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The Shrinking Sandbox - Eve by numbers

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Jenshae Chiroptera
#761 - 2015-05-18 00:45:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
Malcanis wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
It also makes PVP more interesting, as you are more invested, if you built your own ship. Blink
But that doesn't make the activity itself any more fun.
If they added a mini-game to mining, which would be annoying, then I would rather spin my ship or not log on, which would mean one less reserve PVPer to be drawn upon.

Clarifying: Mining + mini-game = annoying not the type of mini-game.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
#762 - 2015-05-18 06:53:07 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:


It also makes PVP more interesting, as you are more invested, if you built your own ship. Blink


But that doesn't make the activity itself any more fun.


Instead, miners do make their own fun. A "more engaging" mining system would evict the current miners. Mining doesn't needs to change, but maybe could use some improvement -something which required more engagement and more risk, but also had more reward, and which expanded the current mechanic without replacing it.

Say, mining "mineral rich" comets with a non-trivial chance to damage the ship when the laser hits too many ice and causes a explosion/geyser (say, 6.000 HP across thermal/kinetic/explosive). But!, an attentive miner can pick visual clues (say, steam plumes) and move away from the area. The reward is that a, say, pyroxeres-rich comet delivers a larger base volume per cycle (say, 15% more than an asteroid).

There you have it! A more engaging mining, with a sensible reward (fills your hold faster), and a risk implicit to the PvE, not a PvP risk.

Some miners will stick to asteroids... others will give a try to the "mineral-rich comets" (MRCs)... people who would never mine asterids may mine comets... and there is no need to make those "MRCs" a low or null-only thing. They can be spawned in highsec as the risk/reward balance is kept by the mechanic itself.

Just saying. Bear

Roses are red / Violets are blue / I am an Alpha / And so it's you
Eve Solecist
Shitt Outta Luck - GANKING4GOOD
#763 - 2015-05-18 07:17:55 UTC

Every time someone writes "just saying", he lies through his teeth.

  • All incoming connection attempts are being blocked. If you want to speak to me you will find me either in Hek local, you can create a contract or make a thread about it in General Discussions. I will call you back. -
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#764 - 2015-05-18 09:00:10 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:

Instead, miners do make their own fun. A "more engaging" mining system would evict the current miners.


That would not be a bad thing.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Jenshae Chiroptera
#765 - 2015-05-18 10:23:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenshae Chiroptera
I have seen High Sec ice miners working tactically, as a fleet, landing, positioning and stripping asteroids out from under the competition, then they get more ice while the competition trundles across to reach other ones.
(There are also miners who steal from each other's can ... and work with gankers for direct warp ins.) >.>

Maybe, the laziest way we can help EVE is to make channels and mailing groups, grab some newbies and suck in more (get newbies to draw more newbies in), foster the lost little waifs.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#766 - 2015-05-18 11:57:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Speedkermit Damo
Jade Yanumano wrote:

I am a player that has been playing EVE since 2005. I am in agreement. I believe what CCP is trying to do is great, but the Sov changes they are putting in place regarding the sov being vulnerable for 4 to 8 hours a day is emptying null sec out a lot more. I remember CCP making a comment that EVE is in now way the representation of the way people thing or live their lives. I would prefer CCP rephrases that, because it is very untrue.

People become immersed into the game, their RL dramas left behind and their ideas and thoughts no matter how sadistic or not become part of the game.

With the new sov changes CCP Fozzie is introducing, i would say that null sec will lose even more numbers and probably already is. Generating more action is just something that is needed, with that i will agree. You can't have everyone carebear all the time and then stagnate the game to a point people quit due to boredom. There are many problems in EVE. One of many is the fact that CCP stated they trying to generate more fun fights and action in EVE, and also trying to allow smaller entities to have a piece of the pie. However, this is not the case, larger more stronger alliances are at it again. They push smaller entities to the point of simply quitting the game, as there are thousands that do not want to be in major 10k to 38k size powerblocs. They don't want to do massive fleets. They enjoy the small gang game play style.

