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why does it seem like CCP is castrating high sec content creators

First post
Author
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#901 - 2016-10-08 12:28:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Kaivarian Coste wrote:
^ Interesting stats. Makes me wonder where all the mining is being done then.

In terms of the current situation:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/3_mining.value.by.region.png

Nullsec and Highsec.

The Forge is typically 1 or 2 consistently and some null areas swap around a bit for places. Lonetrek and Domain are always up there.

So still lots of mining in highsec.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#902 - 2016-10-08 14:12:19 UTC  |  Edited by: March rabbit
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Kaivarian Coste wrote:
^ Interesting stats. Makes me wonder where all the mining is being done then.

In terms of the current situation:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/3_mining.value.by.region.png

Nullsec and Highsec.

The Forge is typically 1 or 2 consistently and some null areas swap around a bit for places. Lonetrek and Domain are always up there.

So still lots of mining in highsec.

can you show the same chart from like 2012? Just to compare

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#903 - 2016-10-08 16:32:40 UTC
Mark Marconi wrote:


All I can say is if you think miners like to be ganked, to make their game more interesting. Well it is obvious you don't know many miners. Mining is something you can do to "Play" a game, when you are to knackered from work or for that matter are still doing work.


Miners used to be more than that.
Mark Marconi wrote:

And that has ben the problem for so long. CCP listening to people who "know best" and we ended up with a hi-sec that was lo-sec and players leaving in droves.


No they listened to the exact opposite side, hence why so much content has been removed.
Mark Marconi wrote:

You want players to kill players, want them to ruin someone elses day to make them selves feel better. Fine, that was what lo-sec was made for..


Wrong, that's what ALL of EVE was made for.
Marcus Binchiette
Federal Vanguard
#904 - 2016-10-09 11:16:04 UTC
Bexol Regyri wrote:
I am new, but after I bought my mining permit I did make a pilot to "walk a mile in their shoes" and went out with code on 5 freighter ganks and a few miner ganks...


Then you were probably a fool for paying ISK to CODE. They are nothing but a bunch of extortionists - and if you still had your balls, instead of buying your "mining licence", you'd have told them where to stick it.


Furthermore, the kind of PvP which CODE chooses to engage in is not of the same calibre as most straight fights. Their business model is oriented toward praying on the weak - and many of their adherants operate from NPC corps so that they don't need to face a conventional hi-sec war... They are nothing more than a bunch of cowards.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#905 - 2016-10-09 15:27:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Marcus Binchiette wrote:
Bexol Regyri wrote:
I am new, but after I bought my mining permit I did make a pilot to "walk a mile in their shoes" and went out with code on 5 freighter ganks and a few miner ganks...


Then you were probably a fool for paying ISK to CODE. They are nothing but a bunch of extortionists - and if you still had your balls, instead of buying your "mining licence", you'd have told them where to stick it.
While they are extortionists, it was his choice to pay the permit fee.

Given that he went out and joined them on a few ops also means that he's learnt how the mechanics work, how to avoid them being used on him and the benefits of working with others towards a common goal; that puts him way ahead of many hisec players in risk mitigation.


Quote:
Furthermore, the kind of PvP which CODE chooses to engage in is not of the same calibre as most straight fights.
It's a different kind of conflict, economic warfare by proxy if you will; there's a reason more than a few industrialists give CODE. regular donations to feed their SRP. It's also a type of conflict that works under very short timescales for the actual engagement, hence their fleet composition and tactics being that of a high DPS blob.

Quote:
Their business model is oriented toward praying on the weak
Don't be, or appear to be, weak; if you act like a victim in a game like Eve, somebody will be along shortly to strengthen that role-play and make you one.

Quote:
and many of their adherants operate from NPC corps so that they don't need to face a conventional hi-sec war... They are nothing more than a bunch of cowards.
What's good for the goose is also good for the gander.

Many hauler, miners and industrialists operate from NPC corps for the exact same reason, to avoid wardecs; which is one of the reasons that suicide ganking is an allowed playstyle, you're not meant to be safe anywhere. That's before we get into that waging a conventional war against CODE. wouldn't be the easiest of tasks considering that they're probably on reasonable terms with the hisec mercs and the various restrictions that the game applies to suicide gankers.

As for cowards? Who knows, what I do know is that some of them are either people, or alts of people, that indulge in PvP that involves other people shooting back.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Marcus Binchiette
Federal Vanguard
#906 - 2016-10-09 15:46:07 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
..While they are extortionists, it was his choice to pay the permit fee, which came about after discussions between themselves and CCP about what they can and can't do in the pursuit of forcing their collective will upon other players.

