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What will be the AUR price of Skill Extractors? Show us your guess!
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Kalgeroth
Doomheim
#41 - 2016-01-29 18:05:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Kalgeroth
Altair Taurus wrote:
Thus CCP will ban characters transfer market..


I think you're mistaken here - they've already stated this is an alternative rather than a replacement with certain drawbacks and benefits. For example, if you want a high SP character you're not going to be using up 100's of injectors at 150k SP a pop...

People will put a price on their SP. You won't be able to buy injectors for the ISK value of the AUR used to purchase them. And so if the AUR cost is high, these things will cost over 1bn, which puts them out of the reach of their intended market of younger players...
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#42 - 2016-01-29 18:15:11 UTC
if ccp is smart it will cost $5. or a bit less (no less then 2.50)

if they are not smart, it will cost $20 or 1 plex worth of aurum

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Mr Mieyli
Doomheim
#43 - 2016-01-29 18:22:54 UTC
Gully Alex Foyle wrote:
Mr Mieyli wrote:
To be honest, I can't see why someone would ever want to extract and sell SP especially with the loss of SP when injecting, unless of course it's an SP farming alt.
I disagree.

I think your impression is based on 12+ years of SP in EVE being an extremely scarce resource.

You could only get SP by passive training. An hour or a day of lost SP was LOST FOREVER. Back when you didn't have skill queues people would alarm clock at 3 AM to not waste SP, etc. etc.

But now, basically SP and ISK will be convertible. You'll be able to get SP out of ISK, and ISK out of SP.


So the point is, what do you want more? SP or ISK? Here's my guess:

WANT SP MORE
. New players (up to 1-2 years)
. ISK-rich players

These guys will buy extractors


WANT ISK MORE
. Casual players
. ISK-poor vets
. Guys that regularly sell PLEX instead of grinding for ISK

These guys will likely sell some or all of their SP because they need ISK more. Example: weekend PVP-er that hates ISK grinding, already has the SP to fly anything that his mates fly, but needs the ISK to replace losses.


DON'T CARE MUCH ABOUT SP
. Alts dedicated to one specific activity (e.g. trading, industry, cyno) for which they're already max-skilled

It's likely that several guys will consider selling SP on alts that don't need any more training


One last consideration: if you sold SP for ISK, then changed your mind, you could always buy it back... SP isn't a 'precious' resource anymore, it's just another commodity.


The problem is that ISK and SP are not convertible with these injectors. Say I'm a "want more isk" guy, if I do what you say and cannibilise my guy leaving him only able to fly certain ships then there's only X sp that I can extract. If someone buys that X sp off me and injects it they only get 0.7X (for example). This difference in SP is lost to the void, every sp trade loses more of that originally extracted sp. So now my guy has still lost his Sp and can't extract any more to sell, and the sp I did extract has been slowly passed around until most of it has disappeared. Seems to me that after a couple months of people shuffling SP around between characters that nobody except alt farms will use this feature.

If I want to make money I can already buy and sell a plex costing me no negatives, or I can sell part of my character and lose it for isk; if I'm going to get more downsides than buying plex I'm going to expect a higher return from selling SP.

This post brought to you by CCP's alpha forum alt initiative. Playing the eve forums has never come cheaper.
stede b0nnet
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#44 - 2016-01-29 18:39:18 UTC
I'm all for this being a new player, but if its 1 plex per extractor we should just ******* boycott the whole idea Pirate
Pryce Caesar
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#45 - 2016-01-29 18:59:24 UTC
I would say it is within the same area as a PLEX's worth of AURUM.

PLEX are versatile items, allowing you to add on game-time, activate multiple training (the actual Multiple Training Item is actually in the same price range as PLEX), convert to AURUM, or is used to re-sculpt your character's features (I think).

But the Skill Extractors and Injectors are another matter. They are an item directly impacting an individual character's performance. By injecting skillpoints into a character, you are able to shave off (at max) almost nine days of training time (at least two days at minimum), and this applies for skills of every rank (an automatic level up to level 5 for any Rank 1 skill for anyone except characters with 80 + mill skill points).

