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Interdiction Nullfied Interceptors are not acceptable!!!

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JC Anderson
RED ROSE THORN
#241 - 2013-11-21 23:35:29 UTC  |  Edited by: JC Anderson
As a side note, it would be kind of cool as an alternative if there was a new module that only inty's could use that is an interdiction nullifier. That way you would weigh your options on whether to use it or not, and the decision to fit would mean you'd have to remove something else. Much like interdiction nullified t3's. Hell could even reduce your scan res or something. On an inty it would make the decision to fit one or not a big one.

Again, I think they are fine as being nullified across the board as they are now, but at least something like that would be a good compromise.
Alaekessa
Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
#242 - 2013-11-21 23:40:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Alaekessa
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
CCP Fozzie and CCP Rise then went on to talk about features coming out with Rubicon, EvE's winter expansion:

While many of the ideas were pretty nifty, this little gem came out:

Interceptor changes: bubble immunity planned. Interdiction nullified, basically. Dropping average HP a little bit, very small cargo bays.

I'm sorry, but Interdiction Nullified ships are generally a BAD thing (i.e. too safe). Furthermore, giving Nullified to fast aligning interceptors is over-the-line, unless the Nullifier mechanics are revised.

Reason 1:
  • Interceptors are generally sent ahead of fleet to "catch" targets. This includes purposely warping them into bubbles where enemy "traps are", with the intention of tackling targets before they can run. This has mixed results depending on the inty pilot skills, but by making inties nullified, you prevent using this tactic!!!

    • Reason 2:
  • This is a dumbing down of the game. It allows inty pilots that stupidly warp gate-to-gate when hostiles are in system, rather than using bookmarks and celestials, to move about more safely. Nullsec travel already has covert ops ships, interdiction nullified ships, and MJD-cloak BSs to move around nullsec very safely. Interceptors themselves are currently very adept at navigating unhindered through nullsec, so why would we want to make them even safer?

    • Reason 3:
  • The number one method to gank inties is to surprise the gate-to-gate traveler with a drag bubble. This is a great way to catch scouts for a gang, which is very accessible even to very young solo frigate pilots.

    • At the end of the day, serious gate campers will still use sensor boosted tacklers to catch inties before they warp, so this really won't really change your big gate camps. Instead, you are
  • encouraging carebears to bubble wrap their systems gates, as a cheap inty will get them through the gate if they desire.
  • making travel safer, especially for the "I don't know how to avoid drag bubbles" crowd.
  • helping inties infringe on the covops role, by making it easier for inties to navigate hostile groups.

    • Potential change to the Interdiciton Nullifier System that could balance out interdiction nullified inties:
  • A long time ago, Interdiction Nullified subsystems were "accidentallied" by CCP, such that a nullified cruiser could warp out of a bubble, but if warped to a celestial with a bubble on it, they'd still be affected by the bubbles pull.

    • P.S. Since most people seem to misunderstand my point: This isn't about "wah my bubble camps can be bypassed". This is about WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER. We already have covops and nullified t3's for the risk adverse carebears. Why add inties to that list?

    CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.

    They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.

    If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.

    I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.
    PotatoOverdose
    School of Applied Knowledge
    Caldari State
    #243 - 2013-11-21 23:41:16 UTC
    On the one hand, the interceptor changes are really fun.

    On the other hand, a rtarded monkey can now fly across all of null in complete safety in an inty, especially if they fit nanos/inertial stabs/wcs to their inty. Oh and celestial bounces counter the smartbomb argument completely.

    Objectively, travel across swathes of null has been dumbed down significantly. But it's fun. The change is probably more good than bad.
    destiny2
    Decaying Rocky Odious Non Evil Stupid Inane Nobody
    Rogue Drone Recovery Syndicate
    #244 - 2013-11-21 23:49:24 UTC
    new inty changes are ok. i havent had a problem while carrier ratting and a inty comes floating around, i love flying them,. however havein their new abilitys allows camps and fleets to get that 1 juicy kill that always gets away.
    Nyancat Audeles
    Center for Advanced Studies
    Gallente Federation
    #245 - 2013-11-21 23:52:27 UTC
    Grey Beard wrote:
    Solution :

    Do something other then camping gates.

