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[Mini-blog] The Next Steps in Structure Transition

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Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
#161 - 2017-05-13 02:59:26 UTC
HandelsPharmi wrote:
Petrified wrote:
What happens with the current Outpost Eggs? Do we get reimbursed for them? Will they be converted to rigless faction Fortizars? Why allow outpost eggs to be built still if they cannot otherwise be planted?


https://community.eveonline.com/news/patch-notes/patch-notes-for-119.5-release

Quote:
Existing copies of Outpost Construction Platforms, Outpost Construction Platform Blueprints, Station Improvement Platforms and Station Upgrade Platforms have been reimbursed in the following fashion:

  • Station Improvement Platforms and Station Upgrade Platforms have been removed and their owners have been credited with isk equal to their full NPC sale value
  • Minmatar and Gallente Outpost Platform Blueprints have been converted into Astrahus blueprints
  • Amarr and Caldari Outpost Platform Blueprints have been converted into Raitaru blueprints
  • Outpost Platforms have been converted into both 1 Fortizar and 1 Azbel


    • Cool beans, thanks for the link and quote. My busy schedule kept me from reading that in detail.

    Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

    Support better localization for the Japanese Community.
    Joan Andedare
    Roving Guns Inc.
    Pandemic Legion
    #162 - 2017-05-17 10:55:48 UTC
    What is going to happen with the faction POS BPCs and the faction POS-module BPCs?
    Will they just be removed?
    Fourteen Maken
    Karma and Causality
    #163 - 2017-05-18 22:07:21 UTC
    have you spoken to anyone in provi about this? it seems only right since they are the ones most affected and judging by the posts in here it looks like the impact could be devastating.

    if the idea here is to "adequately compensate" players for the time and resources they invested into their structures you might want to look at this one again. you're not really compensating outpost holders here, you're effectively punishing them and offering them up for content. I wouldn't mind if it affected everyone equally but this has the potential to devastate a uniquely open group of players in nullsec.

    please reconsider, or at least run it past some outpost holders to see if there is a fairer way to do this. i think you should have selected a cut off date prior to the announcement to preclude the 'outpost gold rush', but if you're going to go ahead with it maybe you could do both: select a pre-announcement cut off date for all oupost holders and give them a packaged standard citadel in jita so the people who built/currently control the outposts have some reward and a means to rebuild in the aftermath of the change, and also introduce the new faction citadels for whoever controls the space after the changes go live.
    IHaveTenFingers
    Lethal Dosage.
    Scary Wormhole People
    #164 - 2017-05-19 03:01:47 UTC  |  Edited by: IHaveTenFingers
    I can't help but feel saddened by these changes. I have issues with both player and npc-originated stations being removed


    1) Player-built outposts
    As the moron who built the D2-HOS station and then lost it less than a week later, I can understand the kind of effort that goes into building these monoliths and how much it sucks when they go away. To turn these into irreplaceable assets is bad enough from a strategic standpoint. I've actually found myself in a position in which I sympathize with the residents of providence because we *all* know what's going to happen there on or around patch day.

    Making matters worse, they are poised to be converted into a structure that isn't much better than their non-racial "upwell" counterparts. For something that would effectively become a priceless liability, that's a hard c*** to suck.

    I've seen the idea suggested to seed BPCs of "outposts" as top-tier (possibly FW-Only?) loyalty point prizes, and I agree wholeheartedly. I think the sweet spot would be something approximating:

    • 2-5 million LP required
    • Material cost similar to old outpost costs (~30 bil, if memory serves)
    • Capabilities and bonuses around 2x that of a "Large" tier upwell structure
    • Extra rig and/or service slots
    • Retain Race-specific role of outposts.
    • This leaves the gallente station as an oddball. Even more service slots seems like a good plan.
    • Nullsec-only to retain their heritage


    Not knowing any better, I think the limited-issue faction rigs are a good compensation to upgraded outposts. Their BPCs should be seeded in a similar manner - possibly by more "fringe" corporations like Thukker, SOCT, Intaki, etc...

    2) The 68 Immensea stations
    These stations are not just shinier outposts - they are pieces of history in eve that have existed since before Capsuleers (if you care about lore). I've always felt a sort of ghostly or nostalgic vibe when I dock in one. Storyline elements aside, they represent the anchor points of some of the first big steps that players took into unclaimed nullsec space. Turning the Immensea stations into destructible assets is effectively the same as destroying history for no reason. It doesn't matter how many epic monuments are put up to honor them - they will fade into obscurity and that's just a bummer.

    Now, it wouldn't be fair for me to just whine and moan about the removal of Immensea stations without proposing a solution. It might seem like a revolting thought to some, but it's fairly obvious to me how to deal with these. I would suggest that they're converted into a permanent non-conquerable freeport (just like any old NPC station) and that the owners get reimbursed randomly with one of the various outpost-replacements.
    Lothros Andastar
    The Scope
    Gallente Federation
    #165 - 2017-05-22 16:24:37 UTC
    No more rookie ships in Nullsec makes me cry.
    HandelsPharmi
    Pharmi on CharBazaar
    #166 - 2017-05-22 17:48:59 UTC  |  Edited by: HandelsPharmi
    Fourteen Maken wrote:
    have you spoken to anyone in provi about this? it seems only right since they are the ones most affected and judging by the posts in here it looks like the impact could be devastating.

    if the idea here is to "adequately compensate" players for the time and resources they invested into their structures you might want to look at this one again. you're not really compensating outpost holders here, you're effectively punishing them and offering them up for content. I wouldn't mind if it affected everyone equally but this has the potential to devastate a uniquely open group of players in nullsec.

    please reconsider, or at least run it past some outpost holders to see if there is a fairer way to do this. i think you should have selected a cut off date prior to the announcement to preclude the 'outpost gold rush', but if you're going to go ahead with it maybe you could do both: select a pre-announcement cut off date for all oupost holders and give them a packaged standard citadel in jita so the people who built/currently control the outposts have some reward and a means to rebuild in the aftermath of the change, and also introduce the new faction citadels for whoever controls the space after the changes go live.