They could even surpass the price of PLEX, if the demand for them is high enough, since one could also use them to give a character who is not actively training skills an immediate skill boost in whatever skill they wish.
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#46 - 2016-01-29 20:13:49 UTC
Extractor costs are the equivalent of the char transfer fee in the bazaar. The average traded char has 50m skillpoints, which costs 2 PLEX to transfer. Hence a valid guess will be 1/100 PLEX (3500AUR) = 35 AUR.

I'm my own NPC alt.
stg slate
State War Academy
Caldari State
#47 - 2016-01-29 20:22:50 UTC  |  Edited by: stg slate
Tipa Riot wrote:
Extractor costs are the equivalent of the char transfer fee in the bazaar. The average traded char has 50m skillpoints, which costs 2 PLEX to transfer. Hence a valid guess will be 1/100 PLEX (3500AUR) = 35 AUR.


That would be ridiculous... I'd actually be a huge fan, but no way they'd consider that :P

You know, I'm getting annoyed they haven't told us how much they are yet.
DaReaper
Net 7
Cannon.Fodder
#48 - 2016-01-29 20:32:18 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
Extractor costs are the equivalent of the char transfer fee in the bazaar. The average traded char has 50m skillpoints, which costs 2 PLEX to transfer. Hence a valid guess will be 1/100 PLEX (3500AUR) = 35 AUR.


thats way too low. if you do the break down, $20 for aurum gives you 4035 aurum, so divide that by 20, and you get 201.75 for each $ spent. so 1 extractor would be about .65 cents

OMG Comet Mining idea!!! Comet Mining!

Eve For life.
Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#49 - 2016-01-29 20:41:18 UTC
DaReaper wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
Extractor costs are the equivalent of the char transfer fee in the bazaar. The average traded char has 50m skillpoints, which costs 2 PLEX to transfer. Hence a valid guess will be 1/100 PLEX (3500AUR) = 35 AUR.


thats way too low. if you do the break down, $20 for aurum gives you 4035 aurum, so divide that by 20, and you get 201.75 for each $ spent. so 1 extractor would be about .65 cents

Remember, the extractor is just a tool / fee, unlikely it will single or double the value of the actual skills. Finally it depends where CCP sees the break-even for the comparison with the bazaar. If they see it at 10m SP / 2 PLEX, the price for the extractor would be 175 AUR. Somewhere in that span ... but we will all know in a couple of days. P

I'm my own NPC alt.
Kalgeroth
Doomheim
#50 - 2016-01-29 20:50:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Kalgeroth
If they cost more than c500 AUR they're going to become a niche item very quickly

people will just use the character bazaar (both those seeking ISK and those seeking skills) if the economics of skill injection are not in balance with the market value of the skillpoints

even excellent characters in the bazaar don't generally cost more than around 250m ISK per 500k skillpoints
Kaivar Lancer
Doomheim
#51 - 2016-01-29 21:06:03 UTC
1 PLEX seems like commonsense.
Altair Taurus
#52 - 2016-01-29 21:53:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Altair Taurus
Nobody sane will pay 1-2 PLEX for 150-500k SP. Please stop assuming CCP is bunch of idiots who are going to introduce completely unprofitable and thus useless game feature...CCP wants to make a quick buck instead!
Mr Mieyli
Doomheim
#53 - 2016-01-29 23:14:15 UTC
Altair Taurus wrote:
Nobody sane will pay 1-2 PLEX for 150-500k SP. Please stop assuming CCP is bunch of idiots who are going to introduce completely unprofitable and thus useless game feature...CCP wants to make a quick buck instead!


The price of the actual extractor is set by CCP, the filled injector with all it's juicy SP will have it's price decided by players. If they value their SP, and I think most people will, then the price will be increased over the pure cost of the SP. The thing will be whether or not the price people are willing to pay for SP will match what people want to sell it for? So far I see no reason to sell my own SP when I can instead sell a plex for no skin off my back.

This post brought to you by CCP's alpha forum alt initiative. Playing the eve forums has never come cheaper.
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#54 - 2016-01-29 23:22:44 UTC
Altair Taurus wrote:
Nobody sane will pay 1-2 PLEX for 150-500k SP. Please stop assuming CCP is bunch of idiots who are going to introduce completely unprofitable and thus useless game feature...CCP wants to make a quick buck instead!



