These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Share your experiences with Fozziesov!

First post First post
Author
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#541 - 2015-08-08 08:25:21 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I think it's because following BR5 there were international news articles (in mainstream news, not just gaming news) and an influx of new players. That's what drives people to the game. "Come and play whack-a-mole in space" isn't.

It drove a lot of people to the game, who promptly left when they discovered that nullsec fights like that happen incredibly seldom because even in the days of BR-5 the vast majority of nullsec was blue to each other.
Which is why conflict need to be encouraged by nullsec mechanics. If they read the news about big battles then arrived and found that there was a healthy amount of smaller battles they can get straight in on between the big ones, they'd be much more inclined to stay.

Andreus Ixiris wrote:
There are tens of thousands of subscribed players in nullsec. If you wanted war, there's nothing in the world bad game mechanics could do to stop you short of dropping all input from the F1 key. If you wanted an end to powerblocs and coalitions, you could voluntarily shut them down yourselves. If you wanted smaller organisations to have a chance you could stop pouncing on them at every opportunity. At any point you could simply decide you don't like the look of a neighbour's face and try to rearrange it.
Like nearly everyone in every MMO ever, we're always going to work as efficiently as we can with the mechanics. Yes we could just throw stuff away to create content, but why the **** should we? Why should we stop minmaxing while everyone else continues just because CCP don't want to make the mechanics fun in the first place? What we want is quite simple. We want the most efficient thing to do in nullsec to be what generates conflict in the first place. If they just dump in crappy mechanics they can expect us to work around them to maintain what we have.

Andreus Ixiris wrote:
PAPULA wrote:
Dominion sov was super awesome compared to this boring sov.
You complained about structure grinding, so CCP removed it. Now you whine that you want it back.
I think very few people want dominion back, but the new system is worst than the old one.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#542 - 2015-08-08 08:37:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Tha is what happens when you buy-in to the next jesus feature that will shake up sov

you get strung up, die, get thrown into a cave and then the door is locked.

Lucas Kell wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I think it's because following BR5 there were international news articles (in mainstream news, not just gaming news) and an influx of new players. That's what drives people to the game. "Come and play whack-a-mole in space" isn't.

It drove a lot of people to the game, who promptly left when they discovered that nullsec fights like that happen incredibly seldom because even in the days of BR-5 the vast majority of nullsec was blue to each other.
Which is why conflict need to be encouraged by nullsec mechanics. If they read the news about big battles then arrived and found that there was a healthy amount of smaller battles they can get straight in on between the big ones, they'd be much more inclined to stay..

They can get involved after hearing about a smartbomb camp in Deklein, then join as an ECM frigate.

Eventually they can upgrade to an interceptor and then they'd be able to match the elite moa sovtaking squad

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Zsha
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#543 - 2015-08-08 09:19:46 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
And now they just straight up don't happen. Which is apparently... better?

Ultimately you can only lay so much blame at the feet of CCP for that.

This thread is wall-to-wall nullsec whining about how the game mechanics don't let them get the nullsec experience they want, but it just straight up does not seem like nullsec knows what it wants. CFC wax lyrical about how the new jump and sov mechanics are stagnating nullsec, while at the same time telling me "we can easily get around jump fatigue and new sov, we have the numbers to ignore them." People constantly whine about the fact that jump fatigue utterly stifles the possibility of warfare on the scale of BR-5 and how the new mechanics are even more hostile to small groups, yet at the same time make out like Pandemic Legion and other groups being able to deploy carriers to anywhere in the game within 15 minutes was somehow a good thing. You say people who can't defend what they own don't deserve to own it yet you're complaining more about solo interceptors with entosis links than you are about entire fleets. You say that entosis makes the game boring yet there wasn't a day that went by before Aegis' release when General Discusison did not have a thread whining about the tedium of nullsec structure bashing.