...Given that he went out and joined them on a few ops also means that he's learnt how the mechanics work, how to avoid them being used on him and the benefits of working with others towards a common goal; that puts him way ahead of many hisec players in risk mitigation.


...It's a different kind of conflict, economic warfare by proxy if you will; there's a reason more than a few industrialists give CODE. regular donations. It's also a type of conflict that works under very short timescales for the actual engagement, hence their tactics are that of a heavy DPS blob.


...Don't be, or appear to be, weak; if you act like a victim in a game like Eve, somebody will be along shortly to strengthen that role-play and make you one.

That's before we get into the fact that waging a conventional war against CODE. wouldn't be the easiest of tasks considering the restriction that game applies to suicide gankers.


It doesn't take a lot of effort to understand the mechanics. The essential problem with paying for a licence, is that in doing so you are aiding CODE to fulfil it's objectives. Even worse than this, paying for this 'license' is an act of submission and legitimises the authority of CODE over oneself... My point is simply this: That a man who is still in possession of his balls would not do this.


I do understand very well the theory and mechanics of warfare, and what you describe is an "aid-de-coup". A war on trade. Executed as part of a military strategy it can be very effective. Though, in the absence of a legitimate opponent which you are seeking to crush it is simply a criminal method of gaining income through the theft of things which others have created.

Yes CODE does engage in aggressive PvP. But it is one which follows a very precise and narrow script. Such things are highly susceptible to disruption. So I think your notion that a war on CODE would be fruitless needs re-evaluation.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#907 - 2016-10-09 16:22:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Marcus Binchiette wrote:
It doesn't take a lot of effort to understand the mechanics.
You're right, the mechanics themselves are fairly simple; the basics being timers, EHP vs DPS calculations and moving concord around, the only real unknowns are the mood of the loot fairy and other players.

Which begs the question why do so many fail at using some of them to their advantage?

Quote:
The essential problem with paying for a licence, is that in doing so you are aiding CODE to fulfil it's objectives. Even worse than this, paying for this 'license' is an act of submission and legitimises the authority of CODE over oneself... My point is simply this: That a man who is still in possession of his balls would not do this.
And the same man who doesn't pay for a permit because "mah balls" will likely cry on in local when his barge gets ganked Roll

With the exception of a symbolic payment and an addition to your bio, the gankers don't really demand much that you shouldn't be doing anyway.

Quote:
I do understand very well the theory and mechanics of warfare, and what you describe is an "aid-de-coup". A war on trade. Executed as part of a military strategy it can be very effective. Though, in the absence of a legitimate opponent which you are seeking to crush it is simply a criminal method of gaining income through the theft of things which others have created.
There's always a legitimate opponent when you get to write your own script, which is one of the great parts of Eve. In CODE.'s case that legitimate opponent is anybody without a permit, the criminality involved has no bearing on the matter.

Welcome to the most frightening virtual playground you'll ever experience.

Quote:
Yes CODE does engage in aggressive PvP. But it is one which follows a very precise and narrow script. Such things are highly susceptible to disruption. So I think your notion that a war on CODE would be fruitless needs re-evaluation.
It's been tried, CODE. don't care about ship losses and most of the ships that they do lose were destined to live very short lives anyway, in addition they'd probably get assistance from other merc corps (BAW have allied with them when Marmite decced them in the past) and they're used to bringing cheap, silly DPS (of all kinds) to parties.

In short the ships that they would have used to gank a freighter will simply be turned upon whoever has them wardecced and turns up to disrupt them.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#908 - 2016-10-09 17:13:47 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Kaivarian Coste wrote:
^ Interesting stats. Makes me wonder where all the mining is being done then.

In terms of the current situation:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/3_mining.value.by.region.png

Nullsec and Highsec.

The Forge is typically 1 or 2 consistently and some null areas swap around a bit for places. Lonetrek and Domain are always up there.

So still lots of mining in highsec.

can you show the same chart from like 2012? Just to compare

2012 wouldn't be 'in terms of the current situation' would it?

They aren't my charts you ******* idiot, they are CCP's and you know they only began publishing them regularly this year.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#909 - 2016-10-09 22:34:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Mark Marconi
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Kaivarian Coste wrote:
Mark Marconi wrote:

They don't mine in groups or by themselves. Most of them have gone.


Yeah, I remember some years ago, you'd always find a miner or two in nearly EVERY high sec system. If you were mining yourself, it'd become a race to to see who could strip the belts first (and leave the rags behind).

These days, you can mine at your leisure. It's kinda sad.

