These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Dev Blog: Reprocess all the things!

First post First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Anhenka
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#601 - 2014-03-21 01:44:55 UTC
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Cor'len wrote:
Really, CCP? What a f*cked way to start off announcing summer features.

This is probably the "big" Summer feature, so don't get your hopes up...


Arthur, do you do anything but whine on the forums?

All I ever see from you is bashing things, doom and gloom, and wide sweeping statements about how CCP is ****.

Do you have any redeeming features whatsoever?
Dealth Striker
Perkone
Caldari State
#602 - 2014-03-21 02:03:26 UTC
Thank you CCP - once this goes live, you will make me a millionaire.
I am currently a billionaire but who cares, right?

CCP, it would be nice if you put in some system where a person can trade in SP for these skills that you make completely useless or make one's gameplay totally different from what they were doing previous.

I have spent countless hours (and thus money) training skills that are greatly affected when you change things that you say are for the better.

Like before, I will wait and see what happens with this nerf to my gameplay and decide if I take a break for a few years like last time.

Boy, does this really hurt the new players though - sheesh!
Striker Out!!
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#603 - 2014-03-21 02:04:00 UTC
Anhenka wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:
Cor'len wrote:
Really, CCP? What a f*cked way to start off announcing summer features.

This is probably the "big" Summer feature, so don't get your hopes up...


Arthur, do you do anything but whine on the forums?

All I ever see from you is bashing things, doom and gloom, and wide sweeping statements about how CCP is ****.

Do you have any redeeming features whatsoever?

The same could be said about a LOT of people on these forums.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
hopielee hopielie
Sihars Little Industries
#604 - 2014-03-21 02:04:32 UTC
Scyllyn wrote:
Another question for a Dev.

Why are you modifying every single asteroid, refining array, Station, skills and every thing else that is involved in this mammoth undertaking INSTEAD or just modifying just modules to produce less minerals when melted?




because they are nerfing high sec, to give the nul peeps more. it does not make sense, but is the ccp way to avoid the sand box they like to act proud of. but avoid letting it affect the game.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#605 - 2014-03-21 02:04:47 UTC
Dealth Striker wrote:
Thank you CCP - once this goes live, you will make me a millionaire.
I am currently a billionaire but who cares, right?

CCP, it would be nice if you put in some system where a person can trade in SP for these skills that you make completely useless or make one's gameplay totally different from what they were doing previous.

I have spent countless hours (and thus money) training skills that are greatly affected when you change things that you say are for the better.

Like before, I will wait and see what happens with this nerf to my gameplay and decide if I take a break for a few years like last time.

Boy, does this really hurt the new players though - sheesh!

Nobody cares.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#606 - 2014-03-21 02:05:34 UTC
hopielee hopielie wrote:
Scyllyn wrote:
Another question for a Dev.

Why are you modifying every single asteroid, refining array, Station, skills and every thing else that is involved in this mammoth undertaking INSTEAD or just modifying just modules to produce less minerals when melted?


because they are nerfing high sec, to give the nul peeps more. it does not make sense, but is the ccp way to avoid the sand box they like to act proud of. but avoid letting it affect the game.

If you had read the dev blog it would make sense.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
The Cue
Violence is the Answer
#607 - 2014-03-21 02:06:05 UTC
Marcia en Welle wrote:
The Cue wrote:
Marcia en Welle wrote:
Also I'd like to point out this is a massive buff to WH residents, perhaps unnecessarily seeing as CCP state that they do not want people living in WHs. Now WH residents will be able to cut themselves off almost completely.


CCP has never said that they do not want people living in WHs. You are very significantly misunderstanding them. They stated that it was a totally unintentional situation, but just because it's unintended does not mean it's unwanted.

This change is also a partial nerf to WH residents, as many of us import ice instead of the four products. Less M3, which is a precious commodity in WHs.

You obviously either don't understand WHs very well, or are just trying to under play how significant of a buff this is to WH residents.

You can now instantly refine and build components at rates higher than a fully skilled station refiner, and also compress at the now new highest standard of compression using the POS module.