Each time CCP makes a change they completely ignore one simple fact, a fact that has been apart of the human condition for thousands of years. That fact is, "I am a stronger caveman than you, join me or I beat you like rock". Then tie that in with the really sadistic minds of some of the people in EVE, well, that only spells bad news for any small entity. Even if its a small entity bent on trying to promote EVE and Null Sec and get more new players to join up and move to a null sec region designed to help build up the abilities of new players, so they can learn how to play the game in a different environment to high security space. Lets take Brave Collective for instance. They have lots of new players join them, teach them, show them the ropes. Some alliance are not as big as they are. Some try to show new players the fun side of a smaller scale way of having fun.

None of what CCP Fozzie has brought forward is of any interest to a new player willing to move to null sec and learn the ropes in a harder environment. At the present moment, numbers are dropping. I also get told, no, numbers are increasing and yet i don't see it. I had a GM tell me they are over 500k accounts. I really could not contain my laughter. CCP makes a big mistake relying purely on just the numbers and not the "active" numbers.

CCP states they cannot intervene nor interfere or they use the phrase, "we cannot directly affect the game". Well now, that is the funniest nonsense I have ever heard. By making certain changes to the game regarding mechanics, you are affecting the game. Due to the 4 to 8 hour timers you are implementing in the new sov changes, you directly affect the game. It forces alliances/coalitions to make every possible attempt to break up smaller entities and push them into joining a larger powerbloc and becoming nothing but a number. That is directly affecting the smaller gang game play style. I would also go as far as stating that CCP have not really changed much in terms of giving opportunities to smaller entities.

To be honest, there is a good chance CCP will lose a lot more "active" players. I myself personally have opened an account on other games like star********. LOL.

It is truly very sad that EVE has turned to this uninteresting, not fun, game. It was the biggest, best game in the world, that no one had the ability to top. Now CCP is just pushing people away, pushing the community away with some of the changes in the new upcoming patch. That has already been a dramatic drop in active players over the past 12 to 18 months. Thank you CCP for a great game, and thank you CCP Fozzie for your effort, but EVE is just no longer worth playing.


Terrible mechanics aside. It wasn't CCP that made nullsec stagnant, it was a small clique of players, and after fozziesov drops, they will do it all over again. Hell, they're at it already. Rebuilding the blue donut.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#767 - 2015-05-18 12:15:47 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Jade Yanumano wrote:

I am a player that has been playing EVE since 2005. I am in agreement. I believe what CCP is trying to do is great, but the Sov changes they are putting in place regarding the sov being vulnerable for 4 to 8 hours a day is emptying null sec out a lot more. I remember CCP making a comment that EVE is in now way the representation of the way people thing or live their lives. I would prefer CCP rephrases that, because it is very untrue.

People become immersed into the game, their RL dramas left behind and their ideas and thoughts no matter how sadistic or not become part of the game.

With the new sov changes CCP Fozzie is introducing, i would say that null sec will lose even more numbers and probably already is. Generating more action is just something that is needed, with that i will agree. You can't have everyone carebear all the time and then stagnate the game to a point people quit due to boredom. There are many problems in EVE. One of many is the fact that CCP stated they trying to generate more fun fights and action in EVE, and also trying to allow smaller entities to have a piece of the pie. However, this is not the case, larger more stronger alliances are at it again. They push smaller entities to the point of simply quitting the game, as there are thousands that do not want to be in major 10k to 38k size powerblocs. They don't want to do massive fleets. They enjoy the small gang game play style.

Each time CCP makes a change they completely ignore one simple fact, a fact that has been apart of the human condition for thousands of years. That fact is, "I am a stronger caveman than you, join me or I beat you like rock". Then tie that in with the really sadistic minds of some of the people in EVE, well, that only spells bad news for any small entity. Even if its a small entity bent on trying to promote EVE and Null Sec and get more new players to join up and move to a null sec region designed to help build up the abilities of new players, so they can learn how to play the game in a different environment to high security space. Lets take Brave Collective for instance. They have lots of new players join them, teach them, show them the ropes. Some alliance are not as big as they are. Some try to show new players the fun side of a smaller scale way of having fun.

None of what CCP Fozzie has brought forward is of any interest to a new player willing to move to null sec and learn the ropes in a harder environment. At the present moment, numbers are dropping. I also get told, no, numbers are increasing and yet i don't see it. I had a GM tell me they are over 500k accounts. I really could not contain my laughter. CCP makes a big mistake relying purely on just the numbers and not the "active" numbers.