    Quoted for truth
    Chopper Rollins
    Brave Newbies Inc.
    Brave Collective
    #246 - 2013-11-22 00:03:52 UTC
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    ...WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER...


    To make nullsec travel safer and easier.



    Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
    Gizznitt Malikite
    Agony Unleashed
    Agony Empire
    #247 - 2013-11-22 00:16:21 UTC
    Chopper Rollins wrote:
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    ...WHY ARE WE MAKING NULLSEC TRAVEL SAFER AND EASIER...


    To make nullsec travel safer and easier.






    uh huh.... it's certainly made ascertaining Cyno inhibitor BPO's and the like much easier... And I've personally traveled through about 300 hostile systems in the last 3 days, easily avoiding home defense fleets while ganking any and all ratters that take more than 13 seconds to get into warp!
    Gizznitt Malikite
    Agony Unleashed
    Agony Empire
    #248 - 2013-11-22 00:20:51 UTC
    Alaekessa wrote:

    CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.

    They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.

    If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.

    I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.


    I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else.

    The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!
    Abdullah Bahdoon
    Doomheim
    #249 - 2013-11-22 00:37:44 UTC
    Well... since you don't like interceptors anyway, can I have your Taranis ?
    Gizznitt Malikite
    Agony Unleashed
    Agony Empire
    #250 - 2013-11-22 00:40:42 UTC
    Abdullah Bahdoon wrote:
    Well... since you don't like interceptors anyway, can I have your Taranis ?


    I think you misunderstand me.... I ******* LOVE interceptors... I just firmly believe that having them interdiction nullified is too much...
    Alaekessa
    Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
    #251 - 2013-11-22 00:43:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Alaekessa
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    Alaekessa wrote:

    CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.

    They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.

    If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.

    I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.


    I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else.

    The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!

    Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun.

    However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile).
    Gizznitt Malikite
    Agony Unleashed
    Agony Empire
    #252 - 2013-11-22 00:47:49 UTC
    Alaekessa wrote:
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    Alaekessa wrote:

    CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.

    They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.

    If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.

    I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.


    I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else.

    The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!

    Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun.

    However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile.


    I've lead more than a few large frigate roams, and generally speaking, smart bombing BS's may get a few kills, after which they die to the rest of the gang they failed to destroy.
    Alaekessa
    Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc.
    #253 - 2013-11-22 00:51:32 UTC
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    Alaekessa wrote:
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
    Alaekessa wrote:

    CovOps, T3's and now interceptors too are not just for risk adverse carebears.

    They're also for people who want to slip your camps and cyno/covert cyno their fleet into your space.

    If you ask me, that sounds like the exact opposite of what risk adverse carebears would do.

    I find it highly amusing how quickly accusations of being a carebear are thrown around here, one might think that carebears are the only people playing Eve.


    I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else.

    The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!

    Roving death squads sounds like a lot of fun.

    However, I am of the opinion that they will only be the "quintessential ship for the risk adverse" until home defense fleets figure out the appropriate counter (I saw someone suggest smartbombing bubble camps, just need to forget about the bubbles and use appropriately sized ships to maximize bombing profile.


    I've lead more than a few large frigate roams, and generally speaking, smart bombing BS's may get a few kills, after which they die to the rest of the gang they failed to destroy.

    They obviously haven't been utilizing the appropriate fleet comp then.
    Leigh Akiga
    Kuhri Innovations
    #254 - 2013-11-22 01:04:07 UTC
    Congratulations on making sure the last remnants of people actually living in 0.0 move out CCP Oops
    Knights Armament
    Deep Core Mining Inc.
    Caldari State
    #255 - 2013-11-22 01:21:45 UTC
    PotatoOverdose wrote:
    On the one hand, the interceptor changes are really fun.