CCP has a habit of occasionally making utterly terrible decisions but one thing I've got to say in their defence is that for the sake of Christ, they're at least trying to get you bastards out of your coalitions and fighting over nullsec again. Team 5-0 is like the goddamn giant panda breeders desperately trying to work out what ridiculous combination of aphrodisiacs, niche pornography and low-grade toxins they need to pump into your cage to get you guys to make a move on each other. They're bound to make some ****-ups because you guys are actively resisting the process. Every change CCP makes is met with universal consternation and disdain, as if CCP have no clue what they're doing - of course they don't know what they're doing, how the hell would they know if you guys keep demanding something and do nothing with the tools they try to give you?

There are tens of thousands of subscribed players in nullsec. If you wanted war, there's nothing in the world bad game mechanics could do to stop you short of dropping all input from the F1 key. If you wanted an end to powerblocs and coalitions, you could voluntarily shut them down yourselves. If you wanted smaller organisations to have a chance you could stop pouncing on them at every opportunity. At any point you could simply decide you don't like the look of a neighbour's face and try to rearrange it.

I remain convinced that CCP could acquiesce to every demand a nullsec player has made since the release of Phoebe and you guys would still be sitting around wondering where the gudfites are.


WORD. Good post mate.
I have confidence CCP will get this right. I think they have, maybe some tweaks need to be made from what I've heard, they will probably come in time.
People just need to ******* relax imo and adapt.
People with the highest levels of intelligence adapt the quickest.
People with a low level of mental capacity will just whine and whinge like little b1tches and spit their dummies out like the majority of people posting in this thread.
The alliance which makes the most intelligent decisions quickest will boss it.

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#544 - 2015-08-08 10:04:51 UTC
Zsha wrote:
WORD. Good post mate.
I have confidence CCP will get this right. I think they have, maybe some tweaks need to be made from what I've heard, they will probably come in time.
People just need to ******* relax imo and adapt.
People with the highest levels of intelligence adapt the quickest.
People with a low level of mental capacity will just whine and whinge like little b1tches and spit their dummies out like the majority of people posting in this thread.
The alliance which makes the most intelligent decisions quickest will boss it.
Roll

Actually, those of us here saying "the system is crap" are those who have adapted already. We've worked out that the best way to work with the new sov system is to ignore it and wok around it. The downside to that is it exacerbates the problem of stagnation in null.

And generally speaking, people with "a low level of mental capacity" come into threads on their NPC alts pretending they know more than they do about a situation and calling other people dumb. Come back when a) you've use the new system, and b) you're committed enough to your opinion to post with your main.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Akballah Kassan
Flames Of Chaos
Great Wildlands Conservation Society
#545 - 2015-08-08 10:36:26 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Zsha wrote:
WORD. Good post mate.
I have confidence CCP will get this right. I think they have, maybe some tweaks need to be made from what I've heard, they will probably come in time.
People just need to ******* relax imo and adapt.
People with the highest levels of intelligence adapt the quickest.
People with a low level of mental capacity will just whine and whinge like little b1tches and spit their dummies out like the majority of people posting in this thread.
The alliance which makes the most intelligent decisions quickest will boss it.
Roll

Actually, those of us here saying "the system is crap" are those who have adapted already. We've worked out that the best way to work with the new sov system is to ignore it and wok around it. The downside to that is it exacerbates the problem of stagnation in null.

And generally speaking, people with "a low level of mental capacity" come into threads on their NPC alts pretending they know more than they do about a situation and calling other people dumb. Come back when a) you've use the new system, and b) you're committed enough to your opinion to post with your main.


Pre the Pheobe changes CFC's whole philosophy about sov war was to bore an attacker to death. CCP can't change your groups core mentality for you. You just hate he fact that attackers can now use similar tactics in space not being used on a regular basis.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#546 - 2015-08-08 10:53:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
There's no mechanic that can prevent people from not logging in and fighting fights they don't want. Only thing that was driving it was the fear (for the lack of better word) that other guys will come and blast something you value in your absence. And this is the problem that easier to solve without fighting as well.