The game peaked in 2013, yet if you look at the value of ores mined since then, the same amount of mining is still going on:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/0_produced.vs.destroyed.png

Of course, perhaps minerals have risen in price, opps not much change at all:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/9fa_index.decomp.MineralPriceIndex.png

Overall, these show mining has slowed (as many areas of the game have) but not much at all.


As you can see here Most of the hi-sec minerals excluding pyerite are down on 2013 levels and when you consider the high levels of tritium, pyerite and mexallon and even isogen in null sec ores, it shows that hi-sec mining is not actually doing that well.
Especially when you look at some of the high volume regions that are null sec like Malpais, Delve and Providence you start to realise how few high sec miners are left.

Look at the places in hisec that miners used to frequent, Sinq Liason, Heimatar, Essence, Tash-Murkon all out done by null-sec regions. Null you know the place that is meant to be more dangerous that Hi-Sec.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#910 - 2016-10-09 23:16:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Mark Marconi wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Kaivarian Coste wrote:
Mark Marconi wrote:

They don't mine in groups or by themselves. Most of them have gone.


Yeah, I remember some years ago, you'd always find a miner or two in nearly EVERY high sec system. If you were mining yourself, it'd become a race to to see who could strip the belts first (and leave the rags behind).

These days, you can mine at your leisure. It's kinda sad.

The game peaked in 2013, yet if you look at the value of ores mined since then, the same amount of mining is still going on:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/0_produced.vs.destroyed.png

Of course, perhaps minerals have risen in price, opps not much change at all:

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/70577/1/9fa_index.decomp.MineralPriceIndex.png

Overall, these show mining has slowed (as many areas of the game have) but not much at all.


As you can see here Most of the hi-sec minerals excluding pyerite are down on 2013 levels and when you consider the high levels of tritium, pyerite and mexallon and even isogen in null sec ores, it shows that hi-sec mining is not actually doing that well.
Especially when you look at some of the high volume regions that are null sec like Malpais, Delve and Providence you start to realise how few high sec miners are left.

Look at the places in hisec that miners used to frequent, Sinq Liason, Heimatar, Essence, Tash-Murkon all out done by null-sec regions. Null you know the place that is meant to be more dangerous that Hi-Sec.

The whole game is down on numbers. Across the board.

Trying to cry that carebears have been driven from the game because of PvPers is so simple, only a fool would think it.

2013 was Eve's peak year for numbers. Numbers are down 30% odd on then, yet mining volumes aren't down 30%. There's still lots of mining going on in highsec.

But cry more.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Marcus Binchiette
Federal Vanguard
#911 - 2016-10-09 23:46:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Marcus Binchiette
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
With the exception of a symbolic payment and an addition to your bio, the gankers don't really demand much that you shouldn't be doing anyway...

There's always a legitimate opponent when you get to write your own script, which is one of the great parts of Eve. In CODE.'s case that legitimate opponent is anybody without a permit, the criminality involved has no bearing on the matter.

Welcome to the most frightening virtual playground you'll ever experience.

...Yes CODE does engage in aggressive PvP. But it is one which follows a very precise and narrow script. Such things are highly susceptible to disruption. So I think your notion that a war on CODE would be fruitless needs re-evaluation. It's been tried, CODE. don't care about ship losses and most of the ships that they do lose were destined to live very short lives anyway, in addition they'd probably get assistance from other merc corps (BAW have allied with them when Marmite decced them in the past) and they're used to bringing cheap, silly DPS (of all kinds) to parties.

...In short the ships that they would have used to gank a freighter will simply be turned upon whoever has them wardecced and turns up to disrupt them.


Your claims that CODE is somehow serving some higher and noble purpose are lost on me. In simple biological terms, CODE is a parasite and I will always regard them as such.

As for your comments on war, and how it would likely work, it is clear to me from your comments that you don't understand how this might work. Or at least that such a thing hasn't happened yet. I am well aware that CODE uses many short lived ships and is fully prepared to loose them - but you also need to understand that any hypothetical opponent is also going to understand this as well. Perhaps we should leave this theory-crafting until we have more experiences to work with.
Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#912 - 2016-10-09 23:51:03 UTC
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

The whole game is down on numbers. Across the board.

Trying to cry that carebears have been driven from the game because of PvPers is so simple, only a fool would think it.

2013 was Eve's peak year for numbers. Numbers are down 30% odd on then, yet mining volumes aren't down 30%. There's still lots of mining going on in highsec.

But cry more.

But as you can see they are not down as far as minerals are concerned. yes there was an alteration to mineral levels but even with that if everywhere was down 30% null would be on par at best, not a 50% increase in Megacyte.

