriation (from alcohol provided by CCP), and did not ask CCP to share the blame (even though the content of his presentation- including the unfortunate slide which prompted this controversy - was vetted by CCP).

This story could have ended with Alex's sincere apology, and would have faded with the next news cycle from the gaming press. Instead, CCP has taken the last, dying embers from this firestorm, and tossed gasoline on them. If they wanted this story to not gain any more traction in the gaming press, banning The Mittani in game for Alex's verbal misteps was exactly the wrong course of action to take. Moreover, while I am sure they acted with the best of intentions, by lumping more punishments on to those that Alex undertook voluntarily, the outcome seems not only excessive, but vindictive.

I am disappointed and saddened by CCP's response to the issue, and I hope that they will take a step back and reconsider the implications and intent of their actions.
Lt Pizi
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#700 - 2012-03-29 02:05:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Lt Pizi
Quote:
words from paradigmblue


i feel bad for ccp .. all they wantet is DUST EVE interaction all over the press after FF

all they got was a drunken guy that couldnot handle himself ....

edit wrong quoting

Goon Tears are best tears, because they're 25% alcohol by volume!