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[Rubicon 1.1] Mobile Micro Jump Unit and Mobile Scan Inhibitor

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Author
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#341 - 2014-01-07 19:43:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Domanique Altares
Petrus Blackshell wrote:
Vivian Marcos wrote:

I would like to know if the MMJD works on ONLY fleet members of your fleet or eveyone in the radius? I assume the former but i would LOVE the latter :D

Anyone can use them.

Fun fact for everyone: all these structures are also warp-to-able-by-everyone (is there a better term for this?), like wrecks or other space junk.


Petrus and I got on SiSi last night and played with these new shitshow items. I wasn't terribly impressed with them, considering they're currently both warpable space junk.

Cyno'd ships cannot use the Mobile Jump Drive; I dunno if that was patched out at SiSi downtime or not, but Petrus was unable to use it with a cyno going. We did not have access to a Marauder to test if it would actually go anywhere under bastion.

The fact that dictor bubbles and anchorables could be placed inside the Scan Inhbitor isn't too hot, especially since it works as some fear; anything approximating a direct warp-to earns you a drag effect.

Over all, I'm not too impressed.

The Jump Drive deployable is a rather clunky 'escape mechanism' (that still left me enough time to burn away to 160km+, warp back to, and tackle Petrus' Tornado before he could alpha my Daredevil off the field or use this thing to escape) that seems more of a toy than a serious thing for most uses.

The Scan Inhibitor is paradigm shifting, and not in a good way. This thing is going to do nothing but promote even more blob warfare, and make already cautious or risk averse players even moreso. This particular flavor of one-way intel is, frankly, bullshit. The only way that these things could be remotely considered balanced is if the inhibitor effect was applied to any ships inside the AOE, rendering their d-scan useless, and preventing their ability to target when within the module's 'field,' just as when one is inside a POS forcefield.

I honestly have to question whether anyone at CCP thinks about these things at all before they send Fozzie out here with it. I suppose it's a bit too much to ask that Devs spend any time playing EVE Online under current metas before they decide to start pissing in the pool with these poorly instituted 'game changers.'

As an aside, CCP karkur and her people have continued knocking homeruns out of the park with small quality of life UI tweaks. I'm honestly more looking forward to these things hitting TQ than I am anything from the balance/shiny toys group.
Draconic Slayer
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#342 - 2014-01-07 19:51:39 UTC
Here's a summary of the thread for you, CCP:

MSI shows how much you enjoy taking a doo-doo on the face of solo and small gang PVPers while making it harder for people with expensive ratting ships to die.

10/10 idea, would pay more money to CCP.
I am disposable
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#343 - 2014-01-07 19:55:45 UTC
Rufus Mc'owen wrote:
About "Mobile Scan Inhibitor" i see this coming:

A large group of carebear in their system gonna just put as much as possible MSI in their system (Belt, Random safe in space) to discourage pirate from search them you gonna just help those who make pve all the time and reduce the interaction beetween player even more.

The ONLY way to prevent sutch behaviour is to make the MSI expensive enough (50M / 150M)


50-150 million isk for an unrecoverable deployable that lasts 2 hours? Rofl...
Erasmus Phoenix
Avalanche.
#344 - 2014-01-07 19:59:59 UTC
If you're going down the cost-balancing route it needs to be the kind of cost that will make it only viable for large scale operations.

Of course, that kind of cost doesn't actually exist in Eve. Look at Titans. Cost balancing basically doesn't work.
Marlona Sky
State War Academy
Caldari State
#345 - 2014-01-07 20:05:48 UTC
Jureth22 wrote:
everytime ccp makes a post,solo pvp dies a little.

example : Mobile Scan Inhibitor

you are a solo vagabond trying to kill a drake of a ibis,irelevant.you check scan and bam nothing.but just 1000km of grid there 1000 people in ibises hiding waiting for a warp in you.i`m just saying.

You would engage a Drake solo with 1000 bad guys showing up in local?
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
#346 - 2014-01-07 20:08:47 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Jureth22 wrote:
everytime ccp makes a post,solo pvp dies a little.

example : Mobile Scan Inhibitor

you are a solo vagabond trying to kill a drake of a ibis,irelevant.you check scan and bam nothing.but just 1000km of grid there 1000 people in ibises hiding waiting for a warp in you.i`m just saying.

You would engage a Drake solo with 1000 bad guys showing up in local?

Would you rather fight 1000 Ibis-sized Drakes, or one Drake-sized Ibis?

