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Dev Blog: Reprocess all the things!

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Chirjo Durruti
Doomheim
#921 - 2014-03-21 18:37:30 UTC
If this change comes through, you will nerf income with which i support my pvp activities and increase the amount of isk that i require to actually pvp.

So effectively you reduced the fun/money ratio of my subscription. Again. Bad move, CCP, bad move.

Guess after this change I'll just use up the scraps of isk i usually keep around, trash the now worthless rest of my resources and biomass myself after.

HOWTO: No More Tears (solo) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdA4ciUrH-k If you can get me a better crew than THIS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yPrtQ9AdoM0 convo me.
Guttripper
State War Academy
Caldari State
#922 - 2014-03-21 18:40:41 UTC
*casually reads through this thread...

... "work" ...
... "effort" ...
... "work" ...

Question

What's next, yearly reviews on your progress and status?

So CCP handing out paychecks to play this game now too?
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#923 - 2014-03-21 18:41:10 UTC
Querns wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:

again, from first hand experience i can assure you that the new order will take on anyone it wants and the amount of tank is much less relevant than you seem to believe. 'tank your ship' is just as much a straw man as nullsec mining 'effort'.

This is true. They take on whoever they want. Fortunately for anyone with a brain, "whoever they want" are the people who are obnoxious and raise a stink about their entitlements. Don't do that, and surprise -- you have no trouble.

Attempting to take a crowbar and open up these improbable series of events into everyday occurrence is a pretty tired tactic.

for the third time, 'being obnoxious' has 0 impact on who gets ganked. being in the wrong place at the wrong time does, as does having no tank, but even if you do everything right(tm), the risk is still greater than 0 and thus greater than in a properly organized 0.0 mining op.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#924 - 2014-03-21 18:41:16 UTC
Chirjo Durruti wrote:
If this change comes through, you will nerf income with which i support my pvp activities and increase the amount of isk that i require to actually pvp.

So effectively you reduced the fun/money ratio of my subscription. Again. Bad move, CCP, bad move.

Guess after this change I'll just use up the scraps of isk i usually keep around, trash the now worthless rest of my resources and biomass myself after.

Heaven forbid you find a new way to make money. Hint: trash cleanup is extremely poor isk/hr, even before the change. You can do better.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#925 - 2014-03-21 18:42:27 UTC
Chirjo Durruti wrote:
If this change comes through, you will nerf income with which i support my pvp activities and increase the amount of isk that i require to actually pvp.

So effectively you reduced the fun/money ratio of my subscription. Again. Bad move, CCP, bad move.

Guess after this change I'll just use up the scraps of isk i usually keep around, trash the now worthless rest of my resources and biomass myself after.


You will make exactly the same after these changes as before in high sec. The other areas will be seeing a buff in income.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#926 - 2014-03-21 18:43:45 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:

for the third time, 'being obnoxious' has 0 impact on who gets ganked. being in the wrong place at the wrong time does, as does having no tank, but even if you do everything right(tm), the risk is still greater than 0 and thus greater than in a properly organized 0.0 mining op.

https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/543/ <-- Exhumers killed in Deklein
https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/463/ <-- Mining barges killed in Deklein

If what you're saying is true, these numbers should be "zero", instead of "hundreds."

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#927 - 2014-03-21 18:44:37 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:


The irony of being lazy.


What is more lazy than expecting high sec to offer the exact same reward or better as the most dangerous areas of space?
Mario Putzo
#928 - 2014-03-21 18:45:09 UTC
Querns wrote:
Chirjo Durruti wrote:
If this change comes through, you will nerf income with which i support my pvp activities and increase the amount of isk that i require to actually pvp.

So effectively you reduced the fun/money ratio of my subscription. Again. Bad move, CCP, bad move.

Guess after this change I'll just use up the scraps of isk i usually keep around, trash the now worthless rest of my resources and biomass myself after.

Heaven forbid you find a new way to make money. Hint: trash cleanup is extremely poor isk/hr, even before the change. You can do better.


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.

Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#929 - 2014-03-21 18:46:29 UTC
Querns wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:

for the third time, 'being obnoxious' has 0 impact on who gets ganked. being in the wrong place at the wrong time does, as does having no tank, but even if you do everything right(tm), the risk is still greater than 0 and thus greater than in a properly organized 0.0 mining op.

https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/543/ <-- Exhumers killed in Deklein
https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/463/ <-- Mining barges killed in Deklein

If what you're saying is true, these numbers should be "zero", instead of "hundreds."

i'm contemplating about if i should be so obnoxious as to claim that these mining ops just wern't organized properly. hello there, true scotsman...

I should buy an Ishtar.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#930 - 2014-03-21 18:46:59 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Querns wrote:
Chirjo Durruti wrote:
If this change comes through, you will nerf income with which i support my pvp activities and increase the amount of isk that i require to actually pvp.

So effectively you reduced the fun/money ratio of my subscription. Again. Bad move, CCP, bad move.

Guess after this change I'll just use up the scraps of isk i usually keep around, trash the now worthless rest of my resources and biomass myself after.