After paid 350m for PLEX i never thought i'd pay 1.2b but i did.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
Kalgeroth
Doomheim
#55 - 2016-01-30 00:56:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Kalgeroth
Tiddle Jr wrote:
Altair Taurus wrote:
Nobody sane will pay 1-2 PLEX for 150-500k SP. Please stop assuming CCP is bunch of idiots who are going to introduce completely unprofitable and thus useless game feature...CCP wants to make a quick buck instead!



After paid 350m for PLEX i never thought i'd pay 1.2b but i did.


Would you spend 1.5bn-2bn ISK for 500k (or more likely much less) skillpoints?

The reason I ask is that if the price is 1 plex, that's what an extractor is going to cost, and for many many players that is the choice facing them. People would have to be very rich, and very attached to their characters, to not simply buy a different character in the character bazaar for far, far less than the cost of injecting skill points.

Imagine the choice:

You want to train for Carrier with good skills - and have 30m SP. It will take 10m extra skillpoints to get there.

Option A: Buy injectors. For 1 plex per extractor, that's going to cost you 25 injectors, or approx 40-50bn ISK!!!
Option B: Buy a carrier pilot with 40m SP for 20bn ISK

I just can't imagine that CCP would be that dumb...but then again...they did introduce the $80 monocle...so who knows. But it would be a crazy move....
Tiddle Jr
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2016-01-30 01:07:09 UTC
Kalgeroth wrote:
Tiddle Jr wrote:
Altair Taurus wrote:
Nobody sane will pay 1-2 PLEX for 150-500k SP. Please stop assuming CCP is bunch of idiots who are going to introduce completely unprofitable and thus useless game feature...CCP wants to make a quick buck instead!



After paid 350m for PLEX i never thought i'd pay 1.2b but i did.


Would you spend 1.5bn-2bn ISK for 500k (or more likely much less) skillpoints?

The reason I ask is that if the price is 1 plex, that's what an extractor is going to cost, and for many many players that is the choice facing them. People would have to be very rich, and very attached to their characters, to not simply buy a different character in the character bazaar for far, far less than the cost of injecting skill points.

Imagine the choice:

You want to train for Carrier with good skills - and have 30m SP. It will take 10m extra skillpoints to get there.

Option A: Buy injectors. For 1 plex per extractor, that's going to cost you 25 injectors, or approx 40-50bn ISK!!!
Option B: Buy a carrier pilot with 40m SP for 20bn ISK

I just can't imagine that CCP would be that dumb...but then again...they did introduce the $80 monocle...so who knows. But it would be a crazy move....


Extractor won't cost 1 PLEX for sure otherwise it's like CCP shooting it's own leg. I hope they not stupid that hard. Injectors is a different story cause we are going to praise them.

"The message is that there are known knowns. There are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say there are things that we now know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know" - CCP
pajedas
Doomheim
#57 - 2016-01-30 01:13:15 UTC

I think most of you are confused about the proposed process. The 'Skill Extractor' should have a minimal cost and the ‘Skill Injector’ will be market driven. I would hope that CCP will also allow contracts to be created. IMO a player should be able to chose who he/she would like to sell/trade/give their SP's to.

🐇
alindak Kahoudi
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#58 - 2016-01-30 01:34:11 UTC  |  Edited by: alindak Kahoudi
I’d be more interested in knowing what the market price is going to be for a 500k sp points injector...
alindak Kahoudi
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#59 - 2016-01-30 01:36:58 UTC
Most ppl are confused about the process, extractors are just modules to suck out the valuable thing (sp points) g

Granted, they won't be cheap, but no a damn plex just for 3 of them.
Yossarian Toralen
M and M Enterpises
#60 - 2016-01-30 06:01:08 UTC
The price on the market will be affected by the amount of money they charge for the tool, the cost of the tool to move SP around should be negligible seeing as they have stated that the market will set the price.

But at the end of the day CCP owns the SP even though they have earned income from selling it the first time so they can charge whatever they want for the the tool to move it.

My guess is 2 for a plex or whatever that converts into AUR and that will be way too much to not affect market value of the final product.