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Share your experiences with Fozziesov!

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Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#561 - 2015-08-08 20:41:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
And on the issue of stagnant it will change not when CCP comes up with some magic mechanic it will occur when you make it occur.
Then it won't happen and null will remain the area we farm between highsec gank ops.

I have to agree completely here.
The onus is no longer on us.
Give us (and the attackers) an actual reason to commit, and to fight, and things might change.
Until then, all they've done is change the bandage on a festering wound, without cleaning it first.
Looks better, but still infected.


I have heard this same sentiment repeatedly from you nullsec guys, you think that it is CCPs job to FORCE you to have fun?

" the onus is no longer on us", WTF ???

If you think that CCP can force you to have fun and you are waiting for game mechanics to make that happen, you have a long wait ahead of you because ive been playing video games since pong was the big kid on the block and not a single game FORCED me to have fun, I had to make that choice myself in every game i have ever played.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#562 - 2015-08-08 20:47:13 UTC
Kiandoshia wrote:
Like I said, we're not having fun on our own and if they keep letting us come up with 'metas' we wont.

We need to be forced to have fun, we need limitations.


Um, CCP cannot force you to have fun, you can choose to be miserable if you want and nothing CCP can do about that except perhaps pity your poor choice.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#563 - 2015-08-08 20:49:01 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
The rest of your post is just an angry rant, and I ignored it.

By that measure pretty much any of the quote-unquote "feedback" you bring up could be ignored.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#564 - 2015-08-08 20:51:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Kiandoshia wrote:
.

We need to be forced to have fun, we need limitations.


I vote the quoted sentence to be the saddest ever to be posted on these forums :(


Sad, but apparently it seems a widely held belief amongst the nullsec crowd, that somehow CCP can FORCE them to have fun, which CCP cannot do, no matter what they do with EVE, fun is and always will be a choice, not only in EVE but in the rest of your life as well, choose fun or be miserable they are both choices but one is imminently more enjoyable.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Loneball
PlexForce07
#565 - 2015-08-08 20:52:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Loneball
Give us an actual reason?

LoL! Ok, uhhhh. . . . . .

How about we issue:

CHALLENGES!!!!

Party A issues a CHALLENGE to Party B!!!

Party B has 5 minutes to respond and fight. If they do not undock and aggress on one of the challengers within that 5 minutes,

PARTY B GETS BANNED FROM THE GAME FOR 24 HOURS!

That's an actual reason right?

Play the game or you'll not get to play the game. That's kind of how it is right now, but maybe we should make it official.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#566 - 2015-08-08 21:06:23 UTC
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I actually thought it was the ironic type.

we need ccp's vision of nullsec to be thrust in our faces after all

It would help if they'd turn on the windshield wipers every once in a while though.


It took me, ZERO game playing time to figure out what EVE was about since i read up on the game before i ever logged in the first time. Since it took me ZERO gaming time to figure out what EVE was about why is it that 10+ years into playing EVE, nullsec is apparently STILL in need of hand holding on what the f***ing game is about ?

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#567 - 2015-08-08 21:14:41 UTC
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I actually thought it was the ironic type.

we need ccp's vision of nullsec to be thrust in our faces after all


It said : "forced to have fun." That is not ironic, it is heartbreakingly sad on a level beyond believe that gamers have succumbed to this state of mind. It is entitlement on God level.

This is what happens when you leave humans to their own devices.
Efficiency will always supersede fun. If you looks at nearly any game (especially mmos), early mystique and wonder pretty rapidly give way to min/maxing, theorycrafting, and in the case of Eve, metagaming on a ridiculously high level.

Those who do not adopt these things, quickly find themselves in the dustbin.
That's where fun in any sort of competitive game lands you.


No, you let min/maxing supersede fun, it isnt some kind of game requirement, you blame human nature but you do realize that most people playing video games, EVE or otherwise DONT min/max they settle for pretty damn good and leave it there because min/maxing tends to make playing a video game feel more like a job than a source of entertainment.

Choose fun and you'll find it, make excuses and you wont.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Loneball
PlexForce07
#568 - 2015-08-08 21:19:24 UTC
word, min/maxing is good for artists.