Accidentally The Whole Frigate - For-newbies blog (currently on pause)

Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Top Belt for Fun
#347 - 2014-01-07 20:13:00 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Jureth22 wrote:
everytime ccp makes a post,solo pvp dies a little.

example : Mobile Scan Inhibitor

you are a solo vagabond trying to kill a drake of a ibis,irelevant.you check scan and bam nothing.but just 1000km of grid there 1000 people in ibises hiding waiting for a warp in you.i`m just saying.

You would engage a Drake solo with 1000 bad guys showing up in local?


I've engaged a Drake solo with 50 bad guys in local. I wouldn't think that's a reasonable thing to do with 5 of these DSIs on scan.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.

Lin Fatale
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#348 - 2014-01-07 20:18:24 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Jureth22 wrote:
everytime ccp makes a post,solo pvp dies a little.

example : Mobile Scan Inhibitor

you are a solo vagabond trying to kill a drake of a ibis,irelevant.you check scan and bam nothing.but just 1000km of grid there 1000 people in ibises hiding waiting for a warp in you.i`m just saying.

You would engage a Drake solo with 1000 bad guys showing up in local?



ofc
jump in check d-scan whats close - decide - start the fight
if **** appears on scan - decide if you can handle it - maybe burn away, try separate them / kite them
decide when u have to gtfo

maybe u die in that process because u decided wrong, maybe u get a good fight and get some opportunity kills
but at least u had a fight

but i would not warp to anything unscannable with 100 ppl in system or start the fight when such a thing is just 1k off gate
Grath Telkin
Amok.
Goonswarm Federation
#349 - 2014-01-07 20:23:41 UTC
Anything that makes the already laughably easy life of an NPCer easy is out of the gate a bad idea. They're hard enough to catch, if they want safety they go to high sec, if they want riches and danger, 0.0, but safe riches and danger is dumb, so the MSI is bad, because if you think cost will prohibit these from being used in broken ******** ways to make NPCing easy then I'd like to sell you a bridge.


MMJD is bad, the ships using it get something for nothing, they suffer no penalties and make no fitting concessions to gain the ability to MJD. Coupled with the fact that it instantly obsoletes the LMJD module because why ever bother fitting one if you can just drop this thing and get it done?


Scrap both mods, they're garbage.

Malcanis - Without drone assign, the slowcat doctrine will wither and die.

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#350 - 2014-01-07 20:24:38 UTC
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:
The MSI would be so, so hard to balance anywhere between utterly broken and totally useless, and either way it's going to make people less inclined to actually fight.

Really... CCP should be wondering if it's worth it at all for what it will add. I don't think it is.

No, it isn't.
It's a terrible idea that should never have gotten to the "post on forums" stage.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#351 - 2014-01-07 20:25:40 UTC
Grath Telkin wrote:
Anything that makes the already laughably easy life of an NPCer easy is out of the gate a bad idea. They're hard enough to catch, if they want safety they go to high sec, if they want riches and danger, 0.0, but safe riches and danger is dumb, so the MSI is bad, because if you think cost will prohibit these from being used in broken ******** ways to make NPCing easy then I'd like to sell you a bridge.


MMJD is bad, the ships using it get something for nothing, they suffer no penalties and make no fitting concessions to gain the ability to MJD. Coupled with the fact that it instantly obsoletes the LMJD module because why ever bother fitting one if you can just drop this thing and get it done?


Scrap both mods, they're garbage.

Holy **** it's Grath and I'm agreeing with him.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)

Jessica Danikov
Network Danikov
#352 - 2014-01-07 20:34:49 UTC
MMJD + Freighters- CCP just want to do bowling in space with big spaceships (especially given the mass restriction isn't implemented on SISI right now- do it with Titans while you still can, and don't forget to youtube it with Benny Hill music).

Seriously, the MMJD could be hillarious if you keep the fixed 12 second spool up but buff the sig bloom to the same as an MWD (after all, your ship doesn't have a drive and any compensatory measures installed with it). Instant bomber-bait.
Erasmus Phoenix
Avalanche.
#353 - 2014-01-07 20:40:43 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Grath Telkin wrote:
Anything that makes the already laughably easy life of an NPCer easy is out of the gate a bad idea. They're hard enough to catch, if they want safety they go to high sec, if they want riches and danger, 0.0, but safe riches and danger is dumb, so the MSI is bad, because if you think cost will prohibit these from being used in broken ******** ways to make NPCing easy then I'd like to sell you a bridge.


MMJD is bad, the ships using it get something for nothing, they suffer no penalties and make no fitting concessions to gain the ability to MJD. Coupled with the fact that it instantly obsoletes the LMJD module because why ever bother fitting one if you can just drop this thing and get it done?


Scrap both mods, they're garbage.

Holy **** it's Grath and I'm agreeing with him.