It looks like Aegis sov does more for people who log in for nothing but to fight - wormholers who have habit of going to null with wands, groups that control 1-2 constellations... At least episodically.

Those 'winning' EVE can't be affected by any means of warfare since they mastered tool that are more powerful than any warfare. It's okay. Can't have both sandbox and lack of such entities. At least you guys found out that there are less sandboxy things to do meanwhile and have fun. LoL, Rocket League or whatever FOTM is.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#547 - 2015-08-08 10:59:52 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

Ultimately you can only lay so much blame at the feet of CCP for that.


I can lay the vast majority of the blame on them for that. The buck stops with them, not the playerbase; most especially when it comes to taking feedback for upcoming changes, something they are, to be quite honest, really really bad about. Every, and I do mean every problem with the existing system was brought up shortly after the announcement of these new mechanics, and the vast majority of the issues raised were ignored, and crop up now as expected. Now, as to whether that's due to the legitimate concerns being shouted down by the "Grr" crowd such as yourself, or CCP's legendary intransigence when it comes to player feedback, or a combination of both, is up for debate.

The rest of your post is just an angry rant, and I ignored it.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Faenir Antollare
For Ever And Ever
#548 - 2015-08-08 11:03:49 UTC
Akballah Kassan wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Zsha wrote:
WORD. Good post mate.
I have confidence CCP will get this right. I think they have, maybe some tweaks need to be made from what I've heard, they will probably come in time.
People just need to ******* relax imo and adapt.
People with the highest levels of intelligence adapt the quickest.
People with a low level of mental capacity will just whine and whinge like little b1tches and spit their dummies out like the majority of people posting in this thread.
The alliance which makes the most intelligent decisions quickest will boss it.
Roll

Actually, those of us here saying "the system is crap" are those who have adapted already. We've worked out that the best way to work with the new sov system is to ignore it and wok around it. The downside to that is it exacerbates the problem of stagnation in null.

And generally speaking, people with "a low level of mental capacity" come into threads on their NPC alts pretending they know more than they do about a situation and calling other people dumb. Come back when a) you've use the new system, and b) you're committed enough to your opinion to post with your main.


Pre the Pheobe changes CFC's whole philosophy about sov war was to bore an attacker to death. CCP can't change your groups core mentality for you. You just hate he fact that attackers can now use similar tactics in space not being used on a regular basis.





Banker of the year award, welldone.

RiP BooBoo 26/7/1971 - 23/7/2014 My Lady My Love My Life My Wife

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#549 - 2015-08-08 12:06:05 UTC
I like living in my home, see a bunch of interceptors who seem to enjoy picking the hardest places to hit though.

It isn't as though the other side of the map isn't that far away for you interdiction nullified trolls though

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#550 - 2015-08-08 13:27:43 UTC
Akballah Kassan wrote:
Pre the Pheobe changes CFC's whole philosophy about sov war was to bore an attacker to death. CCP can't change your groups core mentality for you. You just hate he fact that attackers can now use similar tactics in space not being used on a regular basis.
Actually, before the changes he optimal strategy for both sides was to blueball a good portion of fights. Now it's only on the attackers sides and doesn't require the attacker to form up a giant fleet to look like they are going to attack. And attackers can (and do) use it in all space now.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.

Loneball
PlexForce07
#551 - 2015-08-08 14:24:28 UTC
The mechanics are fun.

It's the player base's reluctance to lose that evaporates fights before they can begin.

I think now that alot of time has passed and the internet has become more engrained in our cultures that we're all suffering from a bit of "Psycho Fatigue". So many borderline spectrum better-than-alls creating an overall negative experience that the norms don't want to play their little games.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#552 - 2015-08-08 14:44:10 UTC
Loneball wrote:
I think now that alot of time has passed and the internet has become more engrained in our cultures that we're all suffering from a bit of "Psycho Fatigue". So many borderline spectrum better-than-alls creating an overall negative experience that the norms don't want to play their little games.