You know, artists. People really good at drawing and stuff.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#569 - 2015-08-08 21:22:48 UTC
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I actually thought it was the ironic type.

we need ccp's vision of nullsec to be thrust in our faces after all


It said : "forced to have fun." That is not ironic, it is heartbreakingly sad on a level beyond believe that gamers have succumbed to this state of mind. It is entitlement on God level.

This is what happens when you leave humans to their own devices.
Efficiency will always supersede fun. If you looks at nearly any game (especially mmos), early mystique and wonder pretty rapidly give way to min/maxing, theorycrafting, and in the case of Eve, metagaming on a ridiculously high level.

Those who do not adopt these things, quickly find themselves in the dustbin.
That's where fun in any sort of competitive game lands you.


No, you let min/maxing supersede fun, it isnt some kind of game requirement, you blame human nature but you do realize that most people playing video games, EVE or otherwise DONT min/max they settle for pretty damn good and leave it there because min/maxing tends to make playing a video game feel more like a job than a source of entertainment.

Choose fun and you'll find it, make excuses and you wont.

You ignored the part about what happens to people who put fun above efficiency. I am sure you did this, because it is undeniable.
You want to see a prime example of what happens when "fun/hr" is your primary goal? Have a look at how Brave is doing these days.
Turns out getting farmed to death doesn't make for compelling gameplay, no matter what you may want to tell yourself.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#570 - 2015-08-08 21:22:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I think it's because following BR5 there were international news articles (in mainstream news, not just gaming news) and an influx of new players. That's what drives people to the game. "Come and play whack-a-mole in space" isn't.

It drove a lot of people to the game, who promptly left when they discovered that nullsec fights like that happen incredibly seldom because even in the days of BR-5 the vast majority of nullsec was blue to each other.


And now they just straight up don't happen. Which is apparently... better?


You (nullsec) chose to have few fights before and you are choosing to have zero of them now, not because fozziesov has made big fights impossible, quite the contrary it has made them easier to get into but you are CHOOSING to fight fozziesov instead of CHOOSING to use it to get into big fights. And as i mentioned in other posts CCP cannot force you to have fun with fozziesov, you could choose to but..........you stubbornly wont.......by choice.

Instead you are throwing the biggest self-pity party in the history of EVE, congrats well played and to such a productive end.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#571 - 2015-08-08 21:32:34 UTC
For the record, min/maxing can be fun, and as space nerds we know that. Until it's not, that's it...

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#572 - 2015-08-08 21:44:56 UTC
lucas kell wrote:
Which is why conflict need to be encouraged by nullsec mechanics. If they read the news about big battles then arrived and found that there was a healthy amount of smaller battles they can get straight in on between the big ones, they'd be much more inclined to stay.


Sigh.......

Again CCP cannot force you to fight each other, nothing CCP programs into EVE can MAKE you fight. You must chose to fight and you have made it clear in a previous post that you have ZERO intention of doing so.

You dont like fozziesov not because it doesnt work but because it does. You are miserable with fozziesov not because it has to be that what but because you choose to play in a fashion that makes it miserable.

EVE is about choice and as a group nullsec is making the wrong one about fozziesov and suffering for it, as they should.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#573 - 2015-08-08 21:54:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Nicolai Serkanner wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I actually thought it was the ironic type.

we need ccp's vision of nullsec to be thrust in our faces after all


It said : "forced to have fun." That is not ironic, it is heartbreakingly sad on a level beyond believe that gamers have succumbed to this state of mind. It is entitlement on God level.

This is what happens when you leave humans to their own devices.
Efficiency will always supersede fun. If you looks at nearly any game (especially mmos), early mystique and wonder pretty rapidly give way to min/maxing, theorycrafting, and in the case of Eve, metagaming on a ridiculously high level.

Those who do not adopt these things, quickly find themselves in the dustbin.
That's where fun in any sort of competitive game lands you.


No, you let min/maxing supersede fun, it isnt some kind of game requirement, you blame human nature but you do realize that most people playing video games, EVE or otherwise DONT min/max they settle for pretty damn good and leave it there because min/maxing tends to make playing a video game feel more like a job than a source of entertainment.

Choose fun and you'll find it, make excuses and you wont.