This is a very significant buff to WH residents.


Consider training reading comp to at least one. I never said it wasn't a buff in some ways, just that it was a nerf in others.
Blake Ice
Bacon Anomaly
#608 - 2014-03-21 02:09:03 UTC
So, in conclusion...

If you reprocess an aluminum can, you can't make another aluminum can. You can only make 66% of an aluminum can.

Sounds logical to me. Good job. Now go play with your toys...
hopielee hopielie
Sihars Little Industries
#609 - 2014-03-21 02:12:04 UTC
Regan Rotineque wrote:
This was already at 31 pages when i started writing and I did take time to read all the replies so far.

(Yes Wall of Text hits you for 2,133 damage)

I find myself with odd mixed feelings about this change being proposed. On one had null does need a boost to give it a much better competitive edge in terms of some industrial changes. However I am not sure I like the way its being proposed.

I think this is overly complicated.

1. I understand the desire to make null sec and player owned/built structures have more value as there is greater risk associated with owning and operating. This I 100% support. However I have never felt that the issue was one of refine rate. In fact I think 100% refine rates are perfectly okay. The issue is that there is ZERO cost associated with NPC refine rates. Once you build up enough standing with said NPC entity you get a big zero on the "we take" side. Sorry but this never made sense to me (though i did as a big ass carebear in high sec benefit from it) but the costs of doing business in high sec seem to be missing in some equations.

There should ALWAYS be a cost associated with using an NPC station for anything....whether that be refine, research, industry etc...etc.... and these taxes should be imho MUCH higher than they are now. Instead of tinkering with the gameplay mechanics so much adding new and useless lines of code - you could have just raised the taxes in high sec.

That being said - I do see that there needs to be some usefulness put into those lvl 5 refine and ore skills. You could have just tweaked the refine rates to less than 100% and made it so that you get 100% with those level 5s.

Instead you have opted for a complicated math solution that confuses the masses and makes people think okay "how do I perfect this" oh wait i cant get 100% - i have some complicated math then we add some extra minerals in...but those will be lost in the conversions...etc..etc...

Just seems a bit daft to me this approach. The goal, and perhaps I am not fully understanding it, is to rebalance refine with a boost to null sec. With taxes its as easy as saying in high sec 10% of all minerals refined are taxed, Low sec 5% null sec - alliance set and just modified that refinery % at each of the stations (btw several others have mentioned this - there is no rationale behind a corp or station being a better refinery over another in high sec - there are Military bases with perfect refine and mining corp stations with less than perfect - be nice to fix that)








null should be the worst refining and production. there profit is in every other area. this added with the removal of PoS fuels from high sec. just makes the game unrealistic mechs. if you go to the congo to mine gold or diamonds, you do not expect to find a 5 star restaurant. and you expect to import all your eq.
Ishka Tekitsu
#610 - 2014-03-21 02:15:53 UTC
pegi 12 violence - wondering what this really means. forum full of violent 12y/o?

for two years now, whenever I try to commit to this game. some expansion comes along that totally anti-hypes my drive.
thanks again. two weeks ago I got refining wastage to zero. with a semi goal to at least try S&I. ohh well, I'll better wait till winter. yeah at least I should login annually.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#611 - 2014-03-21 02:16:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Arthur Aihaken
If Goons can afford to build hundreds of Supercarriers and Titans, maybe we really shouldn't be looking at buffing their income. They're obviously making out hand over first out there, but no wonder they can't stop gloating: more toys for the blue donut.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Daniel Plain
Doomheim
#612 - 2014-03-21 02:16:45 UTC
hopielee hopielie wrote:
just makes the game unrealistic mechs.

please stop talking about realism in a game where planets do not move in their orbits.

I should buy an Ishtar.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#613 - 2014-03-21 02:17:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain6637
High sec should provide a taste of what's available in EVE, and cause players to seek out where they can get more of it/do it better, and those places should be not-highsec. strip highsec down to the frame and leave it on cinder blocks.

edit: and shrink it too.