CCP states they cannot intervene nor interfere or they use the phrase, "we cannot directly affect the game". Well now, that is the funniest nonsense I have ever heard. By making certain changes to the game regarding mechanics, you are affecting the game. Due to the 4 to 8 hour timers you are implementing in the new sov changes, you directly affect the game. It forces alliances/coalitions to make every possible attempt to break up smaller entities and push them into joining a larger powerbloc and becoming nothing but a number. That is directly affecting the smaller gang game play style. I would also go as far as stating that CCP have not really changed much in terms of giving opportunities to smaller entities.

To be honest, there is a good chance CCP will lose a lot more "active" players. I myself personally have opened an account on other games like star********. LOL.

It is truly very sad that EVE has turned to this uninteresting, not fun, game. It was the biggest, best game in the world, that no one had the ability to top. Now CCP is just pushing people away, pushing the community away with some of the changes in the new upcoming patch. That has already been a dramatic drop in active players over the past 12 to 18 months. Thank you CCP for a great game, and thank you CCP Fozzie for your effort, but EVE is just no longer worth playing.


Terrible mechanics aside. It wasn't CCP that made nullsec stagnant, it was a small clique of players, and after fozziesov drops, they will do it all over again. Hell, they're at it already. Rebuilding the blue donut.


It's not a small clique of anything, it's people being people, human nature at work. People will take advantage of ANY situation, whether it's lawless space in an internet game or in real life (look at real life businesses using various laws and regulations to not only make a profit, but beat the crap out of their competition, hell, you don't even have to go that far, look at any High School lol)

Blaming it on a "few people" is an old and tired fallacy (and one usually offered by people who themselves have contributed to the problem but don't want to take any blame), the idea that "things would be great" if a handful of people didn't do something. The real truth is null has been the way it is now since day one, the entire game has been that way, various individuals and groups seeking whatever advantage they could over others and damn the consequences.


In other words, you can't sit there in an Alliance that is Blue to Goons (an Alliance i used to be a part of btw) and complain about Blue anything.
0bama Barack Hussein
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#768 - 2015-05-18 12:38:32 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Jade Yanumano wrote:


To be honest, there is a good chance CCP will lose a lot more "active" players. I myself personally have opened an account on other games like star********. LOL.

It is truly very sad that EVE has turned to this uninteresting, not fun, game. It was the biggest, best game in the world, that no one had the ability to top. Now CCP is just pushing people away, pushing the community away with some of the changes in the new upcoming patch. That has already been a dramatic drop in active players over the past 12 to 18 months. Thank you CCP for a great game, and thank you CCP Fozzie for your effort, but EVE is just no longer worth playing.


Terrible mechanics aside. It wasn't CCP that made nullsec stagnant, it was a small clique of players, and after fozziesov drops, they will do it all over again. Hell, they're at it already. Rebuilding the blue donut.


It's not a small clique of anything, it's people being people, human nature at work. People will take advantage of ANY situation, whether it's lawless space in an internet game or in real life (look at real life businesses using various laws and regulations to not only make a profit, but beat the crap out of their competition, hell, you don't even have to go that far, look at any High School lol)

Blaming it on a "few people" is an old and tired fallacy (and one usually offered by people who themselves have contributed to the problem but don't want to take any blame), the idea that "things would be great" if a handful of people didn't do something. The real truth is null has been the way it is now since day one, the entire game has been that way, various individuals and groups seeking whatever advantage they could over others and damn the consequences.


In other words, you can't sit there in an Alliance that is Blue to Goons (an Alliance i used to be a part of btw) and complain about Blue anything.


I believe biggest concern brought up in this convo (and dev blog) were that new sov will only make stronger stronger, and weaker weaker.

Biggest groups can roll out endless number of fleets with Entosis link, as smaller get their possessions and assets seized or destructed every once in a while, until they cant afford it anymore.

And I totally agree to some before me that EvE is PvP game, and all development should be aimed to make it better and easier to access for new players.
No reason to go compete with other (space) games like ED in mining or PvE, EvE will lose.
Eve has it´s own strenghts like social aspects, and need to focus on those.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#769 - 2015-05-18 12:49:30 UTC
0bama Barack Hussein wrote:
[

I believe biggest concern brought up in this convo (and dev blog) were that new sov will only make stronger stronger, and weaker weaker.