Heaven forbid you find a new way to make money. Hint: trash cleanup is extremely poor isk/hr, even before the change. You can do better.


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.


"I mined it, so it's free."

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#931 - 2014-03-21 18:49:39 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.



The best way to earn isk from missions is to not loot anything at all and blitz them. This change has zero impact upon the best level 4 income.
Querns
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#932 - 2014-03-21 18:49:51 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
Querns wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:

for the third time, 'being obnoxious' has 0 impact on who gets ganked. being in the wrong place at the wrong time does, as does having no tank, but even if you do everything right(tm), the risk is still greater than 0 and thus greater than in a properly organized 0.0 mining op.

https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/543/ <-- Exhumers killed in Deklein
https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/463/ <-- Mining barges killed in Deklein

If what you're saying is true, these numbers should be "zero", instead of "hundreds."

i'm contemplating about if i should be so obnoxious as to claim that these mining ops just wern't organized properly. hello there, true scotsman...

Conversely, all highsec ganks were a result of not taking common, inexpensive precautions and mistakenly assuming that your mouth won't get you into trouble.

We can do this all day, really. However, feel free to shortcut it and accept that neither nullsec nor highsec is perfectly safe. Furthermore, nullsec security is completely manufactured by a playerbase, while highsec security is guaranteed by the server. Have you ever heard of a logoff trap?

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#933 - 2014-03-21 18:51:21 UTC
Daniel Plain wrote:
Querns wrote:
Daniel Plain wrote:

for the third time, 'being obnoxious' has 0 impact on who gets ganked. being in the wrong place at the wrong time does, as does having no tank, but even if you do everything right(tm), the risk is still greater than 0 and thus greater than in a properly organized 0.0 mining op.

https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/543/ <-- Exhumers killed in Deklein
https://zkillboard.com/region/10000035/group/463/ <-- Mining barges killed in Deklein

If what you're saying is true, these numbers should be "zero", instead of "hundreds."

i'm contemplating about if i should be so obnoxious as to claim that these mining ops just wern't organized properly. hello there, true scotsman...


They were mining in the same ways as high sec miners operate. Most along, some in small 2 to 10 man fleets. We do not run mining OPs.
Avalokitusvara
Doomheim
#934 - 2014-03-21 18:53:00 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
Its funny seeing the regular Goon posting crew being the only ones calling this a good change. Mittens must have sent a ping out this morning.


Its because the Goons are the only ones benefiting from this change
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#935 - 2014-03-21 18:54:08 UTC
Avalokitusvara wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:
Its funny seeing the regular Goon posting crew being the only ones calling this a good change. Mittens must have sent a ping out this morning.


Its because the Goons are the only ones benefiting from this change


Because only goons have access to null and POS.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#936 - 2014-03-21 18:55:39 UTC
Avalokitusvara wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:
Its funny seeing the regular Goon posting crew being the only ones calling this a good change. Mittens must have sent a ping out this morning.


Its because the Goons are the only ones benefiting from this change


I'm sure if you try really hard you can find something even more ridiculous to say.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#937 - 2014-03-21 18:56:16 UTC
Querns wrote:
Furthermore, nullsec security is completely manufactured by a playerbase, while highsec security is guaranteed by the server.

...which is irrelevant unless the deciding factor in maintaining mullsec security is in fact mining and not other much more relevant reasons.
Quote:
Have you ever heard of a logoff trap?

in great detail, after being the target of one.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Mario Putzo
#938 - 2014-03-21 18:57:28 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.



The best way to earn isk from missions is to not loot anything at all and blitz them. This change has zero impact upon the best level 4 income.


Thats great if I cared about the "best isk". But I don't. If I did, I wouldn't running missions in HS and LS. I would be in 0.0 farming plexes.
admiral root
Red Galaxy
#939 - 2014-03-21 18:58:21 UTC
Mario Putzo wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.



The best way to earn isk from missions is to not loot anything at all and blitz them. This change has zero impact upon the best level 4 income.


Thats great if I cared about the "best isk". But I don't. If I did, I wouldn't running missions in HS and LS. I would be in 0.0 farming plexes.


Actually, no, you'd be running L4s in highsec.

No, your rights end in optimal+2*falloff
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#940 - 2014-03-21 18:58:45 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
Mario Putzo wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Mario Putzo wrote:


Some folks don't do it for the isk/hr. Some folks do it to build themselves ships they buy with LP. Many folks do actually. Typically you would get enough ore to produce the ship you want by doing the missions to get the LP you need to buy the BPO. With this change you would need to do 33% more missions in order to achieve the same effect.

As a self reliant player this is an unacceptable change.



The best way to earn isk from missions is to not loot anything at all and blitz them. This change has zero impact upon the best level 4 income.


Thats great if I cared about the "best isk". But I don't. If I did, I wouldn't running missions in HS and LS. I would be in 0.0 farming plexes.


Well then if you dont care about isk then you dont care about this slight nerf to loot from missions. Level 4 income beats anom ratting quite well, hence why most of null run them.