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#614 - 2014-03-21 02:19:53 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
High sec should provide a taste of what's available in EVE, and cause players to seek out where they can get more of it/do it better, and those places should be not-highsec. strip highsec down to the frame and leave it on cinder blocks.
edit: and shrink it too.

We'd have to buff null (again) to compensate Goons for all their lost income… Roll

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#615 - 2014-03-21 02:25:11 UTC
do it, make it the big leagues. make it so that a new player logs in for the first time like a broke immigrant who can't speak the local language, and changes mean up and out (of highsec)

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Grarr Dexx
Blue Canary
Watch This
#616 - 2014-03-21 02:27:24 UTC
Quote:
It prevents us from giving low and null-security facilities some advantage


That's really great and all, but that sentence is actually the only time you mention lowsec. Conveniently forgotten, again?
hopielee hopielie
Sihars Little Industries
#617 - 2014-03-21 02:30:20 UTC
Rain6637 wrote:
High sec should provide a taste of what's available in EVE, and cause players to seek out where they can get more of it/do it better, and those places should be not-highsec. strip highsec down to the frame and leave it on cinder blocks.

edit: and shrink it too.



most the people i know would not mind leaving high sec, but first they would need to get rid of mega allys, and the possibility of them, make null more like WH space. and you would see a lot more people in it. notice how many WH's have people living in them, but you don't want the people in high sec to move to low or null, then you would lose a lot of the goodies there. you just want them to be forced to visit so your gate camps are not so boring.
Rain6637
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#618 - 2014-03-21 02:34:04 UTC
i started EVE in Curse and i like wormholes, and i'm not sure we've met, hi i'm rain

Help, I can't download EVE

President of the Commissar Kate Fanclub

PLEX: A Giffen good? (It's 1B?)
Miles Chanlin
Doomheim
#619 - 2014-03-21 02:37:12 UTC
What an incredibly disappointing announcement, CCP. My thoughts:

I generally agree with allowing low/null stations and POS's have better reprocessing returns than High; however, dropping net returns by ~40% for station reprocessing is too severe.

I also agree with those who have argued that skills should affect reprocessing returns regardless of the station or outpost used to do the reprocessing. Make the skills count if you want them to be taken seriously.

It seems by your blog that the primary complaint is that some modules provide more mineral value than their actual value. What a strange way to address this, if it is really an issue at all.

You shouldn't have to nerf an entire profession to spot-fix the mineral returns on a few problem modules.


And the prefession I refer to is salvaging. The salvaging profession suffers much under this new system. And it would seem other professions, if affected at all, will be so only trivially.

The dev blog does not explain what made the salvaging profession so unbalanced as to deserve a massive nerf. It is already the case that salvage is better in low and null. The rats are bigger and better. The missions are bigger and better. Players' ships leave better modules. Everything about salvaging in low and null is better--except getting shot down easily in a Noctis, but I digress. Making salvaging and reprocessing *much less profitable* in high sec compounds this. I can accept some rebalancing... but demolishing? Why?

The primary impact of this change as I see it is that placing alts in high-sec careers becomes increasingly unaffordable. And to those arrogant snobs who snigger away their "adapt and die" cliche: go away. Real people play the game and want to be successful at it, and spend real time and money acquiring the skills to build the careers that are now being screwed with. What a waste of money!
Ludi Burek
Exit-Strategy
Minmatar Fleet Alliance
#620 - 2014-03-21 02:41:04 UTC
The only issue that concerns me is alchemy and not from the "my sec lol" nerfed point of view. Big smile

As alchemy depends on the scrapmetal skill, it has been nerfed accross the board. You are increasing it's refine value to match the ore but it doesn't use the ore skills. Did I miss something where it will be changed to match the new scrap processing bonus?

As with the changes to ore & minerals, it will balance out pretty quick and no one will even remember the patch but I fear that alchemy may be pushed into a "not worth doing" basket.

Now that I think about it a bit more, prices of moon products will probably adjust (rise) and all will be fine again but alchemy still worries me.