That's always the case. People seem to forget that the sov system we have right now was intended to "open up" space for "new groups", and they mistake the jockeying for position and restructuring that's going on in null right now as something that it isn't. overly optimistic types are going "see it's all working so far", but don't seem to remember that THE SAME THING happened right before Dominion.

Human nature conquers all. Groups will figure out "Fozzie Sov" is short order (and maintain large groups in order to increase the reach of their influence, causing "small groups" to join up, or payt rent, or GTFO), the same way they figured out Dominion Sov in a few weeks, the same way they figured out how to farm "unfarmable" incursions, the same way they figured out how to live in "unlivable" wormhole space etc etc.

People actually cheered for Dominion Sov because they didn't understand that they were so tired of the old "POS based" sov system we had that anything would have looked good.
Sgt Ocker
What Corp is it
#770 - 2015-05-18 12:53:38 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Jade Yanumano wrote:

I am a player that has been playing EVE since 2005. I am in agreement. I believe what CCP is trying to do is great, but the Sov changes they are putting in place regarding the sov being vulnerable for 4 to 8 hours a day is emptying null sec out a lot more. I remember CCP making a comment that EVE is in now way the representation of the way people thing or live their lives. I would prefer CCP rephrases that, because it is very untrue.

People become immersed into the game, their RL dramas left behind and their ideas and thoughts no matter how sadistic or not become part of the game.

With the new sov changes CCP Fozzie is introducing, i would say that null sec will lose even more numbers and probably already is. Generating more action is just something that is needed, with that i will agree. You can't have everyone carebear all the time and then stagnate the game to a point people quit due to boredom. There are many problems in EVE. One of many is the fact that CCP stated they trying to generate more fun fights and action in EVE, and also trying to allow smaller entities to have a piece of the pie. However, this is not the case, larger more stronger alliances are at it again. They push smaller entities to the point of simply quitting the game, as there are thousands that do not want to be in major 10k to 38k size powerblocs. They don't want to do massive fleets. They enjoy the small gang game play style.

Each time CCP makes a change they completely ignore one simple fact, a fact that has been apart of the human condition for thousands of years. That fact is, "I am a stronger caveman than you, join me or I beat you like rock". Then tie that in with the really sadistic minds of some of the people in EVE, well, that only spells bad news for any small entity. Even if its a small entity bent on trying to promote EVE and Null Sec and get more new players to join up and move to a null sec region designed to help build up the abilities of new players, so they can learn how to play the game in a different environment to high security space. Lets take Brave Collective for instance. They have lots of new players join them, teach them, show them the ropes. Some alliance are not as big as they are. Some try to show new players the fun side of a smaller scale way of having fun.

None of what CCP Fozzie has brought forward is of any interest to a new player willing to move to null sec and learn the ropes in a harder environment. At the present moment, numbers are dropping. I also get told, no, numbers are increasing and yet i don't see it. I had a GM tell me they are over 500k accounts. I really could not contain my laughter. CCP makes a big mistake relying purely on just the numbers and not the "active" numbers.

CCP states they cannot intervene nor interfere or they use the phrase, "we cannot directly affect the game". Well now, that is the funniest nonsense I have ever heard. By making certain changes to the game regarding mechanics, you are affecting the game. Due to the 4 to 8 hour timers you are implementing in the new sov changes, you directly affect the game. It forces alliances/coalitions to make every possible attempt to break up smaller entities and push them into joining a larger powerbloc and becoming nothing but a number. That is directly affecting the smaller gang game play style. I would also go as far as stating that CCP have not really changed much in terms of giving opportunities to smaller entities.

To be honest, there is a good chance CCP will lose a lot more "active" players. I myself personally have opened an account on other games like star********. LOL.

It is truly very sad that EVE has turned to this uninteresting, not fun, game. It was the biggest, best game in the world, that no one had the ability to top. Now CCP is just pushing people away, pushing the community away with some of the changes in the new upcoming patch. That has already been a dramatic drop in active players over the past 12 to 18 months. Thank you CCP for a great game, and thank you CCP Fozzie for your effort, but EVE is just no longer worth playing.