Yeah I have to wait out my timer cooldown before I can go psycho again.

Too bad I didn't train Psycho Synchronization to V

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#553 - 2015-08-08 15:56:08 UTC
I think its disgracefull to complain about boredom and that fozzysov is boring when they are clearly not doing nothing them selves to spice it up. You have massive blob of blues and they wont deploy. CFC fault, not the rest of eve or CCP.
It was like this before so nothing to do with fuzzy sov. Fozzy sovstill brings a lot of fun and pvp. There are those that already are choosing to escalate it from the start to titans Blink
Snowmann
Arrow Industries
#554 - 2015-08-08 16:27:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Snowmann
Icycle wrote:
I think its disgracefull to complain about boredom and that fozzysov is boring when they are clearly not doing nothing them selves to spice it up. You have massive blob of blues and they wont deploy. CFC fault, not the rest of eve or CCP.
It was like this before so nothing to do with fuzzy sov. Fozzy sovstill brings a lot of fun and pvp. There are those that already are choosing to escalate it from the start to titans Blink



It seems many are refusing to play, because the don't like the fact that their big toys are not required anymore.
Plus, Null Sec has been mostly blue for a lot longer than the recent Sov changes.

The recent Sov changes came about because of the complaints about the previous Sov system, and the blue donut.

I think the real issue is the players and leaders themselves. They are bored with "this" game as it is, and they won't play in the new system because they don't automatically have the advantage like they used to.

Sov warfare now has a much lower barrier to entry and their big toys can be easily outmaneuvered in the new system.
They want fights on their terms, where the incumbents have the advantage.

I don't think this game is stagnating, I think the majority of the Sov holders leadership is stagnating.
They are stagnating because they have the best gear in the game and it is getting old for them.

I do not think any change in Sov mechanics will fix the issue for any extended period of time.
It may make things new again for a short period of time, but that is it.

Getting new blood out there and at the top would be far more effective.

But the ultimate change would be to make the best gear rare, not by cost, but by being unique.
That would probably be the hardest change, but it might be the best.

Having less players with the best toys in the game means less people stagnating at the top.

And a low barrier to entry into sov warfare means new blood out there.

Cries about how hard Sov has become be dammed. Its time CCP turns Null Sec on its head, for the good of Eve Online.

What is stagnating about Null Sec are those who are in control of it!
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#555 - 2015-08-08 17:53:15 UTC
Snowmann wrote:
But the ultimate change would be to make the best gear rare, not by cost, but by being unique.
That would probably be the hardest change, but it might be the best.

Having less players with the best toys in the game means less people stagnating at the top.

Heh heh, yeah

Who would be stagnating at the top with all the unique stuff? Probably mission runners in highsec who then get ganked I guess, like most officer gear...

or titans that never log in...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Gallowmere Rorschach
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#556 - 2015-08-08 18:16:56 UTC
Icycle wrote:
I think its disgracefull to complain about boredom and that fozzysov is boring when they are clearly not doing nothing them selves to spice it up. You have massive blob of blues and they wont deploy. CFC fault, not the rest of eve or CCP.
It was like this before so nothing to do with fuzzy sov. Fozzy sovstill brings a lot of fun and pvp. There are those that already are choosing to escalate it from the start to titans Blink

Hey, that was funny, and you know it. Big smile
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#557 - 2015-08-08 19:37:20 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:

Ultimately you can only lay so much blame at the feet of CCP for that.


I can lay the vast majority of the blame on them for that. The buck stops with them, not the playerbase; most especially when it comes to taking feedback for upcoming changes, something they are, to be quite honest, really really bad about. Every, and I do mean every problem with the existing system was brought up shortly after the announcement of these new mechanics, and the vast majority of the issues raised were ignored, and crop up now as expected. Now, as to whether that's due to the legitimate concerns being shouted down by the "Grr" crowd such as yourself, or CCP's legendary intransigence when it comes to player feedback, or a combination of both, is up for debate.