    On the other hand, a rtarded monkey can now fly across all of null in complete safety in an inty, especially if they fit nanos/inertial stabs/wcs to their inty. Oh and celestial bounces counter the smartbomb argument completely.

    Objectively, travel across swathes of null has been dumbed down significantly. But it's fun. The change is probably more good than bad.


    This is a good thing, less people in empire, more people in null.

    Click here to get something special for new players, an EvE Trial Invitation extremely rare, high quality.
    Damsyl
    Memory Den
    #256 - 2013-11-22 03:56:04 UTC
    Leigh Akiga wrote:
    Congratulations on making sure the last remnants of people actually living in 0.0 move out CCP Oops


    Knights Armament wrote:
    This is a good thing, less people in empire, more people in null.


    So these amazing nullified interceptors are responsible for making nullsec residents move out, and empire residents move in to nullsec. I think I get it.
    Decian Cor
    Stronghelm Corporation
    Solyaris Chtonium
    #257 - 2013-11-22 04:49:38 UTC
    Gizznitt Malikite wrote:


    I've been flying the hell out of inties the last couple days.... they are fun, and they are the utlimate get-away ships. Our gangs of inties simply bypass home defense fleets as if they never bothered to form up. We engage that which we believe we have a chance to kill, and bypass everything else because we are so super amazing. Did I mention my e-peen? It's Huge.

    The problem is, it is very easy to avoid any and all fights when flying these ships, which makes them the quintessential ship for the risk adverse!



    After the 5th or so time you brought up your awesome death dealing, home defense avoiding, super fast and cool Inty fleet, I determined you would like a cookie.

    And nobody really wants to give you a cookie.

    [u]Unfiltered for the masses.[/u]

    http://imgur.com/mzSl1Ie
    Black Canary Jnr
    Royal Amarr Institute
    Amarr Empire
    #258 - 2013-11-22 05:15:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Black Canary Jnr
    Should inties be nullified? Yes and no.

    Against anchorable bubbles? Yes. Why? Because these are primarily used in risk free actions such as bubbling ratting system gates to hell and back and occassionally cloaky/ sniper camping. These actions allow people to avoid engagements if they so please to.

    Against dictor bubbles? Hell no. If you are fielding a dictor you are putting a squishy target into the enemies sights, 7k, 8k ehp is not alot. Further more these rely on someone hitting that button at the right time to drag people or bubble a gate. Dictor probes are also relatively small, about 20km ish radius, nothing to an intie. It's not an 'i win' button by any means, it is a way to open a window for engagement with a currently unengageable ship type.

    And there is the problem, intie fleets are currently unengageable between their 4k plus speeds and instawarping combined with nullification. There is one counter i can think of and has a low chance of success; cloaky recons around a bait ship. Even after the effort of setting it up inties still have an 8 second window to slip point and warp. It should be noted that this is dependent on them engaging you, which is why i am for non-nullification against dictors, because without it roaming gangs, and most defence gangs, cannot even consider engaging interceptors.


    My 2 cents.

    Till next time fly safe and fly inty.
    Herzog Wolfhammer
    Sigma Special Tactics Group
    #259 - 2013-11-22 05:29:39 UTC
    People who think inties are OP claiming that they are ganking the crap out of everything with fleets of inties in an attempt at reverse psychology.

    As if anybody is going to care about botters and AFK miners in lowsec (all 3 or 4 of them).

    Nice try.


    Bring back DEEEEP Space!
    Cynter DeVries
    Spheroidal Projections
    #260 - 2013-11-22 05:41:19 UTC
    Tactically
    Enhanced
    Acceptably
    Rebalanced
    Ships

    Cynter's Law of feature suggestion: Thou shalt not suggest NPCs do something players could do instead.