Terrible mechanics aside. It wasn't CCP that made nullsec stagnant, it was a small clique of players, and after fozziesov drops, they will do it all over again. Hell, they're at it already. Rebuilding the blue donut.

Actually it was CCP's fault nulsec became stagnant, any half decent game developer would have been able to predict the outcome of groups of ever increasing size forming and done something to curb it. CCP decided to not only sit back and let players find the right balance, they actively encouraged it - and they did, players (some who no longer play eve but still run a large part of it, for RL profit) found a balance. It is called - bigger wins.
Devs are well aware of the damage these large groups pose to the future of eve and so thought up a nice little plan to give the mega groups some content to keep them paying each month.
Fozziesov, will indeed create content for the large established groups (at least in the short term), while not posing even the slightest threat to those same groups.

CCP boasting about exceeding 500k registered accounts - Wonderful, except only roughly 10% of those are active and for close to 12 months, it seems 50% of those have been playing skill ques online. Leaving us with around 24k per day logging in to play

Yesterday - Just for interests sake I went on a 68 jump roam, alone, through what used to be very active regions of nulsec. I saw quite a few systems with 2 or 3 docked up players or people sitting in pos's, seems my lone ceptor was considered a risk so everyone safed up. In the end I saw 1 ship in space, just before I got home, a guy in a minmatar rookie ship who was going to pick up a new ship in the adjoining lowsec system.

My opinions are mine.

  If you don't like them or disagree with me that's OK.- - - - - - Just don't bother Hating - I don't care

It really is getting harder and harder to justify $23 a month for each sub.
0bama Barack Hussein
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#771 - 2015-05-18 12:59:45 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
0bama Barack ******* wrote:
[

I believe biggest concern brought up in this convo (and dev blog) were that new sov will only make stronger stronger, and weaker weaker.


People actually cheered for Dominion Sov because they didn't understand that they were so tired of the old "POS based" sov system we had that anything would have looked good.


Actually that POS based sov system does not sound so bad now (if it were done right).
At least attacker had to attack and risk something, and defenders would have defenses of the POS to equalize fight.

But i guess it didn´t work right like that (so well)...
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#772 - 2015-05-18 14:16:38 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
Speedkermit Damo wrote:
Jade Yanumano wrote:

I am a player that has been playing EVE since 2005. I am in agreement. I believe what CCP is trying to do is great, but the Sov changes they are putting in place regarding the sov being vulnerable for 4 to 8 hours a day is emptying null sec out a lot more. I remember CCP making a comment that EVE is in now way the representation of the way people thing or live their lives. I would prefer CCP rephrases that, because it is very untrue.

People become immersed into the game, their RL dramas left behind and their ideas and thoughts no matter how sadistic or not become part of the game.

With the new sov changes CCP Fozzie is introducing, i would say that null sec will lose even more numbers and probably already is. Generating more action is just something that is needed, with that i will agree. You can't have everyone carebear all the time and then stagnate the game to a point people quit due to boredom. There are many problems in EVE. One of many is the fact that CCP stated they trying to generate more fun fights and action in EVE, and also trying to allow smaller entities to have a piece of the pie. However, this is not the case, larger more stronger alliances are at it again. They push smaller entities to the point of simply quitting the game, as there are thousands that do not want to be in major 10k to 38k size powerblocs. They don't want to do massive fleets. They enjoy the small gang game play style.

Each time CCP makes a change they completely ignore one simple fact, a fact that has been apart of the human condition for thousands of years. That fact is, "I am a stronger caveman than you, join me or I beat you like rock". Then tie that in with the really sadistic minds of some of the people in EVE, well, that only spells bad news for any small entity. Even if its a small entity bent on trying to promote EVE and Null Sec and get more new players to join up and move to a null sec region designed to help build up the abilities of new players, so they can learn how to play the game in a different environment to high security space. Lets take Brave Collective for instance. They have lots of new players join them, teach them, show them the ropes. Some alliance are not as big as they are. Some try to show new players the fun side of a smaller scale way of having fun.