You ignored the part about what happens to people who put fun above efficiency. I am sure you did this, because it is undeniable.
You want to see a prime example of what happens when "fun/hr" is your primary goal? Have a look at how Brave is doing these days.
Turns out getting farmed to death doesn't make for compelling gameplay, no matter what you may want to tell yourself.


Then you admit that the reason you are not having fun is your own (poor) choice, great we agree.

I have a great time everyday, you are choosing to be miserable, i enjoy my choice and you just endure yours. Which one of us is really winning EVE, id have to say me because im enjoying myself and you are not by your own admission.

There is no more bitter pill to swallow than the one you made yourself.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.
Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#574 - 2015-08-08 22:29:30 UTC
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:

Then you admit that the reason you are not having fun is your own (poor) choice, great we agree.

I have a great time everyday, you are choosing to be miserable, i enjoy my choice and you just endure yours. Which one of us is really winning EVE, id have to say me because im enjoying myself and you are not by your own admission.

There is no more bitter pill to swallow than the one you made yourself.

Who's miserable? Eve actually happens to have facilitated the only reason I am still around (being in alliance with the people I play with). I spend far more time on Mumble, Jabber, and forums than actually playing Eve, so if CCP continues to **** it up, I'm sure we'll all find another home elsewhere.

But, until then, we'll keep pointing out their **** design choices as they are made, and hope that they knock it off at some point.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#575 - 2015-08-08 22:45:04 UTC
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Turns out getting farmed to death doesn't make for compelling gameplay, no matter what you may want to tell yourself.

Get massadeath to write you a victory narrative and keep it up years and several membership changes later

... it works.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Kiandoshia
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#576 - 2015-08-08 22:47:03 UTC
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Kiandoshia wrote:
Like I said, we're not having fun on our own and if they keep letting us come up with 'metas' we wont.

We need to be forced to have fun, we need limitations.


Um, CCP cannot force you to have fun, you can choose to be miserable if you want and nothing CCP can do about that except perhaps pity your poor choice.


Of course they can. They make this game. They can make all ship classes relevant, they can make all ship types relevant and all weapons viable and all choices of ammo have some kind of point. They are the god in the sky that can change everything and tweak all the numbers and force us to do anything.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#577 - 2015-08-08 23:30:30 UTC
Icycle wrote:
I think its disgracefull to complain about boredom and that fozzysov is boring when they are clearly not doing nothing them selves to spice it up. You have massive blob of blues and they wont deploy. CFC fault, not the rest of eve or CCP.
It was like this before so nothing to do with fuzzy sov. Fozzy sovstill brings a lot of fun and pvp. There are those that already are choosing to escalate it from the start to titans Blink
"not doing nothing". So we're doing something?

And lol, we're back to that crap where you're suggesting that because CCP can't design a fun mechanic that we should cripple ourselves to create content. How about we go back to dominion sov, then the onus is back on you to create your own superblob to fight? No? Oh that's right, because you guys shouldn't be forced to play any particular way, but we should just abandon our coalitions and fight at random with our neighbours to keep the game going.

**** that. If CCP can't build an entertaining mechanic, we'll continue to just farm null as we ever have until the game dies.


Snowmann wrote:
The recent Sov changes came about because of the complaints about the previous Sov system, and the blue donut.
Yes. You guys crying about the mysterious blue doughnut and actively refusing to do what you needed to do to fight in the sov system (form up into coalitions) because it bored you, so you complained. Now it's the other way round, where we're expected to just trash our way of playing to play with the boring new struture mining whack-a-mole mechanics. You're a hypocrite.

I think the real issue is the players and leaders themselves. They are bored with "this" game as it is, and they won't play in the new system because they don't automatically have the advantage like they used to.

Snowmann wrote:
Sov warfare now has a much lower barrier to entry and their big toys can be easily outmaneuvered in the new system.
They want fights on their terms, where the incumbents have the advantage.
No they can't. Nobody can take sov that we want under the new system without fighting our "big toys". They still exist and any serious attempts to take sov will result in fleet fights which we will generally outblob. The only difference is that idiots in interceptors feel relevant when they make us have to respond almost constatntly.