The rest of your post is just an angry rant, and I ignored it.


The 'problems' were framed as 'problems' by people that were not going to benefit by design from these changes, they arent problems they are solutions you just dont like them.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#558 - 2015-08-08 19:51:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
B0RG 0VERLORD wrote:
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
All I'm hearing is more excuses from nullsec dwellers about how hard it is to fight things.



if you don't live out in null then i think your opinion shouldn't count towards anything related to this patch,as it has no relevance to hs dwellers


Thank you for putting all of nullsecs attitude into one sentence.

It is precisely this type of thinking that fozziesov is attempting to fix, that only those that currently reside in nullsec should have a say in what happens there. Fozziesov is attempting to bring fresh blood into nullsec and fresh blood means they didnt come from nullsec to begin with.

If anything the exact opposite should be true, Nullsec should shut its pie hole and everyone else in EVE gets to speak on the issue, since these changes were intended to benefit us and not you.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.

Icycle
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#559 - 2015-08-08 20:11:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Icycle
Gallowmere Rorschach wrote:
Icycle wrote:
I think its disgracefull to complain about boredom and that fozzysov is boring when they are clearly not doing nothing them selves to spice it up. You have massive blob of blues and they wont deploy. CFC fault, not the rest of eve or CCP.
It was like this before so nothing to do with fuzzy sov. Fozzy sovstill brings a lot of fun and pvp. There are those that already are choosing to escalate it from the start to titans Blink

Hey, that was funny, and you know it. Big smile


Belive it or not I do find it funny. And makes you think about adaptation like what to do next time. We did had an aeon the other day that had to jump out cos it lost all its shields vs 30 bombers. I laughed but I cried also Lol
we were sooo close Twisted
Maldiro Selkurk
Radiation Sickness
#560 - 2015-08-08 20:18:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Maldiro Selkurk
Lucas Kell wrote:
Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
But as ive asked a dozen times before, what exactly keeps you from taking a fleet and kicking your neighbors ass, nothing.
What stops all the hard done by "small groups" forming up a giant group and taking sov by force? Nothing. What stops groups actually fighting when they fly into sov holders space rather than bringing shitfit interceptors and running away? Nothing. Don't act like the entire problem is us just because you think it should be our responsibility to work with crappy mechanics.

We could go out and create fights risking our sov in the process while we're deployed. Alternatively we can find likeminded people and arrange content between ourselves with little risk to our space and continue as ever we did during dominion.

The whole idea of this sov systems was to make it fun enough for both sides that people would want to engage with it. Since it's not, there no reason for us to do anything beyond what we used to do, and since it's simpler to both attack and defend, we don;t even need to create the big battles we used to have periodically. This system will create more stagnation than dominion sov. It's not up to us to turn a crappy mechanic into content.

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
Stop posting, get off your space butts and find another alliance to entoss and show up when its battle time, easy.
No thanks, I'm not into mining structures.

Maldiro Selkurk wrote:
And on the issue of stagnant it will change not when CCP comes up with some magic mechanic it will occur when you make it occur.
Then it won't happen and null will remain the area we farm between highsec gank ops.


1. You admit that you have gamed nullsec and the reason you dont find big fights is because you dont want to, thanks its about time at least one of you admitted this truth, certainly a step in the right direction.

2. You ask why dont i condemn those small groups for not bringing you big fights it is because i have not heard them moaning en masse that they want big fights, it is you that said you did and at the same time give yet another lame excuse why you dont, that being you might lose sov well that is what your fights are supposed to be about not staged slap fights in space.

3. If nullsec remains stagnant that is okay as i said CCP cant make you have fun, you can block that fun any time you like but dont blame fozziesov because you want to sit on your space ass and do nothing all day, fozziesov is telling you that isnt how its going to be anymore. So fight frigates all day or go get into a big fight but stop blaming fozziesov for your personal shortcomings.

Yawn,  I'm right as usual. The predictability kinda gets boring really.