None of what CCP Fozzie has brought forward is of any interest to a new player willing to move to null sec and learn the ropes in a harder environment. At the present moment, numbers are dropping. I also get told, no, numbers are increasing and yet i don't see it. I had a GM tell me they are over 500k accounts. I really could not contain my laughter. CCP makes a big mistake relying purely on just the numbers and not the "active" numbers.

CCP states they cannot intervene nor interfere or they use the phrase, "we cannot directly affect the game". Well now, that is the funniest nonsense I have ever heard. By making certain changes to the game regarding mechanics, you are affecting the game. Due to the 4 to 8 hour timers you are implementing in the new sov changes, you directly affect the game. It forces alliances/coalitions to make every possible attempt to break up smaller entities and push them into joining a larger powerbloc and becoming nothing but a number. That is directly affecting the smaller gang game play style. I would also go as far as stating that CCP have not really changed much in terms of giving opportunities to smaller entities.

To be honest, there is a good chance CCP will lose a lot more "active" players. I myself personally have opened an account on other games like star********. LOL.

It is truly very sad that EVE has turned to this uninteresting, not fun, game. It was the biggest, best game in the world, that no one had the ability to top. Now CCP is just pushing people away, pushing the community away with some of the changes in the new upcoming patch. That has already been a dramatic drop in active players over the past 12 to 18 months. Thank you CCP for a great game, and thank you CCP Fozzie for your effort, but EVE is just no longer worth playing.


Terrible mechanics aside. It wasn't CCP that made nullsec stagnant, it was a small clique of players, and after fozziesov drops, they will do it all over again. Hell, they're at it already. Rebuilding the blue donut.


It's not a small clique of anything, it's people being people, human nature at work. People will take advantage of ANY situation, whether it's lawless space in an internet game or in real life (look at real life businesses using various laws and regulations to not only make a profit, but beat the crap out of their competition, hell, you don't even have to go that far, look at any High School lol)

Blaming it on a "few people" is an old and tired fallacy (and one usually offered by people who themselves have contributed to the problem but don't want to take any blame), the idea that "things would be great" if a handful of people didn't do something. The real truth is null has been the way it is now since day one, the entire game has been that way, various individuals and groups seeking whatever advantage they could over others and damn the consequences.


In other words, you can't sit there in an Alliance that is Blue to Goons (an Alliance i used to be a part of btw) and complain about Blue anything.


Only a few people run Alliances/Coalitions. Ultimately they are the ones who decide to blue up everything within 20 jumps. and further, or not. Was nullsec always like this? I have been playing for less than 3 years so I wouldn't know. But from what I've read and heard apparently not.

And yes I do see the irony of me making this observation considering who I currently fly with.

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#773 - 2015-05-18 14:45:22 UTC
Speedkermit Damo wrote:


Only a few people run Alliances/Coalitions. Ultimately they are the ones who decide to blue up everything within 20 jumps.


And none of that matters unless you have thousands of people at your back to enforce the situation. As an individual player I could blue all of EVE and it would make no difference, but if I were an alliance leader, it would.

Which is the point, the people who ENABLE blue donuts have no right to complain about Blue Donuts, alliance leaders are making decisions that the rank and file support. I was a member of N3 till last month, you never heard me complain, blue space is great for a PVE focused guy like me..

Being in a big coalition complaining about everyone being blue is like being a worker in a meat packing plant complaining about all the animals getting slaughtered lol.

Quote:

and further, or not. Was nullsec always like this? I have been playing for less than 3 years so I wouldn't know. But from what I've read and heard apparently not.


People always remember the 'glory days' incorrectly, whether it null sec in this video game, or how much they got laid in high school lol. Those memories are always faulty. The real truth is that Null has in some form or fashion always been what it is today: space that is unfriendly to small/new groups and friendly to bigger groups. It's just that in the past there were fewer people playing so it wasn't as apparent.
Dersen Lowery
The Scope
#774 - 2015-05-18 16:25:54 UTC
The root problem is that the genie will not go back in the bottle. There are people whose livelihoods now depend on the contributions of tens of thousands of people. The infrastructure is long since set up and tested; the servers and apps are stable and mature and professionally sourced and maintained; the agreements are drawn up and negotiated by actual RL lawyers. The vast bulk of it exists outside of the game and, as the recent Imperium foray into H1Z1 shows, it's also independent of the game.

