Player Features and Ideas Discussion

How many fleets has bombers bar wiped with their bombing runs over the past month? And how many fleets have ammzi, space, oodell, or any of the numerous other well-known isboxing bombers killed?

The problem with these changes is that they don't have a pronounced effect on the most prolific source of bomb related issues. It's a question of throughput.

It just looks like your ignoring the salient issue (isboxer, and how it applies to bombers in particular) because it also touches on an issue (isboxer as a whole) that probably represents 2%-3% of CCP's revenue. Or maybe that is the salient issue...

My issue with this is the decloaking part. This is just plain stupid. I am ok with the rest of it. However, your already nerfed wormholes to where people are moving out. Now you take away pretty much most of our life and quite frankly I am getting pretty fed up with some of the stupid decisions. People in wormholes fly mainly cloaked.

Since Fozzie so so clueless as to how cloaking is used elsewhere.

PVP gang fleets in wormholes. Since you still won't put in temp bookmarks or fleet bookmarks or linkable bookmarks and bookmarks also take forever to go out to all toons in a corp. We hunt, we scout we find a targets. We have to fleet warp to 10 on a wormhole. Can't do that anymore we all decloak. You pretty much screw most Wspace travel. Using a covert ops ship as a scout, Warp to scout? Can't do that anymore decloak the covert ops.

Hunting and seeing traffic on a wormhole everyone cloaks up orbiting at 5k from the hole so we can jump in as soon as they do. Nope not anymore we will all decloak each other.

How about rolling holes. Well we already know you hate rolling holes after what you did to us in the last patch. We cloak waiting our timers, we don't warp off. Cloak and orbit the hole. We now will run into each other.

The cloak thing does nothing to an isboxer fleet it only harms everyone else. It harms PVP elsewhere and this stupid idea just generally pisses people off.

So by changing cloaking to somehow try to fix stealth bombers you affect the entire gameplay of:
Recon Ships
Strategic Cruisers
Covert Ops Frigates
Expedition Frigates
Transport Ships
Some Faction Cruisers
Some Faction Frigates
And then Stealth bombers

Then you also affect every single other ship that has a fit where they can put a cloaking device on. I have put them on dictors and even Battlecruisers before. Heck I have one fit on a Noctis for farming wormholes it floats in space safely cloaked until needed. Admittedly as safe spots which should still keep him safe but still. This is pretty stupid change.

Let look at another scenario. Your huffing gas in a wormhole in a fleet in expedition frigates or lets say mining ore in null sec for what ever reason. Bomber comes in drops combat probes, fleet leader sees it on dscan, warps the fleet to a safe spot. No one can cloak in warp, too close, no one can cloak when they land, too close, the combat probes now have a huge target of frigates all at the same spot. Warp to 30 and throw bomb on landing. They don't even need to cloak. Everyone is trying to get away from everyone else and trying to cloak, getting decloaked by others that are cloaked, like clowns doing a chinese fire drill. Your pretty much render fleets of prospects useless now they can't cloak or warp cloaked.

People bought PLEX at 400
People buy PLEX at 800

So ISBoxer is single handedly responsible for the PLEX market price now?

When I was watching that announcement at fanfest, where Mr. Fozzi was talking all that crap about how he wanted to make SBs more fun to fly and improve them and whatnot, I already said thats code for rendering them useless due to nulltears. I stopped putting bomber and blackops related skills in, unsubbed covops/blackops alts, awaiting the nerfbat.. So, it's not like I didn't see the nerf coming.

I gotta say, the extent to which this happens now, still surprises me. The effiency of nerfing every single aspect that made them work is almost German. This isnt a rebalance. This is making sure bombers are utterly useless and ineffective in pvp, especially fleet operations. This is eleminating one of the last remaining ways of asymmetrical warfare and at the same time dealing a maximum of collateral on the game experience of totally unrelated players (eg me - never isboxing, to start with). Good job in once again rigging the dice in favor of the winning party. It's one thing to HTFU and adapt to changing rules. It's a completely different thing to adapt to rules that are changed on demand of the other team.

I have removed some rule breaking posts and those quoting them. As always I let some edge cases stay.
Please people, keep it on topic and above all civil!

The Rules:
4. Personal attacks are prohibited.

Commonly known as flaming, personal attacks are posts that are designed to personally berate or insult another forum user. Posts of this nature are not beneficial to the community spirit that CCP promote and as such they will not be tolerated.

5. Trolling is prohibited.

Trolling is a defined as a post that is deliberately designed for the purpose of angering and insulting other players in an attempt to incite retaliation or an emotional response. Posts of this nature are disruptive, often abusive and do not contribute to the sense of community that CCP promote.

27. Off-topic posting is prohibited.

Off-topic posting is permitted within reason, as sometimes a single comment may color or lighten the tone of discussion. However, excessive posting of off-topic remarks in an attempt to derail a thread may result in the thread being locked, or a forum warning being issued to the off-topic poster.

Thread re-opened.

well that's a bit harsh what this nurf looks like is they got together talked about it and some people had a few good ideas so they implemented them however they forgot that each idea was independent so when implemented together it went over kill


But CCP listened with the jump drives so i'm sure they are now(even if they haven't shone it) and a few of the CSM members are also taking feedback so i'm sure we will have some revision in a few days

You're the one claiming that touching ISB will crash the PLEX market

Someone in NULL tears up about losing a few ships. Fozzie to the rescue.

Actually, one of the CSM members said that most of these changes were proposed by the CSM members themselves.

While you guys are changing stealth bombers, can you switch the Purifier to use the Tormentor hull instead of the Inquisitor? It makes no sense as-is, since the others are based off of combat frigates (Kestrel>Manticore, Tristan>Nemesis, Breacher>Hound) while the Amarr bomber's based off of the logi frigate.

Oh yea, DEV's taking the advise of a few self serving CSM's.

That will make the game better.