It takes a truly horrific idea to bring together people this different against it.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#354 - 2014-01-07 20:59:51 UTC

I think the mobile scan inhibitor sounds like a great addition to the game. It can be used to create intel voids that need a pilot to actively explore. Don't listen to these nay-sayers, as they'll adapt or die like they should!
Priestess Lin
Darkfall Corp
#355 - 2014-01-07 21:04:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Priestess Lin
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:

It takes a truly horrific idea to bring together people this different against it.


So many delicious pirate tears in this thread.

EVE is supposed to be a harsh environment, why should it not be so for aggressors? They have had it far too easy for far too long.

These are excellent ideas that will add much needed balance to the game. We know you are angry because EVE got a little harder for you. Adapt or die.

When discussing weaknesses of heavy drones vs fast frigates: baltec1- " A thanatos with a flight of geckos killed a bomber gang while AFK. So yea, they track frigates just fine." https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=4678049#post4678049

Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#356 - 2014-01-07 21:04:58 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Marlona Sky wrote:
Jureth22 wrote:
everytime ccp makes a post,solo pvp dies a little.

example : Mobile Scan Inhibitor

you are a solo vagabond trying to kill a drake of a ibis,irelevant.you check scan and bam nothing.but just 1000km of grid there 1000 people in ibises hiding waiting for a warp in you.i`m just saying.

You would engage a Drake solo with 1000 bad guys showing up in local?


I've engaged a Drake solo with 50 bad guys in local. I wouldn't think that's a reasonable thing to do with 5 of these DSIs on scan.

-Liang


These things have a 2 hour time limit, which means they won't be spammed all over the universe. If there are 5 on scan, there is probably a pretty damn good reason!

Now, at 5 m isk build cost... that may be a tad lowball. I'd recommend a 20m isk price tag, and then people won't spam them as much, and if they are spamming them, you know they are doing so for a good reason!

Erasmus Phoenix
Avalanche.
#357 - 2014-01-07 21:07:57 UTC
Priestess Lin wrote:
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:

It takes a truly horrific idea to bring together people this different against it.


So many delicious pirate tears in this thread.

EVE is supposed to be a harsh environment, why should it not be so for aggressors? They have had it far too easy for far too long.

These are excellent ideas that will add much needed balance to the game. We know you are angry because EVE got a little harder for you. Adapt or die.


Yes, because this will only make things harder for pirates. It has absolutely no effect on people trying to get decent WH PvP or trying to find actual fights in faction warfare.

And I am obviously a pirate.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#358 - 2014-01-07 21:10:49 UTC
Domanique Altares wrote:


The Scan Inhibitor is paradigm shifting, and not in a good way. This thing is going to do nothing but promote even more blob warfare, and make already cautious or risk averse players even moreso. This particular flavor of one-way intel is, frankly, bullshit. The only way that these things could be remotely considered balanced is if the inhibitor effect was applied to any ships inside the AOE, rendering their d-scan useless, and preventing their ability to target when within the module's 'field,' just as when one is inside a POS forcefield.



A cloaked ship can't be dscanned, but can still dscan.
The MSI is a stationary object that you can easily identify and know that forces may be hiding there. This is hardly game breaking. Instead it creates an increased need for intel gatherers, and that's very much for the better.

The sky is not falling with the introduction of this item. Instead, new tactical possibilities are opening up.
Randy Wray
Warcrows
Shattered Foundations
#359 - 2014-01-07 21:14:47 UTC
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:
Priestess Lin wrote:
Erasmus Phoenix wrote:

It takes a truly horrific idea to bring together people this different against it.


So many delicious pirate tears in this thread.

EVE is supposed to be a harsh environment, why should it not be so for aggressors? They have had it far too easy for far too long.

These are excellent ideas that will add much needed balance to the game. We know you are angry because EVE got a little harder for you. Adapt or die.


Yes, because this will only make things harder for pirates. It has absolutely no effect on people trying to get decent WH PvP or trying to find actual fights in faction warfare.

And I am obviously a pirate.

Calm down it's just a troll.

Solo Pvper in all areas of space including wormhole space. Check out my youtube channel @ http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCd6M3xV43Af-3E1ds0tTyew/feed for mostly small scale pvp in lowsec/nullsec

twitch.tv/randywray

Loki Feiht
Pathfinders.
Shattered Freeholds
#360 - 2014-01-07 21:26:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Loki Feiht
This sounded like a good idea becuase? if the thing hid me from local it would be awesome, otherwise i'll just fit a cloak :P

Although i suppose it could theoretically hide me in a plex like someone else mentioned /me shrugs

More NPC - Randomly Generated Modular Content thread https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=220858