The simple fact is that carebears HAVE been driven from the game. Look at the stats you yourself posted, the hi-sec minerals are down, the majority of the highest mining areas are not in hi-sec and why?

Because risk vs reward is broken, it costs more to war dec a large alliance than a small corp and gankers are using 2 destroyers to kill exhumers, hardly risk vs rewate, and killing freighters with 10 destroyers.

Yeah they are risking so much, 10 million worth of ships to kill a billion. All in so called Hi-Sec space. Maybe we need a bit more realism where the cops shoot down killers on site. I mean permanently not wait till they jump into a new clone and shake their finger at them.

So yeah carebears did get sick of them being the ones taking all the risk and they voted with their wallets and left.

CCP forgot the golden rule, those that have the gold make the rules, not those that spend most of their time on a video game.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#913 - 2016-10-10 00:13:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Mark Marconi wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

The whole game is down on numbers. Across the board.

Trying to cry that carebears have been driven from the game because of PvPers is so simple, only a fool would think it.

2013 was Eve's peak year for numbers. Numbers are down 30% odd on then, yet mining volumes aren't down 30%. There's still lots of mining going on in highsec.

But cry more.

But as you can see they are not down as far as minerals are concerned. yes there was an alteration to mineral levels but even with that if everywhere was down 30% null would be on par at best, not a 50% increase in Megacyte.

The simple fact is that carebears HAVE been driven from the game. Look at the stats you yourself posted, the hi-sec minerals are down, the majority of the highest mining areas are not in hi-sec and why?

Because risk vs reward is broken, it costs more to war dec a large alliance than a small corp and gankers are using 2 destroyers to kill exhumers, hardly risk vs rewate, and killing freighters with 10 destroyers.

Yeah they are risking so much, 10 million worth of ships to kill a billion. All in so called Hi-Sec space. Maybe we need a bit more realism where the cops shoot down killers on site. I mean permanently not wait till they jump into a new clone and shake their finger at them.

So yeah carebears did get sick of them being the ones taking all the risk and they voted with their wallets and left.

CCP forgot the golden rule, those that have the gold make the rules, not those that spend most of their time on a video game.

The only thing carebears have driven is the constant whinging and whining.

Those figures you are looking at increased right after the mineral rebalance. Go read the devblogs. It's all in black and white. That's why earlier the graphs were mining related, not minerals value related.

Drop the self importance. PvEers (not carebears) are no more or less valuable to the game than PvPers. Many players include a lot of different activities in their play from mining to pvp.

Only carebears who don't matter at all think they are key to the game's success.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Marcus Binchiette
Federal Vanguard
#914 - 2016-10-10 00:19:41 UTC
Well the problem is that, the way I see it, CODE is simply using the CONCORD mechanics as a shield - and undertaking "war-like actions" without the full repercussions of what a war would actually entail. So we have the ridiculous situation where we know who the real targets are, but, we can't shoot them. CODE happily breaks the rules in hi-sec when it has the interest in doing so, but, then uses that very same protection which CONCORD provides to escape retribution.

- and yes from the new player perspective CODE is most annoying. It wouldn't surprise me if many new players just quit straight after trial. The real heart of this game is in full blown PvP. But, before a player can get to that level they need the resources, the skills accumulated to do this. Hi-sec is a place where new players can safely do these things until they are ready for null-sec...

So when you start greifing new players before they are capable of operating at your level - and in doing so hamper their development. Then yes you are doing this game a dis-servce. If you're part of CODE then you are part of the cancer which is driving newer players from this game. To put it bluntly, you are a bastard.
Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#915 - 2016-10-10 00:20:59 UTC
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

The only thing carebears have driven is the constant whinging and whining.

Those figures you are looking at increased right after the mineral rebalance. Go read the devblogs. It's all in black and white.

Drop the self importance. PvEers (not carebears) are no more or less valuable to the game than PvPers. Many players include a lot of different activities in their play from mining to pvp.

Only carebears who don't matter at all think they are key to the game's success.

If you bothered to read I did not the mineral rebalance, which was just over 30% so as I said null should be flat if it has had a 30% decline in players but megacyte has had a 50% increase.

You are right you do need PvErs and PvPers to make the game work properly and prosper. Problem is the game was set for so long to favour the PvPers that the PvErs left.

Like I said look at risk vs reward, 2 million loss in ships to kill a 200 million ship is not a balanced risk vs reward. Killing a 1.3 billion isk ship for 10 million loss in ships is not balanced. Yes there should be a risk but it needs to be a real loss like having to use at least 50% of the cost of the ship your attacking seems fair. You want to attack a freighter it should cost you 10 battle cruisers not 10 destroyers.

you know balance. Then the PvE players might look at the game again.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#916 - 2016-10-10 00:23:11 UTC
Mark Marconi wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

The only thing carebears have driven is the constant whinging and whining.