    I do NOT want to start any "propaganda discussion"...

    As far as I can rememeber, the players and Outpost holders in Providence have fought many times against great alliances / coalitions and have shown their power.


    Lothros Andastar wrote:
    No more rookie ships in Nullsec makes me cry.


    Holy ****, I have never thought about this... no free cyno frigs will be available anymore.

    BUT on the other side, you can transport cyno frigs with LO in their cargo in the ship maintenance bay of your Capital since this winter. It was just a small patch note.
    Zatar Sharisa
    New Eden Heavy Industries Incorporated
    #167 - 2017-05-23 05:10:23 UTC
    Valkorsia wrote:
    Give us a self-destruct button for stations. We'd rather blown them up ourselves than see a dread blob with 50 titan alts from a superpower coalition unanchor faction citadels and whisk off a piece of history as a collectors item.



    Not that I actually have a dog in this hunt, but you just hit on my thinking. If the changes paint a bullseye on you, then when the changes hit, blow up the bullseye. Not trying to be a smart alek or anything, it just seems a reasonable resort: gather everyone you can for the moment of change and blaze away, thereby creating your own self-destruct button for the stations.

    Maybe I'm just a very wrathful, petty, and vengeful individual though. :D

    I now leave you to your regularly scheduled arguments.

    I understand about indecision, but I don't care if I get behind.  People livin' in competition.  All I want is to have my peace of mind.

    "Peace of Mind"  --  Boston
    Fourteen Maken
    Karma and Causality
    #168 - 2017-05-23 21:52:48 UTC
    Zatar Sharisa wrote:
    Valkorsia wrote:
    Give us a self-destruct button for stations. We'd rather blown them up ourselves than see a dread blob with 50 titan alts from a superpower coalition unanchor faction citadels and whisk off a piece of history as a collectors item.



    Not that I actually have a dog in this hunt, but you just hit on my thinking. If the changes paint a bullseye on you, then when the changes hit, blow up the bullseye. Not trying to be a smart alek or anything, it just seems a reasonable resort: gather everyone you can for the moment of change and blaze away, thereby creating your own self-destruct button for the stations.

    Maybe I'm just a very wrathful, petty, and vengeful individual though. :D

    I now leave you to your regularly scheduled arguments.


    the problem is these faction citadels go to whoever owns the system on the day the change hits, meaning some people might think it's worthwhile to capture systems in provi space so they own the citadel on the day the change hits. so the current system owners, won't get the faction citadels and they will likely lose their space. seems a raw deal to me, i don't know enough about nullsec to know what will happen i'm just going on comments in here.

    if current owners lose their space and end up with nothing to show for their conquerable stations do you think that's fair? i don't think it's right.
    Zatar Sharisa
    New Eden Heavy Industries Incorporated
    #169 - 2017-05-23 22:25:54 UTC
    Fourteen Maken wrote:
    Zatar Sharisa wrote:
    Valkorsia wrote:
    Give us a self-destruct button for stations. We'd rather blown them up ourselves than see a dread blob with 50 titan alts from a superpower coalition unanchor faction citadels and whisk off a piece of history as a collectors item.



    Not that I actually have a dog in this hunt, but you just hit on my thinking. If the changes paint a bullseye on you, then when the changes hit, blow up the bullseye. Not trying to be a smart alek or anything, it just seems a reasonable resort: gather everyone you can for the moment of change and blaze away, thereby creating your own self-destruct button for the stations.

    Maybe I'm just a very wrathful, petty, and vengeful individual though. :D

    I now leave you to your regularly scheduled arguments.


    the problem is these faction citadels go to whoever owns the system on the day the change hits, meaning some people might think it's worthwhile to capture systems in provi space so they own the citadel on the day the change hits. so the current system owners, won't get the faction citadels and they will likely lose their space. seems a raw deal to me, i don't know enough about nullsec to know what will happen i'm just going on comments in here.

    if current owners lose their space and end up with nothing to show for their conquerable stations do you think that's fair? i don't think it's right.


    Hmmm....Yeah, that's pretty much the shaft alright, because I'm assuming there's no way to take them down now? If not, then now I'm starting to understand why some folks are feeling like a big target's been placed on them, and then the people that did it are kicking back in La-z-boy recliners with bowls of popcorn and laughing. I mean these are going to, then, wind up solely in the hands of the big alliances, and anyone popping off with the excuse of "Well, defend them," is either a member of one of those or being seriously disingenuous for some reason or other.

    I understand about indecision, but I don't care if I get behind.  People livin' in competition.  All I want is to have my peace of mind.

    "Peace of Mind"  --  Boston
    Imane Fatlip
    Overload This
    Escalation Theory
    #170 - 2017-05-28 17:22:02 UTC
    CCPlease, what will be happening with market orders already existing in Player Owned Outposts on patch day when they are replaced by faction citadels? Will they be magically transferred to the new citadel intact?
    HandelsPharmi
    Pharmi on CharBazaar
    #171 - 2017-05-28 18:29:16 UTC
    Imane Fatlip wrote:
    CCPlease, what will be happening with market orders already existing in Player Owned Outposts on patch day when they are replaced by faction citadels? Will they be magically transferred to the new citadel intact?


    Otherwise you want a reimburstment of your broker fees?
    Imane Fatlip
    Overload This
    Escalation Theory
    #172 - 2017-05-28 19:00:38 UTC
    yes