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Will I be able to get multiple moon materials from one moon with the changes? For example, will a Dysprosium moon spawn rocks that yield only Dysprosium, or will they refine into multiple minerals, such as Titanium or Technetium as well? Will I be able to get small amounts of rarer moons from a lower-tier moon? Will there be new mining crystals for these moon materials?

Moons won't be "freed up." It's just more tedium to extract the goodies.

Anyone planning on taking a fleet of hulks into PL space to mine under their cit's guns, nm their fleet?

Sign me up for that.. lol.

It just adds another layer to the tt2 process, so the real winners will be mission runners and anyone who hunts faction bpc's, since they're basically all superior to t2 anyhow.

In fact, there's no point to even having basic or intermediate moon mats if all that has to be done to refine them is run a bpo, aside from eating up finite industry.... errr... reaction slots and forcing alts into the reacting business.

Also kills any efficiencies one might gain by running a complex reaction at a moon that produces an ingredient for a mid-range input. It ALL has to be mined and built like t2 components.

If we're gonna have to mine it, at least cut out the two bullcrud steps of basic and intermediate and just have Crystalline Carbide and Ferrogel moons... ok, so maybe unrefined ferrogel...

But seriously, the point to adding two more steps to t2 production is what again? And adding mining to a production process that has never relied heavily on it?

Would be an easier pill to swallow if the goal was clear. Is the goal to see people who hate mining but are forced to die horribly?

You know what used to generate meaningful content and pvp? SOV warfare... that is until it was turned into mining.... errrr.. entosisisng

Timers and alarm clock ops. Because CCP knows we love that stuff.

Alternatively it could be called "we can't think of an actual game mechanic, so here, have more timers".

I must agree. Allow WH and HS to do this as well. There is absolutely no reason not to allow the content across the platform. I know CCP is so concerned about T2 prices. Whatever happened to the T2 were originally supped to cost 2x at T1. I remember that. All moon mining became in reality was the passive cash cow. Would be nice for once, for the content to go across the cluster instead of just to null sec, cause in the end that is where it will happen majority of the time. CCP please give the content across the cluster, we need more life in the game not limitation to if your in a special alliance or null sec only. Cheers and I hope that we see the content for all to enjoy and prey upon.

I find it seriously funny how in a Universe in which we can use Structures to build other such Structures and Spaceships of immense complexity we still have to take the pickaxe (be it the cool T2 pickaxe for all I care) in our hands to acquire basic materials. The new Structures will be able to somehow disconnect a large piece of an astronomic entity with serious gravitational powers and "beam it up", somehow make that huge piece explode into perfectly digestable smaller pieces, but for some reason beyond my understanding of logic it cannot go the next step and do what a Venture can do.

edit: What's the explanation of this technological backlash? Could it be that you guys try the impossible: be everybodies darling, be everyones foe, try to keep things the same, while making "big changes"?

Thoughts #1:

Any time we can move player driven gameplay and organized events into scheduled timers is a good thing. Those timers act like Fish Aggregating Devices (FADs) (Gosh you need to backronym this into something in game) bringing players together for content.

Sub thoughts:
1. Any methods we can use, within reason, to expose these timers in a moderately aggregated and anonymized way, displayed in game, will be extremely valuable in guiding players towards content. Emphasis on within reason.
A new map stat – Fracking Activity Detected, simply giving a regional (or at worst constellation) count of ongoing fracking processes, would probably suffice.



Thoughts #2:
Given how moon mining is becoming an active process, us players will need to take new approaches to organizing and disrupting these activities and will need new tools to be creative in doing so.

Potential Organizational Ideas:
1. First on the subject of asteroid layout in these moon belts; let’s make this process more dynamic, avoiding straight forward min-max theory from developing, leaving room for expression of player skill, and allowing room for accidents to happen.

How? Billiards! We can use the new fighter interface and tactical camera to have a simple minigame where we line up and shoot the detonation charge at the rotating moon chunk. The simplified ballistics of which determines where our new asteroids will land. Gives us a new belt layout every time. Let’s practiced demolitions operators kind of keep belts closer to safety, lets inexperienced demolitions operators cause hilarity. Plus, it will look cool.

2. Before CCP took it’s own direction with Rorquals I had an idea that they should be transformed into a platform for horizontally scaling mining architecture rather than the new apex miner that they were reworked into (which meant that everyone just mines in rorquals now *frowny face*). Now that refineries will be on grid with the moon belts in what is intended to be a collaborative gameplay, we can consider inserting those features here. My idea was to introduce mining service drones that provided utility rather than raw mining stats. That utility could be applied in the form of increasing quality of life for mining ships and thus their *applied* mining rates, rather than just stat boosting the max rates which would cause the markets to crash(*hmm*).

Mining service drones: (fighter sized things)
A. Retrieval Drone: Scoops out ore from the target ship’s cargo and ore holds, (potentially compressing it,) and returns this ore to the mothership’s own stores. Requires no consent allowing use offensively and defensively. Streamlines the process of jet can mining and saves the lives of PvPers forced to join Mining CTAs.

(note these were thought of long before PANIC was a thing)
B.) Warp Core Boosting drone: A drone that gives the target an additional +n points of warp strength to target ship. An anti-point.
C.) Sacrificial auxiliary shield drone: Consumable one use drones that add grey health/overshields to target.
C.b)Sacrifical PANIC drone: Consumable one use drone that gives a short PANIC duration to the target. Might be the more modern way of doing it.

3. Ledgers:
These will be a net ‘good thing’. However, I’m not sure that ninja mining showing up on these ledgers is the best idea. Detectable siphons made them pointless. Punch card mining logs will do the same to ninja mining. There are a few options I can think of for addressing it. Each has their own pros and cons.

A.) Make ledgers operate from a reciprocally validated Access List. Wouldn’t track ninja mines. This has the potential to get unwieldy fast. Especially for NRDS organizations like Provibloc.

B.) Make ledgers operate from proposed Retrieval Drones. This lets collection and tracking of ore be handled in one step. Any ore some ninja warps off or docks with goes untracked, and unpaid. Probably the most convenient for all parties. However it operates under the assumption of the implementation of Retrieval Drones and presence of a Refinery (or drone user) in the mining op.

C.) Put ledgers into the Ihubs themselves. This would be a catch all that covers ice and ore anoms. However this can be untenable for renters who are stuck waiting on landlord bureaucracy to find out the results of their ledger.

*disruptive ideas to come in another post later.

I don't know what you don't get... in theory maybe but no one will be able to harvest them in enough capacity to matter.....

I didn't see it in the posts (might have missed it), are reprocessing facilities going to be removed then from Engineering citadels when Refineries go live?

current rigs will be unfitted from the structures. so you decide if you want to put it back in or into the refinery.. the refinery will provide the bonus to refinement via the service mods..


so by default.. you just spent 1 rig slot on the refinery... good luck on figuring out the 2 slots.. and brace for the t2 rig version.. guess that also means somebody better do some calibration math quick.. cause its not looking pretty at all.

Yes. Rigs will be refunded. The service module can already be removed.

You can then choose to put the rigs back on, at likely a reduced reprocessing yield (no rig bonus from structure).