Those figures you are looking at increased right after the mineral rebalance. Go read the devblogs. It's all in black and white.

Drop the self importance. PvEers (not carebears) are no more or less valuable to the game than PvPers. Many players include a lot of different activities in their play from mining to pvp.

Only carebears who don't matter at all think they are key to the game's success.

If you bothered to read I did not the mineral rebalance, which was just over 30% so as I said null should be flat if it has had a 30% decline in players but megacyte has had a 50% increase.

You are right you do need PvErs and PvPers to make the game work properly and prosper. Problem is the game was set for so long to favour the PvPers that the PvErs left.

Like I said look at risk vs reward, 2 million loss in ships to kill a 200 million ship is not a balanced risk vs reward. Killing a 1.3 billion isk ship for 10 million loss in ships is not balanced. Yes there should be a risk but it needs to be a real loss like having to use at least 50% of the cost of the ship your attacking seems fair. You want to attack a freighter it should cost you 10 battle cruisers not 10 destroyers.

you know balance. Then the PvE players might look at the game again.

Bullshit. I'm a pve'er and I play together with a lot of other PvEers that are still here.

The simplistic, PVEers left because of PvPers is so stupid an argument.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#917 - 2016-10-10 00:24:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Marcus Binchiette wrote:
Well the problem is that, the way I see it, CODE is simply using the CONCORD mechanics as a shield - and undertaking "war-like actions" without the full repercussions of what a war would actually entail. So we have the ridiculous situation where we know who the real targets are, but, we can't shoot them. CODE happily breaks the rules in hi-sec when it has the interest in doing so, but, then uses that very same protection which CONCORD provides to escape retribution.

- and yes from the new player perspective CODE is most annoying. It wouldn't surprise me if many new players just quit straight after trial. The real heart of this game is in full blown PvP. But, before a player can get to that level they need the resources, the skills accumulated to do this. Hi-sec is a place where new players can safely do these things until they are ready for null-sec...

So when you start greifing new players before they are capable of operating at your level - and in doing so hamper their development. Then yes you are doing this game a dis-servce. If you're part of CODE then you are part of the cancer which is driving newer players from this game. To put it bluntly, you are a bastard.

You can shoot them just fine. Just like they shoot other people.

Your claims in relation to cancer don't match the information CCP has concluded. Just another set of unvalidated opinions that you think must be true but have never actually checked.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#918 - 2016-10-10 00:30:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Mark Marconi
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

Bullshit. I'm a pve'er and I play together with a lot of other PvEers that are still here.

The simplistic, PVEers left because of PvPers is so stupid an argument.

If your statement was true, most of the mining would not be occurring in Null, mineral prices like trit would not have doubled over the last 5 years especially after the 32.5% increase in yield.

Yes there are still PvE players left but they are as the stats show, as far as hi-sec goes a larger drop than those in PvP as if PvP had fallen the same the mineral prices for all minerals should be down 30%

Simple maths.

Edit: Plus CCP would not be making things easier for miners and industrialists if they were the majority of those who stayed.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.

Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#919 - 2016-10-10 00:35:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Shae Tadaruwa
Mark Marconi wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

Bullshit. I'm a pve'er and I play together with a lot of other PvEers that are still here.

The simplistic, PVEers left because of PvPers is so stupid an argument.

If your statement was true, most of the mining would not be occurring in Null, mineral prices like trit would not have doubled over the last 5 years especially after the 32.5% increase in yield.

Yes there are still PvE players left but they are as the stats show, as far as hi-sec goes a larger drop than those in PvP as if PvP had fallen the same the mineral prices for all minerals should be down 30%

Simple maths.

Edit: Plus CCP would not be making things easier for miners and industrialists if they were the majority of those who stayed.

What does highsec v nullsec have to do with this?

Mining and the value of the minerals is not the same thing. CCP rebalanced ores to make nullsec mining more rewarding. Of course it works out that way. It's by design.

You're on about carebears being the salt of the earth that holds the game together and woah betide CCP that they have left. Carebears bring nothing good to the game.

It's complete rubbish. That you can't get past your own bias isn't a fault of the data. That's your own narrow mindedness.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#920 - 2016-10-10 00:37:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Mark Marconi
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:

That you can't get past your own bias isn't a fault of the data. That's your own narrow mindedness.

Just read your own quote to yourself.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.