It's like complaining about supercapital proliferation. You can, and your argument can be irrefutable, but... welp.

The only actual fixes CCP could make would spark player revolts that would make the "Summer of Rage" look like a garden party. And there's no guarantee that they'd work.

Proud founder and member of the Belligerent Desirables.

I voted in CSM X!
Nicolai Serkanner
Incredible.
Brave Collective
#775 - 2015-05-18 17:37:04 UTC
Ishtanchuk Fazmarai wrote:


Did not say "change". I did say "improve", even "expand". The people who want mining mechanics to change are not miners.Roll


Wait... so why does PvE needs to be improved/expanded if, according to you, it is already so much fun to do?

Happy now? Roll
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#776 - 2015-05-18 18:00:58 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
It also makes PVP more interesting, as you are more invested, if you built your own ship. Blink
But that doesn't make the activity itself any more fun.
If they added a mini-game to mining, which would be annoying, then I would rather spin my ship or not log on, which would mean one less reserve PVPer to be drawn upon.

Clarifying: Mining + mini-game = annoying not the type of mini-game.




What if it was like Digdug?

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Jenshae Chiroptera
#777 - 2015-05-18 18:41:45 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
... What if it was like Digdug?
No.
Mining is my time to kick back and relax while still being in EVE. I don't want fiddle with mini-games, no matter what they are.

CCP - Building ant hills and magnifying glasses for fat kids

Not even once

EVE is becoming shallow and puerile; it will satisfy neither the veteran nor the "WoW" type crowd in the transition.
MidnightWyvern
Fukamichi Corporation
SAYR Galactic
#778 - 2015-05-19 02:10:54 UTC
Jenshae Chiroptera wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
... What if it was like Digdug?
No.
Mining is my time to kick back and relax while still being in EVE. I don't want fiddle with mini-games, no matter what they are.

They've before mentioned the idea of allowing the old mining while also having a mini-game that let's active miners get a bit more yield, and that sounded okay to me.

Rattati Senpai noticed us! See you in the next FPS!

Alts: Saray Wyvern, Mobius Wyvern (Dust 514)
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#779 - 2015-05-19 02:44:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Nevyn Auscent
MidnightWyvern wrote:

They've before mentioned the idea of allowing the old mining while also having a mini-game that let's active miners get a bit more yield, and that sounded okay to me.

Right until you do it for the 50,000th time. The 'minigame' if it exists should be in finding the ore, not mining the ore. Mining is a repetitive straight forward task.
Lets play 'imagine if'.
Imagine if they got rid of 5% & 10% variants of ore.
Instead they replace these with 'concentration' amounts, that your survey scanner tells you about. So if the ore has a concentration of 20% (just to keep numbers familiar) you get 20% more ore than your mining lasers would normally yield.
We have now simplified the market in a good way, gotten ride of clutter but still reward exploration.
Now imagine instead of belts we have anomalies only. But in all area's of space and not instant respawn. These anomalies might contain more significant hazards such as AOE damage to all on grid, the rock might be moving etc.
Now imagine the rock also no longer contains a finite amount, but instead the concentration drops over time, and the anomaly looses it's beacon after a while, but you can stay on grid with the rock as long as you want, it just yields less and less over time.

Now we have a situation where finding fresh high concentration rocks to mine yields high returns, time is spent exploring actively but once you've found it it's a fairly passive activity which you can continue until you decide it's worth trying to find a new rock. More people mining depletes concentration faster.
And we can also have LARGE rocks, like 40km across rocks, since we only need a few on grid, rather than 200 on grid now. So we free up a lot of 'object' data everywhere making it easier for the databases to track things at the same time.

Anyway, wandering somewhat off topic, but I'm bored and "Imagine if" can be a fun game to play when you are bored.
Aza Ebanu
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#780 - 2015-05-19 04:58:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Aza Ebanu
The people complaining about mining miss the point of what mining is. It is supposed to be a way to inject minerals into the game so people can destroy them in/with ships. The people in the markets are the ones you should be mad at. If mining did not pay, and CCP did not design the game to center around predator/prey mechanics as much, you'd have more player engagement.