Snowmann wrote:
Getting new blood out there and at the top would be far more effective.
Go on then. You think new blood is needed, so be new blood. Form up your own alliance and your own coalition and take some space.

Snowmann wrote:
But the ultimate change would be to make the best gear rare, not by cost, but by being unique.
That would probably be the hardest change, but it might be the best.
Why would it? The best gear is mostly irrelevant anyway. Sheer numbers beat out shiptypes any day. All you're really saying here is "I don't like titans, therefore titans should be removed". It's not going to happen.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#578 - 2015-08-08 23:41:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
1. You admit that you have gamed nullsec and the reason you dont find big fights is because you dont want to, thanks its about time at least one of you admitted this truth, certainly a step in the right direction.
Everyone games every system. It's the nature of MMOs and pretty much the most defining win metric. We could easily set each other red and fight, but we would literally be throwing away what we have just to generate content because CCP are bad at game design. No thanks, I'd literally rather watch null die than have to fake content into the game.

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
2. You ask why dont i condemn those small groups for not bringing you big fights it is because i have not heard them moaning en masse that they want big fights, it is you that said you did and at the same time give yet another lame excuse why you dont, that being you might lose sov well that is what your fights are supposed to be about not staged slap fights in space.
Of course you haven't, because most of them are "grr goons". They don't care whether null mechanics or fun or whether players are attracted to EVE, they simply want to feel like they've got one up on the null groups. What dumb is that this mechanic also make it easier for use to deny people space if we really want to, and I think as renter alliances grow back in you're going to see that happening a lot more.

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
3. If nullsec remains stagnant that is okay as i said CCP cant make you have fun, you can block that fun any time you like but dont blame fozziesov because you want to sit on your space ass and do nothing all day, fozziesov is telling you that isnt how its going to be anymore. So fight frigates all day or go get into a big fight but stop blaming fozziesov for your personal shortcomings.
You say that's OK, but CCP disagrees. They know that nullsec is a massive portion of the appeal of the game, and they won't leave that to die. And no, Fozziesov isn't saying that. If anything it's saying "sit on your ass more" since we now have to farm our space to keep indices up. Sure, we have to chase frigates and the capture mechanics are boring as hell, but we can pretty much ignore most of the mechanics and be safe in the knowledge that our space is secure. Fozziesov was supposed to encourage people to want to fight, it failed. That's what you don't seem to be able to get into your head over whatever it is that goonswarm did to make you flip your **** like you have here.

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
I have heard this same sentiment repeatedly from you nullsec guys, you think that it is CCPs job to FORCE you to have fun?
No, CCP are supposed to make the mechanics fun enough that we want to use them. They are terrible, therefore we don't want to use them. We're not going to go out of our way to generate content just because CCP can't produce a mechanic the vast majority of their null playerbase want to interact with. It's game design 101.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Drachiel
Mercury LLC
#579 - 2015-08-08 23:46:17 UTC
10mn Svipuls are metagame enough without being awesome at tossing from 150KM away going sonic hedgehog fast.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#580 - 2015-08-08 23:48:51 UTC
Loneball wrote:
Give us an actual reason?

LoL! Ok, uhhhh. . . . . .

How about we issue:

CHALLENGES!!!!

Party A issues a CHALLENGE to Party B!!!

Party B has 5 minutes to respond and fight. If they do not undock and aggress on one of the challengers within that 5 minutes,

PARTY B GETS BANNED FROM THE GAME FOR 24 HOURS!

That's an actual reason right?

Play the game or you'll not get to play the game. That's kind of how it is right now, but maybe we should make it official.
Minus the bannign part, that's what we're asking for. The problem is, it's currently this.

1. Party A shows up in disposable ships
2. Party A challenges Party B
3. Party B shows up to fight
4. Party A runs away and cloaks
5. Party B returns to ratting
6. Goto 1

What we want is for Party A to put enough on the line for step 1 that they may actually lose during the fight so that when the challenge Party B, a fight actually occurs. That won't happen without trollceptors going in the bin and more needing to be put on the field to challenge sov. It used to require too many people and too much isk. Now it requires too few people and too little isk. It just needs to be balanced somewhere in the middle. I think at some point along the line CCP forgot this is an alliance level mechanic, not something one idiot in a frigate should be able to contest.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.